Refugee center zombies update

[I-am-Erk]

Is your feature request related to a problem? Please describe.

The refugee center zombies are currently a bunch of randomly spawned zombies, and then a named one appears when you take the quest. The named one is always a special zombie, type randomly selected. This allows one somewhat weird exploit where you can sneak in, kill most of the regular Z, then spawn just sean alone and fight the special Z on your own terms to complete the quest. All in all, it feels a little bit dated. It's not really broken but, in reviewing how we could update it, I've thought of some cool stuff. I am going to record it here so I don't forget it, and if someone wants to help me work on it, feel free!

Solution you would like.

1. Create a new unique "mini boss" zombie for Sean, something a bit stronger than a tough zombie but weaker than a brute. Not a fancy mutant. This zombie should start spawned in the back room, and killing it should trigger a few variables that can be used to track the progress of the quest. Now that it's a unique zombie it can also have some unique loot, which is a great opportunity for special storytelling.
2. Create a specialized refugee center zombie that copies-from the mon_zombie but cannot evolve and has special loot. This allows two things: first, we can track how many of these zombies have died and how many you've killed yourself, so we can make sure you've killed all the Z, not just Sean. If you kill them by leading them into the guards, we should actually be able to comment on that. Second, we can potentially do some more in-depth storytelling through the loot they drop, especially if we have a few more unique ones. For example, it should be possible to specifically identify Boris and Stan's son among the dead.
3. Add some unique items to be found among the dead, and small bits of dialogue where you can return these to their owners.
4. Add some new dialogue before and after the quest, particularly after, clarifying more what happened.
5. Add a timeline to the quest. If more than a few weeks pass from the start of the game, the zombies should be cleared out by the merc in the center, and the merc should sustain an injury in the process.

Dialogue changes

• Make the center staff a bit more vague and elusive about what happened. The implication is that they're sanitizing the story: in truth, they panicked and shut some people in to die with the zombies. Exploring the back bay triggers the ability to ask about this and learn more about what really happened. The dialogue shouldn't paint them to be too terribly villainous: just panicked. Nobody made a specific order for it to happen and many sympathetic people should agree that there wasn't any safe way to get anyone else out.
• Add ferals to the original part of the story. It ups the danger level and makes it more clear how things went out of control.
• Dialogue from Smokes if you kill the zombies without the quest
• Dialogue from other people in the center during and after the quest based on outcomes
• Add the ability to ask the merc to help out in return for some of the pay

Describe alternatives you have considered.

It's not really necessary to do all the custom monsters, I just think it's cool and adds potential for immersion.

Additional context

No response

[MNG-cataclysm]

Would it be possible to fail the quest badly enough to the point where the zombies overwhelm security staff and overrun the center, or should the guards be able automatically handle it before it gets this bad? Should refugees comment on the player's actions if they (for some illogical and unknown reason) sabotage the back bay clearing methods to allow it to spiral to this point, or if it just naturally gets this bad on its own?

[I-am-Erk]

I'm not sure that should really be possible unless you turn around and help the zombies... Part of the idea is that the free merchant guards could easily clear the zombies but they're too scared to try. Rather, efforts should go to making sure if you try to do that, the guards clear the zombies but recognize that they did the work, and comment on it to you (probably docking your pay).

I don't think I can anticipate how a player would sabotage things to get out of hand. Possibly we could have an automatic kill field if the special zombies leave the room, and attribute those deaths to the merchants

[Kywi001]

Unique items?

• a diary/note with the writings on what couldve happened
• a locket with a picture
• a bloody teddy bear (or some sort)

[I-am-Erk]

Kind of in that vein yeah. I was thinking of a few specific items for people we've coded, and then a variantized item like "memorabilia" that is randomized and can be turned into smokes who will track down the appropriate person downstairs in return for a reward and goodwill

[PatrikLundell]

A few weeks is a very short time for the quest to expire.

