Intro to JavaScript on week 6 and advanced JS for week 12?

[asalkey]

To me it makes sense to pair HTML/CSS with JavaScript. Maybe go over some basic syntax and DOM manipulation so the students can add some extra functionality to what ever they build during the HTML/CSS week. On the scheduled JS week students can go over some more advanced topics like AngularJS, Node.JS, etc.

Thoughts?

[nickirios]

It makes sense to me to have them go right into learning JS after learning HTML and CSS, especially if we introduce polyfills in week 6. Could we move the JS week between weeks 6 and 7? It could be a good transition from client-side to server-side.

[jefflembeck]

:+1: Maybe it's just my JS bias, and I know we're limited on time, but having two weeks to focus on JS that are a bit spread out certainly couldn't hurt. I like the idea of doing DOM Manipulation/jQuery early and then more advanced topics later (even if they aren't front-end frameworks/Node, there are still a LOT of facets to the language that will be left untouched during a week of teaching about the DOM).

[dpersing]

I agree that at least starting JS after HTML/CSS is going to be important. I do think giving HTML and CSS a whole week on their own, instead if introducting JS during the same week, is also going to be important, since in the current 12-week setup it's the only time the students will be introduced to web standards and best practices.

[johana-star]

I'm unsure that week six is the right time for this... JavaScript has a few syntactical issues that are likely to trip up beginners, and getting the cohort comfortable with Ruby first will help them get up to speed with JS sooner.

If possible, I would highly recommend teaching JavaScript with Jasmine to test and minimal libraries (like Underscore) to start out with, and only after students have a solid grasp on these concepts should they learn something like jQuery.

Would weeks 7 and 8 be the right time to start in with JS? From the outline it's hard to tell if the students will have experience building server side Sinatra apps in Week 3 and 4.

[asalkey]

Hmm not sure what's planned for week 7 and 8. Perhaps something can be moved to week 12 so JS can be around the HTML/CSS week.

[kerrizor]

I really should set up a calendar for this, so everyone cone visualize what's happening when. :)

Keep in mind that many (but not all) of our applicants are coming in with some basic HTML/CSS. We're going to be throwing a LOT at them in the first 12 weeks, and I'd like to make sure there are some successes and comfort with whatever comes before JS.

I'd like to see HTML/CSS make an appearance earlier than week 6, so that we can go into Sinatra and/or Rails and have comfort with the view layer. What does the JS team think about something that was like (but not exactly):

• HTML/CSS with a little smattering of JS -> week 2 or 3 (or thereabouts)
• Sinatra/Rails -> Weeks 4, 5, 6
• JavaScript framework -> Week 7ish

[jefflembeck]

I can dig that. Under JavaScript framework, would that be where we address jQuery and the like then?

[kerrizor]

I'm thinking so - I'm not sure we need an entire week on Multi-tenancy and Security.. each is worth a day at least, but I'd rather spend 1/12th of the first 3 months on practical skills as opposed to "important things that can be expert level tasks when addressing"

So here's a question - would you go with jQuery, or are there better framework/libraries out there these days that we should focus on?

[jefflembeck]

jQuery is certainly the most ubiquitous library that I can think of and is even a dependency of some of the better known MVC frameworks (Backbone and Ember). I'd certainly be happy to start off (during the first session) with just plain ol' vanilla JS-based DOM manipulation, and then make our way into jQuery.

[asalkey]

@kerrizor love that setup. But for the whole framework week are you guys planning to focus on just one framework? I think they should be introduced to an MVC framework even if you guys spend all the time on jQuery maybe you could do a quick intro to an MVC framework at the end of that week.

[jefflembeck]

I definitely worry about going into an MVC framework this early. They'll likely just be getting the concepts of DOM manipulation down and will be missing quite a bit of the arsenal necessary to be successful at using an MVC framework. I think it might be best if we can set them up with some of the fundamentals of JS. Things like functional scoping, prototypal inheritance, IIFEs, and closures are pretty important if they want to step into something with the complexity levels of say, Angular.

[asalkey]

@jlembeck Ok, that makes sense :+1:

[kerrizor]

@asalkey @jlembeck I think we're all on the same page - core concepts in a format that is immediately applicable, with a bit of "tasting menu" content presented to broaden horizons /after/ the groundwork is laid. :D

[jefflembeck]

:smile:

[asalkey]

Yep, that sounds great. I think we have this issue resolved now on to the implementation.