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the-benchmarker / web-frameworks

Which is the fastest web framework?
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Remove go/iris #1129

Closed brunocassol closed 5 years ago

brunocassol commented 5 years ago

https://old.reddit.com/r/golang/comments/b481q7/a_warning_about_githubcomkatarasiris/ (archive)

iris author continues to edit issues and ban users that point out legal or technical problems with his framework. Go community in general shuns the project for all the continued wrongdoings of the author.

The lib's README claims to be the fastest and links to https://github.com/the-benchmarker/web-frameworks as proof. But when someone pointed out the very linked benchmark says otherwise, the issue was deleted and the user banned from https://github.com/kataras/iris/.

I suggest that iris should be removed from https://github.com/the-benchmarker/web-frameworks since giving it any exposition is just a waste of everyone's time. After so many years of community backlash the author still hasn't learned and can't even respect the very benchmark project he links on his repo.

brunocassol commented 5 years ago

For reference:

https://github.com/avelino/awesome-go/pull/1135

waghanza commented 5 years ago

Hi @brunocassol,

I was not aware of some claims about that.

Even if @kataras (and iris community) is not very respectful of any license, I do not think it's our role to ban iris and/or muxie from here.

What do you think @the-benchmarker/web-frameworks ?

Regards,

vladfaust commented 5 years ago

Seeing all these discussions, it makes me feel that something's really wrong with that framework author. The simple fact of his backwards changes brings security and code trust issues to the table. Benchmark acts like an advertising for frameworks, and we shall not advertise dangerous things.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin @julienschmidt @kataras it seems that you are facing some contradictions here:

PS: I don't have any go skills, I just want to understand the discussion.

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza iris was rewritten a number of times after that reddit and awesome-go part of story. Back then, iris was obviously based on httprouter, even with the same comments and names, but without any license notices.

@kataras edited so many issues and tried to hide that, including that account recreation etc.

But, first of all, I don’t think it’s a good idea to talk about it again in kataras’ organization. We all know, that nothing based on net/http can’t be faster then optimal fasthttp-based solutions, so noticing that this benchmark compares only net/http solutions could make this ad campaign at least somewhat true.

Next, if somebody want to make money on software, they should check all licenses, but with iris that’s not the case.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

So, as I understand, the matter is with iris author, not with any security or code trust.

vladfaust commented 5 years ago

@waghanza there are witnesses which claim that author tends to backward change the code (i.e. rewriting old commits).

waghanza commented 5 years ago

sure @vladfaust

But, the main question here, is :

SOULD we remove iris from here ?

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza not only code, but trust at all. Removing git history back then @kataras broke CI/CD for so much people. That’s why I removed all kataras’ links in awesome-go. Iris also was removed from go Web Framework Benchmark. But I don’t think I can help you with that choice.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

Does this concern also muxie, since same author ?

waghanza commented 5 years ago

Also I can see that iris is still include https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/tree/master/frameworks/Go/iris

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@the-benchmarker/web-frameworks I don't want to take any removal decision alone :stuck_out_tongue:

Please vote / react, and I'll remove / keep iris here

Voting stop on 6th of april 2019

Please add a :+1: for removal, and :-1: for keeping

/cc @kataras

ww9 commented 5 years ago

Regardless, you can always add iris back if the author changes his ways and I truly hope he does. I'm all for giving people chances to learn and redeem themselves. But I wouldn't hold my breath, he's been like that for years and any amount of community backlash hardly made any difference so far.

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@ww9 I love the Go community for giving people Nth chance, but how many times kataras ~f-cked~ things up with iris? I remember at least 5 times with different consequences. every time he fixes anything and tries to blame everything on the fact that he is being attacked by everyone around him. some time ago I revisited iris to check if he really fixed any problems and consider unbanning kataras and iris itself in awesome-go, and it was looking promising until I found that he still editing issues. I think iris is a good idea but unfortunately it can't be done right while editing issues, editing git history, lying and basically trying to be as toxic as possible. disclamer: I used to use iris in my projects before I banned it, and it was terribly sad for me. I created my own framework (#1135) just because I need something to rely on, and nothing else didn't work for me that well. so yes, it's honest to say that without that story with removing iris from awesome-go due to multiple license violations and so on, maybe I'll never create gramework.

p.s. I think it's quite ironic, that issue about introducing gramework here (#1135) and PR about removing iris in awesome-go (avelino/awesome-go#1135) got the same number, isn't it? keeping in mind one of the reasons of creating gramework.

andersfylling commented 5 years ago

I'm giving a thumbs up for removing Kataras completely tbh. It's not like Muxie and Iris is going to be night and day from a moral stand point. It's the author/owner that's the issue, not the source code.