I've usually started with heavily addicted XXXL people (min/maxing according to the old rules, with some starting challenges as the price to pay), and it takes one to two months to recover health sufficiently that I'd risk going to the refugee center (and approach others in general, due to the risk of catching diseases). It takes a month or so to get over the withdrawals, but the tanked health takes forever to recover (the withdrawals are over well before the health messages in the morning starts to change from the "you're on the verge of dying" versions to the "you're just a short distance from dying" and a fair while before the next change, after which the health messages shoot up like a cork in water). Note that this includes eating minimal amounts to cover vitamin needs while still shedding weight (again, it takes a very long time to notice anything as bathroom scales top out at 150 kg and thus are useless).

Apart from my specific start choices, it still takes a couple of months to get sufficient equipment to dare to try to take on the quest (maybe I'm a coward?).

[IdleSol]

A few weeks is a very short time for the quest to expire.

And in a month's time, there could be a Hulk. Or any other powerful zombie that would have broken through the defenses. In two months, there should definitely be a Hulk. Probably more than one.

Based on the speed at which the average zombie takes out a wooden door. This whole room looks unrealistic.

A basement with concrete walls and iron doors? Probably would have contained a group of zombies for a month. But the Hulk would have broken down the iron doors, too.

It would be better to change the quest conditions a bit.

• it is not available when you first visit the center, the back room is inhabited, including unique npc (those who then die). They may have unique skills (character training).
• After the first time outside the reality bubble and after some time (say at least 12 hours), the conditions for starting the quest are met. Alternative: sleeping outside the refugee center.
• Re-visiting the center, if the conditions described above are met, starts the quest. NPCs tell of a tragedy: someone covered up a bite or something broke in. Or it is a diversion of bandits (how?). And in general we don't care about chit-chat, help us kill zombies. In this way the usual dialogs are blocked.

This will allow the zombie evolution time to be tied to the time of the player's first visit. And adjust their difficulty. Since conditionally, the tragedy just happened just now, almost before the player came. And not on the first day of the cataclysm. Which is odd if the player comes years later.

The player will be able to get to know non-player characters, and lose them afterward. In practice, you can have time to learn something, but you will have to live in a refugee center, as it is worth leaving it and the countdown begins.

Personally, I like the idea of spiders. Giant spiders. Everybody likes spiders?

Day one, it's just spiders and a bunch of dead bodies. After a couple days, it's zombies and a bunch of dead spiders. Wait a little longer and put together a combo of zombies and zombie spiders.

@I-am-Erk

Why stop at one unique monster? Create a group at once. One monster for each significant NPC. That is, every NPC mentioned by the remaining survivors.

Is it possible to link their drops to items they had when they were alive? Provided the player can catch them alive?

Is it possible to implement two reality bubbles? One for the player, one for the time areas? And so, after getting a quest, the refugee center area is sent to a temporary reality bubble.

[PGR-14]

Maybe it's like that assault team devourer? But much, much, less OP.

[I-am-Erk]

Patrik: it's not going to represent a serious loss of content if the back bay is cleared without you. The opposite, in fact: if I design both possibilities, I want people to experience both, not for one to be the default. However you must realize that your specific play preference isn't standard, you are describing a setup where you start with a ton of traits and conditions that will make it slower to get started. It doesn't make sense to design the refugees to wait for you.

Idlesol: it's a neat idea allowing you to meet the NPCs, but what you're describing would add huge amounts more content and complexity for a thing to only be seen once, and would still need more time based processing so that eventually the back bay event happens on its own if you never show up. I think sticking to the plan for it makes it substantially more manageable.

[PatrikLundell]

Well, regardless of my start preferences, I'd still not be ready to take on the back bay in a few weeks due to a lack of equipment (or compensating skills, unless starting with a relevant overpowered profession). However, if it's not critical to be able to do it in time it's no big deal. I still maintain it's a quest for overpowered starts, though, but you seem to be fine with that, so it should be OK.

[I-am-Erk]

it's worth remembering, the back bay in this version is probably going to be easier. The mini-boss is a tougher tough zombie, there's probably going to be fewer zombies overall, and you can pretty easily get the merc to come help.

[Kywi001]

Would also be a nice addition that they add a graveyard somewhere near once you clear this quest

[I-am-Erk]

I'd like to do a lot of map updates to the ref center but I've never had the combination of time and motivation all at once

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