wolstaeb
commented
3 years ago @C3ETH/c3eth-team has a time been agreed for this. I'm able to attend anywhere from 6:00 AM UTC until 12:00 PM UTC on Tuesday. If I recall from discussion in the meeting #20, the best time was 8:00AM UTC onward for Greg.
Our objective is to work on the C3 ETH Catalyst Fund 6 Proposals in the workshop.
Attendees
Workshop Notes
Our objective was to work on the C3 ETH Catalyst Fund 6 Proposals in the workshop.
Some Background
@YanTirta, @zicozibu are doing a workshop with Tevo to go over the mini-proposal proposal workshopping process before introducing it into ETH sessions. A mini-proposal is a reduced version of the main proposal with a reduced budget - that can be workshopped in a structured way. The suggestion is that this process will be a great way to start ideation of the C3 ETH proposals.
If @C3ETH/c3eth-team can draft insights this week- and we encourage everyone to draft insights to raise our profile and receive feedback- these will become our starting point for developing the full/mini proposals. Ideate the proposals using insights on Ideascale then copy them over to the Fund6 Proposal GitHub repo.
Miro Proposal Ideation
Since there is potential for overlap with Catalyst Swarm, and Catalyst School, we will map out the multiple proposals on miro board
Insights Gathered
Catalyst Fund 6 insights have been gathered. Some were authored by members of C3ETH, others just found to be interest or relevant. You can find these in the īnsights.md` files are listed below. Insights from C3ETH participants identify the proposer. Links to the individual insights on IdeaScale are included.
In some cases, relevant comments, additional information, and related insights have been added. NOTE: This is not a definitive collection of insights from Ideascale. It is curated. This collection of insights are from Fund 6 only. Only in some instances have prior fund proposals and insights are referenced. If time/energy permitted a more extensive analysis would be useful.
Adhoc Analysis
Several patterns or trends are evident from looking at the insights to date.
Proposal Submission to Ideascale
Following the lead of CatalystSwarm to have a distinct profile on Ideascale for submitting proposals:
The C3ETH specific proposals will be non-technical. Typically covering four main deliverables.
Proposal Budget Structures
We had some discussion around better funding mechanisms be recognised the limitations of the current Catalyst process to fund retroactive work and ongoing effort. Some discussion in particular around paying for the efforts of the participants. Ideally...
The Fund 6 proposal(s) need to work within these limitations for the moment. Recognising the insufficient and incomplete nature of tools required to work together in a decentralised globally distributed fashion.
Budget structure needs to:
Examples of direct costs (requiring conversion into a national currency) include using:
Working in with other groups.
In the numerous discussions, it has been highlighted the cross-over with other community groups in Catalyst. The challenges themselves are competitive, however, there is nothing preventing us from taking a collaborative approach. After all, in most case, we are creating public goods for the Cardano Ecosystem. They have similar goals to broaden the reach of the Cardano Catalyst Ecosystem. The three groups often discussed because there is plenty of overlap in memberships:
It seems pointless to work on competing proposals. However, in the spirit of decentralising governance, it is not considered desirable to coordinate under a single umbrella proposal. Local needs and specific focus will vary. The proposals themselves will have a similar focus and structure. Therefore we'd like to work on and develop common template proposals with these other community groups. The proposals would then be tweaked (customised) to each group's local needs.
In many cases, for instance, local language groups, these proposals while similar are non-rivalrous. C3ETH voters are more likely to vote for C3ETH proposals because they cater to the C3ETH's local members.
Concerns and Goals for C3ETH Proposals
Relative voting power
The relative voting strengths of each language/country group in the C3ETH timezone. An important issue to consider. @tuvalusoftware in prior comments the disadvantage that countries like Vietnam (and @wolstaeb notes New Zealand too) have relative to larger countries in the hemisphere. Whether because of awareness or size. If the proposal's focused on specific countries and languages then countries like Vietnam would be at a significant disadvantage. Unified proposals would be much better. At least in the beginning.
Retroactive Funding
In a prior meeting, Greg discussed the budget structure of the proposals should contain an allowance for %50 retroactive funding. That is because we are already trying to get the ETH off the ground. Proposal development takes significant time too. This is an issue for public goods funding in general. When there isn't a business model that justified risk-taking many community efforts fail because they rely on altruism. And that is not sustainable.
Catalyst Challenge Teams and Rapid Funding
Only incidentally related to the ideation of proposals, we discussed the idea and objectives of the Challenge Teams and Rapid Funding. These directly touch on issues concerning retroactive funding, and inverted proposals mentioned above.