Also, someone just pointed out that Kataras is a part of this organization? I seriously hope he does not have write access...

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@andersfylling I can not ensure that @kataras will NEVER has write access, but actually he has not

andersfylling commented 5 years ago

I got to ask tho; if he does not have write access, why is he a part of the organization? What exactly is his role?

waghanza commented 5 years ago

As far as I can read, members can :

@see https://help.github.com/en/articles/permission-levels-for-an-organization

waghanza commented 5 years ago

My initial purpose of inviting people (@kataras or others) is to gather some people on various communities., mine is only ruby

andersfylling commented 5 years ago

I'll be happy to take over for Kataras to help ensure an unbiased environment.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

Honestly, I'm not ok to add you AND remove @kataras, but I'll be glad to add you and increase our knowledge of go

EDIT : I'm NOT ok to make @kataras removal from this community, a condition of adding you here :stuck_out_tongue: (for me their are 2 subjects : adding you here AND keeping/removing @kataras from here -> subjects are not linked for me)

andersfylling commented 5 years ago

No thank you. I'm worried that would negatively reflect on myself, to work with Kataras. (Kataras has already delete a contribution I did to his Iris project as well lol)

Edit: I would recommend to reconsider removing Kataras from the organization as you already have authors that refuse to add their projects here due to his presence. I don't see that trend faltering.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

As you want

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@tbrand What do you think ?

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@andersfylling The author you mentioned has not taken position because of @kataras is a member of this organization @kirillDanshin does not want to add gramework here, if @kataras has write access @peterbourgon does not want to compare gokit to iris

so no matter of any membership :heart_decoration:

vetcher commented 5 years ago

There you can find more about iris and his author https://github.com/julienschmidt/httprouter/issues/148

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza speaking of membership — I can't understand how a developer that doesn't respect community can represent that community.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

you got the point :stuck_out_tongue:, but the disrespect was not about this community, but go one

it's an other point to argue about @kataras banishment from this community, let's make an other issue / debate

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

Just to clarify: I was talking about abstract community of developers, not about the community of this particular benchmark project

ioquatix commented 5 years ago

I just want to congratulate everyone here for keeping on topic, focused on the issue at hand, and being respectful. It's really awesome. GG everyone.

tbrand commented 5 years ago

Hi @waghanza, I've read the discussion here and references. As my understanding, the main question is here.

SOULD we remove iris from here ?

In my opinion, iris should be removed from this benchmark without sending disrespect to the author. If we allow it, we have to add copy/paste projects (not forked) under the regulation.

I appreciate you guys discuss many about this repository. I'll put my approval to the pull request.

Regards.

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@tbrand it’s late to decide whether to “pay disrespect” or not. All kataras’ libraries removed from awesome-go. That’s not a matter of respect, that’s the metter of listening to the community and being honest. Another question that interesting for me is how kataras got the membership? Didn’t anyone search one of many reddits?

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin I have invited @kataras on this organization on the basis of a participation https://github.com/the-benchmarker/web-frameworks/issues/1129#issuecomment-477577883

But :

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza why not to just @-mention folks? People don’t see what you’re trying to do and can’t correct any decision before critical point. Let’s make any decision making wide open to community, then you’ll not need any such “membership”

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin

why not to just @-mention folks?

it could be done like that, but it avoid mentioning 18 persons separately :stuck_out_tongue:

Let’s make any decision making wide open to community, then you’ll not need any such “membership”

That's what I'm trying to do :heart:

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza but my proposal avoids situations like this, when you don’t know that guy is banned in a community X, and you invite him to make decisions about projects made with X, or a dangerous project, when you adding both project and author to the benchmark 😁

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin sure things, adding a person to this community is not an easy thing, because this community purpose is to make a bridge between other communities.

