Closed Jegelewicz closed 2 months ago
I was going to set this up in test but it appears test is down? @dustymc
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Test is no longer publicly available, you'll need a tunnel or VPN, @mkoo can point you in the right direction.
on approval I'll just move the existing data into this source and shut down the legacy name-linked system (which will also save significant CPU).
That is an expected part of this if it moves forward.
I don't work with common names much, but I do have a couple of questions.
1) Would you have to start individually assigning common name identifications to each specimen, or would these somehow still be linked to taxonomy? 2) Could you end up running into issues in data entry where a student would enter a common name instead of the taxonomic name?
Once I can access test, I will set up an example.
Would you have to start individually assigning common name identifications to each specimen
No.
or would these somehow still be linked to taxonomy?
Yes (more below).
student would enter a common name instead of the taxonomic name
It'll just error (unless the common name is also a taxon name) - exactly the same thing that'll happen now if a student enters some random taxon term for some reason.
There are two ways this can work, and they can overlap to any degree.
@dustymc would you care if I just made this source in production? I don't think it's going to hurt anything and we can always remove it if it doesn't do what we want.
@Jegelewicz that seems completely reasonable to me (and one can - sorta - create sources by sending data to globalnames, a lower bar for these might make some sense anyway).
Here are a few examples:
https://arctos.database.museum/name/Kalmia#ArctosCommonNames
https://arctos.database.museum/name/Turdus%20migratorius#ArctosCommonNames
Right now, this will do absolutely nothing except facilitate search unless someone decides to select it in their list of taxonomy sources, but I am wondering if we can use this source to allow CHAS to select the common name they want to display (see the entry that has CHAS:Herb or CHAS:Bird) @dustymc thoughts?
select the common name they want to display
See (2) in https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/7832#issuecomment-2150787931
You can add common names to your preferred classifications, which would bring them in a bit closer to your records. This would (sorta, probably) be less confusing when (hemi)homonyms are involved, it would display them on your record pages, make them available as record data in the API, and basically still do everything (1) does. You can do this now by managing whatever classification(s) you prefer, no CT request of any kind is necessary (but please - as always - play nice if you share those Sources).
This is really not the workable solution you think it is. It means that we end up with everyone managing their own taxonomy just to get a preferred common name and I don't think we need to go that far. I was thinking that we could use the common name classification in ways beyond discovery.
https://arctos.database.museum/name/Turdus%20migratorius#ArctosCommonNames
Could we set up an identification attribute that pulls from the common name classification? The one above has a class term type = CHAS:Bird with the value American Robin
which could show up in this classification as an identification attribute
ID attribute type | ID attribute value |
---|---|
collection preferred common name | American Robin |
If this is too resource intensive, are there other ways we could so this? I'm looking to keep common names out of the taxonomic sources that include scientific classifications and provide collections with an ability to use preferred common names when needed.
Also - should the various common names go in the no_class or class section of the classification
?
everyone managing their own taxonomy just to get a preferred common name
Just like anyone who wants a "preferred subfamily" would do!
identification attribute that pulls from the common name classification?
This sounds like a very complicated way to produce inconsistent data; skip the complexity and add some attributes if that's the goal.
are there other ways we could so this?
I'm pretty baffled by this whole thing. I'm hearing "this is an important part of the metadata" and "we don't want to treat this like we treat every other important part of the metadata." If common names are something like families, treat them like it and manage them with all other metadata. If they're attributes, treat them like that and don't over-complicate things. If they're something else, spell that out and we'll find an appropriate model for it.
no_class or class
The model doesn't care. If common names should be in the hierarchy they can be, if they're not they can do that too. (But I'd read your data to state that Mirlo primavera
is superior to/above/a parent of/broader than Merle d'Amérique
and I doubt that's the intent.)
Using the example, I found the American Robins with this search
So for search, if we could make the "Common Name" field only search the Common Name source, that could still be useful and wouldn't require knowledge of where common names are stored.
Initial Request
Goal
Describe what you're trying to accomplish. This is the only necessary step to start this process. The Committee is available to assist with all other steps. Please clearly indicate any uncertainty or desired guidance if you proceed beyond this step.
Better manage and use vernacular or common names that are related to taxon names in Arctos #5025 . Also, development of a path for managing offensive common names #6040.
Context
Describe why this new value is necessary and existing values are not.
Currently common names are associated directly with taxon names. This makes them less useful when a particular collection would like a particular name associated with their records and they are more difficult to manage in a bulk format. @ArctosDB/diversity-and-inclusion thinks setting up a common name source might be a good idea and asked @Jegelewicz to set up in test.
Table
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https://arctos.database.museum/info/ctDocumentation.cfm?table=cttaxonomy_source
Proposed Value
Proposed new value. This should be clear and compatible with similar values in the relevant table and across Arctos.
Arctos common names
Proposed Definition
Clear, complete, non-collection-type-specific functional definition of the value. Avoid discipline-specific terminology if possible, include parenthetically if unavoidable.
A source for common names of taxa or organism (also known as a vernacular name, English name, colloquial name, country name, popular name, or farmer's name) which are names that are based on the normal language of everyday life; and are often contrasted with the scientific name for the same organism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_name
Collection type
_Some code tables contain collection-type-specific values.
collection_cde
may be found from https://arctos.database.museum/home.cfm_N/A
Attribute Extras
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N/A
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Available for Public View
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yes
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