For fund 6 we are not considering C3ETH as a challenge team or a candidate for rapid funding. However, for future proposals, we may want to consider alternative funding models to experiment.
Doing too much too soon
The C3ETH is young. Very young and we are still trying to figure out how to work together. There are different skill sets, different languages, and widely different cultures. While this is beautiful it does make understanding and coordinating more difficult. Western cultures for instance share many cultural similarities, ditto shared language communities such as Spanish.
In the C3ETH we bridge many languages and cultures. Be careful in how much we attempt to take on. Take time to understand each other, make sure everyone is welcome and able to find a way to contribute. While there is a desire to do a number of proposals, less is more. Until we plant our feet firmly.
Challenge Setting
Language-Specific Challenges
In prior dicussion we had settled on a format for language-specific challenges. Start-small and grow from there. Asking for Challenge Funds of say $75K USD. This would enable onboarding to start without placing too much onus on C3ETH participants to coordinate. The multi-language proposal's themselves would be unified by virtue of coming from C3ETH.
On reflection of @tuvalusoftware in relative voting power comments an alternative approach was suggested - adopt and adapt the Grow Cardano, Grow Africa proposal for South-East Asia.
Just copy it more-or-less.
Multilingual Challenge
Many community groups and IOG/CF/Ideascale want to translate content. However, coordinating efforts to do that through a single coordinating group is difficult to pull off and counter to ideas of decentralised governance/control. So how to approach this while not replicating effort?
The general approach is to lead by example, make it open, and help establish a shared approach that ensures details can be easily integrated/share. In our C3ETH case, we are uniquely positioned because we are from the beginning dealing with multiple languages. English is not a first, or fast second language, across the eastern hemisphere. We are not oriented around a common language like the Spanish community for instance.
To serve our own needs @wolstaeb is asking the C3ETH participants to use some tools and processes not familiar to many members of the group. Git, Github, Markdown, and Crowdin. These will take time to learn and let people become accustomed to them. However these tools are proven to work in global knowledge creation- Open Source Software development- therefore provide a good basis for standardising localisation practice.
In addition, @wolstaeb and @FelixfromSwarm have had discussions with the Spanish Community, and IOG staff. Clearly, there is a need to do something in common using the C3ETH as the initial example.
Distributed Decision Making
Building upon all the prior discussion, the C3ETH efforts fit this challenge from the point of view of helping to:
Within the Eastern Hemisphere, and South East Asia specifically. There is significant overlap with the Catalyst School in any proposal in this challenge. Please refer to the miro board and Catalyst School proposal development.
Additional orientation notes will be added here when these have been reviewed.
Proposer Outreach and Value Onboarding
Proposer Outreach and Value Onboarding are two challenges that in general the C3ETH fall. By running the Eastern Townhall we aim to do introduce the community to:
How we do that is going to be an evolving format. Centred initially and primarily on the unified Eastern Townhall and language-specific breakout room format. We will take cues from the Catalyst Swarm, and hopefully also provide cues and ideas back to them also. For example, @whitevo has been helping C3ETH members (@YanTirta and @zicozibu) understand the mini-proposal format and process.
There is significant overlap with the Catalyst Swarm and Catalyst School in any proposal in these challenges. Please refer to the miro board and Catalyst School proposal development.
Additional orientation notes will be added here when these have been reviewed.
Notes on experiments with translation
Please start translating the Campaigns in the Fund6 Proposal GitHub repo. There is a public translation project in Crowdin to help streamline the translation of the Catalyst Fund 6 Challenges and our work developing proposals for Fund 6. We are trying things out using Crowdin, Github, and markdown files.
The Crowdin project is pulling the English source files (markdown) from the Catalyst Fund 6 repository. If all goes well we should be able to crowdsource translations and offer bounties 😁 and NFT achievement badges eventually. The following languages have been set up for translations, more can be added:
If you go to https://crowdin.com/project/c3eth-fund6 and sign up to Crowdin you should be able to pick the language and start translating the Catalyst Fund 6 Challenges into your language. Have a go and try it out.
Please let me know what email you used to signup to Crowdin so I can add you as a team translator if needed. That way you'll be able to send the link to the public project out and get other people to help out. You will be able to go through and approve their translations before they end up back in the main repository. Periodically I will pull the translations back into the main Catalyst Fund 6 repository and merge them. More details are in the README file. Any questions you can either put them into the Eastern Townhall Discord or Crowdin has chat/message features.