This remains the questions : how can we add any community members ? how must decide ? ... but, I think we are not (yet) structured for that :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

BTW, thanks for advices

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

@waghanza you can just use language-specific communities. For Go, ask /r/golang and/or awesome-go

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin can I ping from github to reddit ? or should I write a thread on reddit to ?

kirillDanshin commented 5 years ago

I think, you can create a thread on reddit asking for help with maintaining the Go part. We’ve got a very warm and nice community there. But before this issue’s main question should be answered, I think.

Also, I suggest my help if this issue will be solved.

kataras commented 5 years ago

Guys relax, the "stolen code" idea is just a defame about Iris.

This "stolen code" idea started started 3 years ago from an article a very young person and friend of the buffalo framework author wrote to its personal blogspot in order to defame Iris (and split the Go Community back then) through my pride and professionalism, they couldn't hurt Iris otherwise. This is past, I though that the trolls are finished with this story but in my suprise and dissapointment this is more personal than I thought.

Read the code and stop spreading more lies please. These "fake news" (and I really hate this word but this is the most accurated word to describe these accusations) are more than 3 years old and for the shake of logic, read the Iris code, and muxie's which is created this year and used into Iris. Maybe I stole it from another planet? Because I can't find similarities to that "stolen code" you are referring to.

About the contributions, @andersfylling, you had never contribute to Iris, apparently you don't remember your contirubtions well enough. All the 53 contributions are listed here, why in the hell I "deleted" yours and keep others and how can, technically, to do that all? There is no sense to all these, this is the last time I answer to this bullying, keep it calm and for the shake of community and progress, do your own research, read code, it is your job.

@kirillDanshin, you have your own agenda and a quick look at your profile can reveal it quite easly. I am a professional software engineer. Larger entities, like companies, are serious and make real research for who they are hiring, they already search all that you are spreading about me. I have never had issues like this before, I have a job and I am really coding some useful software that others uses. I contribute to various open-source projects far more than yourself and you can't spread these lies in public, reddit is not safe for discussion, one of reddit/golang moderator is the author of the 3year-old article who deleted my messages from a reddit issue without reason. I understand the marketing strategy you are trying to follow but this just hurts you (and me when I answer).

I don't have your time to spread more drama. Be more careful and at least respect the thousands of hours I spent to a succed project, 100% free. Keep note that I have plenty of personal messages about devs that found a decent job because of Iris. At least respect those people and the big Go community behind Iris, if not me.

As I wrote on an answer on quora, in general this is the world we live. This is the environment we have to work, you will discover that if you do something great, other people will be jealous and try to defame your thousands of hours of work for their own benefit, sadly this means “business” for them.

Iris is far more attractive than any other web framework because simply it is the most complete and updated web framework among its "competitors", there is nothing like this that I could just "stole/copy-paste" and make all these happen.

Thank you for trust @waghanza and your chat messages, I just saw those.

You are totally free to do whatever you want, I am happy that the trolls are not the majority nowdays.

I am not responsible for answering every time the "stolen code" idea is rising up, every professional can fully understand my position and the work I've done for the community. I am still here and the project is growing every day with the help of all contributions and its users' support and feature requests.

majidbigdeli commented 5 years ago

@kirillDanshin @kataras Muxie is a project that was created this year. And the project is not stealing, and you can check its code. You know that at Golang there are currently no complete web-based platforms. iris is The most complete framework is currently in Golang. Let me tell you something The company's executives who I am working on do not agree with all the efforts that I have made to get Golang into a newly started project and we have to use the Django framework. I really do not like django, but we must admit that django is currently very popular. @kirillDanshin I know you are the fasthttp maintiner . We'd better stop doing this and try to create a comprehensive golang framework. Iris is currently the most complete framework in the golang. It's better to help me out and do more to get into a place like Django. Excuse me for my poor English language.

andersfylling commented 5 years ago

If you just google Iris and find links to issues from stack overflow etc. you will notice that most, if not all, of those, are in fact, deleted. And several people creating these issues are instantly blocked. So yeah it is not weird that there's no trace of those contributions. Then there's the part where you rewrite git history to obscure how the code come to be, to begin with..

And let's not forget the references already listed here.

