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This is a place for Cataclysm & Wrath of the Lich King Classic bug reports and research
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[BUG][TEST-REQUEST] Nitro boost fail rate is too low #961

Closed Lillyton closed 7 months ago

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

1. Current Behavior

1.1. Description

Nitro boost fail rate is currently too low. (around 5%)

I haven't been able to get into the beta to test this myself, but through the grapevine I've heard it's really low. Decided to make this report to at least get some attention in case I don't make it into the beta. It does sound like it can fail in dungeons (hopefully raids too), so that sounds correct.

2. Expected Behavior

2.1. Description

Nitro boost should be able to fail in instances (dungeons, raids, pvp) and have a high fail chance of 50-60%.

With the release of Cataclysm, the Blizzard team made it so Nitro boost could fail in instances. And they gave it a high chance to do so, to balance it out.

eltreum0 commented 7 months ago

I should add to this that i've played as an engineer since cataclysm (in retail) and pretty much always had nitro boosts.

They never failed at around 50%, it was always a very low chance, id say the current chance is about correct

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

I should add to this that i've played as an engineer since cataclysm (in retail) and pretty much always had nitro boosts.

They never failed at around 50%, it was always a very low chance, id say the current chance is about correct

It was for sure quite high, it had people foaming at the mouth when they changed it. One people even had it fail 4 times in a row after the Cata change.

I'll make a list of sources about high failure chances.

eltreum0 commented 7 months ago

The proc hasnt changed since cata, you can just login into retail and test. You can cause the leak multiple times in a row, but over hundreds of times the leak/damage chance will be quite low

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

Are you serious? Took me 2 mins to prove you wrong. image

Oh didn't see that last comment. Mm, let me find more info from Cata time period.

eltreum0 commented 7 months ago

Most of the comments you find will be from people having very bad luck, like i said you'd need to use it over 100 times to get better numbers, its just statistics.

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/534914-world-of-warcraft/57903260 image They mention it being able to fail in pvp battlegrounds.

eltreum0 commented 7 months ago

I remember me dying to it at least once in SoO prog way back, but i dont really remember it failing after

As for bgs, i think bgs are treated differently and it can indeed fail there

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

Most of the comments you find will be from people having very bad luck, like i said you'd need to use it over 100 times to get better numbers, its just statistics.

True, but the chances of multiple failures in a row is still lower than the current chance. And that was happening to a lot of people.

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

image image image So maybe not 50-60, but more around 30-50? I'll find more stuff tomorrow. Heading to bed soon.

eltreum0 commented 7 months ago

Thing is that all those people are throwing wild numbers around, they need to supply data. Even myself i am just speaking from experience, i really very rarely get the debuff and i do use it quite often (pretty much all my characters have nitro boosts)

You will need to test this to confirm

Yotsutester commented 7 months ago

I spent the first 30 minutes of my morning afk inside Blackrock Caverns using rocket boost on CD. I had one fail.

https://imgur.com/a/xc8BsEg

Here's an imgur link with screenshots of buffs, timestamp, and character pane shown.

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

I spent the first 30 minutes of my morning afk inside Blackrock Caverns using rocket boost on CD. I had one fail.

https://imgur.com/a/xc8BsEg

Here's an imgur link with screenshots of buffs, timestamp, and character pane shown.

Thank you for testing. But could you try maybe a couple dozen more times? 10 isn't that high of a test sample, even if it was currently 50%. While you could get 1/9 with a coin flip, it would be more unlikely then if it was 5%.

Like Eltreum said, 100 would give better numbers. But don't want to take too much of your time.

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

Some of the info I've found. Found a bunch of people complaining about it. I've not found anyone who had done a big test so far, but it did seem to be higher than it might be at the moment.

Searched for Rocket fuel leak on mmo-champion Some example comments being: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/798087-New-belt-quot-rocket-boots-quot-constantly-misfires/page2?highlight=rocket+fuel+leak image https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/894508-Engineering-4-1-Nerf-(again)?highlight=rocket+fuel+leak image https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/946456-Things-that-always-seem-to-happen-to-you?highlight=rocket+fuel+leak image

https://web.archive.org/web/20110502054612/http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/172334/why-do-nitro-boosts-kill-you-now image

ssabbyccatt commented 7 months ago

Some of the ferals did some data collection on this. It looks like in instances, it's somewhere between 6-10% fail rate.

test 1- https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1170121940778889330/1230970332400189490/image.png?ex=66354175&is=6622cc75&hm=9e11f1df052ecf8f371ee8b2f22ce8d808af8bd608d1fa42620edcd045d05b7a& test 2 - https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1170121940778889330/1230970518795190372/image.png?ex=663541a2&is=6622cca2&hm=220374205c2f9e3b2fc844bd9a47120de1b47d099738c873e79d54e8404c001e&

ForgeGit commented 7 months ago

(Written) sources from OG Cata seem to contradict each other, and are extremely anecdotical for the most part.

Similarly to all those anecdotes of having a "high" fail, there are other comments from back then suggesting the chance of it happening is "very low".

ZaoZao, in a 2011 post casually mentions 1/1000 uses image

In that same post, Halle mentions the failure rate of getting launched into the air being an "extremely rare" ocurrence. Although it is later clarified that this might be due to mixing in-combat vs out-of-combat chances, and it is specifically about getting launched in the air (not about the leak)

image

Both taken from this thread: https://web.archive.org/web/20120207222357/http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t125290-blood_dk_endgame_tanking_4_x/p5/#post1990475

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

ZaoZao, in a 2011 post casually mentions 1/1000 uses

That's about the shield belt tinker. That one had a very low failure chance.

Lillyton commented 7 months ago

@CharWS Reopen this. One comment doesn't disprove the multiple I found.

knasen88 commented 7 months ago

does it ever occur to you that people only complain when it fails? people arent gonna post when it works as expected. Any comments as source is

it is pretty easy for blizzard to just check the correct value and apply it, some communication from them would obv help to end any speculation