Edit: "Thank you for trust @waghanza and your chat messages, I just saw those." Do not worry. Your trust is not on the line here @waghanza . People do notice how well you are handling this, and letting the community vote. Kataras might make it seem like this affects how trust worthy you are. But this whole "drama" is about the trust issues Kataras have created about himself, not you.

brunocassol commented 5 years ago

I'm replying to this comment: https://i.imgur.com/Nx4ZiL2.png

@kataras you're really going to continue playing the conspiracy victim card against internet's archive despite the fact that all the problematic issues linked elsewhere are deleted on iris? This saddens me since it shows you haven't learned much. Please take a step back, ponder on your actions, apologize to the community and change your ways. There's still chance, at least for me. But stop denying what's documented on a simple "go iris" google search.

Read the code and stop spreading more lies please. These "fake news" (and I really hate this word but this is the most accurated word to describe these accusations) are more than 3 years old and for the shake of logic, read the Iris code, and muxie's which is created this year and used into Iris. Maybe I stole it from another planet? Because I can't find similarities to that "stolen code" you are referring to.

You're telling us to just read the code as if the repo commit history wasn't flattened? Or is this a lie also? Next you're going to tell us to read the deleted issues.

I just noticed you've unbanned me from iris repo. Can you undelete my issue somehow? Not sure if it possible in GitHub.

I refuse to tag big names of the community to chime in since they have better things to do. But if you're going to name them, at least tag them here so they have a chance to defend themselves. Who do you refer as very young person and friend of the buffalo framework author wrote to its personal blogspot in order to defame Iris?

tsingson commented 5 years ago

Some comments about fasthttp:

  1. As some friends said, fasthttp is not a "framework". fasthttp is an excellent implementation of high-performance golang http. In the commercial projects I have implemented, fasthttp is used on very important key nodes, high performance and low cost. Required. For this, I am full of respect for the developers and all contributors of fasthttp.

  2. As far as I know, some "famous" golang lib / framework is inspired by fasthttp, and fasthttp related developers and users continue to grow in a good community.

English is not my native language. For improper description, please forgive me.

ww9 commented 5 years ago

I'd like to apologize to @myannikos for my unfounded accusation. Even though I deleted the message seconds after submitting it once I realized my mistake, everyone subscribed to this thread received the message by e-mail and it's not fair for me to let my mistake slide just because the rest of the internet wont see.

On another note, perhaps you'd like to know that your messages don't seem to be visible on this thread @myannikos. Maybe you decided to delete them as well. In any case, I feel ashamed for accusing you and I'm sorry.

majidbigdeli commented 5 years ago

@ww9 My dear friend, Iris, is just a simple framework. We do not need to hurt another one. my opinion, Iris is a good framework. Of course fasthttprouter is faster. But Iris has the most complete documentation and most examples. And Kataras has worked hard on this framework. I do not think it is necessary to remove this project from this repo.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

FYI, iris was removed from tfb => https://github.com/TechEmpower/FrameworkBenchmarks/issues/4591

brunocassol commented 5 years ago

Thanks for the kind words @majidbigdeli, but this issue is not about which framework or lib is fastest.

It's simply so that https://github.com/the-benchmarker/web-frameworks/ maintainers could be a bit more informed about Go ecosystem and suggest that go/iris be removed for now at least.

I have no doubt that @kataras worked hard on his repos and I truly hopes that he changes to a less aggressive stance and that with time the Go community can notice it and soften the communication.

Sometimes little mistakes snowball to situations like this. I've been there before and it takes a toll on everyone involved. Open-source is specially harsh in this regard.

If I'm allowed to suggest, I'd tell @kataras to be more lenient and forgiving with valid complains to the project, stop editing and deleting other's issues. Credit copied source code. Admit mistakes instead of being dismissive. These are not easy tasks specially when we feel cornered but time is our friend in these cases.

@waghanza I'm sorry you had to go through this. Thank you for your attention.

I'll steal @ww9's words: you can always add iris back if the author changes his ways and I truly hope he does.

waghanza commented 5 years ago

@brunocassol Thanks for getting me into this issue known in go eco-system

However, there is a vote opened on this issue, and I'll prefer to let this issue open until https://github.com/the-benchmarker/web-frameworks/issues/1129#issuecomment-477328645 is closed

Regards,