I run 2 Ender 3 model printer, just the regular ancient Ender 3machines, one I run on 0.8mm nozzles for some less detailed jobs and the other I run at 0.4mm.
After years I've finally upgraded them to all metal hot-end's, now that I'm mostly printing PETG or other CoPolyesthers - I used Bi-Metal Heatbreak inserts for this (titanium/copper). (I tried microswiss hot-ends but they just were to finnecky to get dialed in with PLA and kept jamming even with all the recommended tuning to retraction printing temp and print speed etc.).
In general this seemed to work great on my 0.8mm machine, only with PLA I still had too many issues, especially when printing at lower speeds due to heat-creep.
So after some searching online I concluded that I had to switch out the hot end coolling fan. I went from the Stock Ender Fan to a cheap 4020 fan producing roughly 9.7 CFM @ 0.1A 24V. Which eliminated the issue for the most, but still there was an occasional jam, with heat-creep being the culprit again.
So I upgraded the fan to a 16.2 CFM @ 0.2A 24V and that worked perfect.
However on my 0.4mm machine I noticed when running it that at first I had a lot of underextrusion, printing PLA @ 200C.
I figured this was reasonable as it is recommended to turn up the temperature a bit when going all-metal.
When printing at 225C it printed perfect again with PLA.
Then on one occasion I was monitoring a specific print and I noticed the heating cycle of the 0.4mm machine took quite long, I also noticed that when the machine had reached the printing temp. It instantly dropped to 195-200C within the first two layers, never getting back up to 225C again...
Because of this I've ran several tests to figure out what's wrong, but it's throwing me for a loop... It seems regardless of what temperature I choose it now permanently hovers 5-15C lower than any temp I assign it to, with part-cooling on even as much as 25C. When I run a diagnostic without any cooling at all (no hot-end fan on or part-cooling on) the hot-end heats up to any desired temp, no issue at all.
It's almost as if the hot-end is not getting enough current or something?
What I've tried so far in more or less chronological order.:
re-tune PID
Did not make a significant difference.
replace the stock heater cartridge and thermistor - suspecting one or both to be damaged.
Worsened the issue since stock is 40W and I only have 30W as spares. Ran the test with and without part cooling, both tests with hot-end cooling on.
Hot-end was not able to get even close to 260C maxing out at 220C.
Put in a 12V 50W cartridge I had lying around, and tested it with hot-end cooling on as well as max power on the part cooling fan. - assuming the cartridge is still the culprit.
Firstly, I am aware of how stupid and dangerous this is and that @24V, you're running a 200W unit, but it was just to test and under controlled conditions. It did however heat up and maintain temp (with some 6-9C jumps) without any issue at all.
Run a diagnostic with no cooling at all. To see how severe the influence of cooling would be.
Which worked, printer was able to attain all desired temperature settings with decent ease.
Leading me to believe that maybe the power of the hot-end cooling fan was the issue and that 16.2CFM is simply too much, or the hot-end cartridge is still to anemic.
Changed the geometry of the hot-end housing I designed so that less air is blowing directly on the heat-block.
Ran another diagnostic with the improved hot-end housing, both with the 9.7 CFM fan and 16.2 CFM.
The printer was completely incapable to get up to temp (target 260C), this was worse with the more powerful fan of course.
So the geometry change made no real difference unfortunately.
Everything is using a silicone insulating sock on the heater block as well.
It's really confusing, since the 0.8mm machine which has the exact same set-up than the 0.4mm machine, has none of these issues.
The 0.8mm machine heats up to 260C with the 16.2CFM fan as a hot-end cooling fan and a 9.7CFM fan for part cooling both at full blaze. And it does so in less than 5 minutes. It 'maybe' drops 2C at most @ 260C. The most infuriating, is that the 0.8mm machine runs a 30W heater...
So I'm a bit lost, the only thing I haven't looked into is how old both machines exactly are and if they're running different boards.
Or if the boards produce different currents. Or if it's maybe firmware related.
The 0.8mm machine is one I bought new in 2019 and I have update the firmware in 2021 on it.
The other printer I bought second hand and have no idea how old it is and what firmware it runs exactly.
Has anobody got any suggestions? So far what I'm going to try still is put a heavier heater on there, I've ordered both 50W and 70W @ 24V.
Although I don't want this as a permanent fix because of safety tbh.
Maybe the board is toast? Or is the firmware messed up? - I really have no real issue where to look especially since my electromechanics isn't up to par.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
TL;DR
Upgraded my two Ender 3 printers to all metal, one machine is running without issues, other machine cannot get up to temp not even to save it's own life. One runs 0.8mm nozzle the other 0.4mm, the 0.4mm machine has issues.
I swapped out:
The heat break for a titanium/copper heatbreak.
The hot-end Fan for a 4020 CFM 9.7 fan and later for a 4028 14.6 CFM unit
The heatercartridge on the 0.8mm machine from 24V 40W to 24V 30W - other machine runs stock 40W cartridge.
A custom housing for the hot end to direct cooling as much towards the heatbreak and heatsink as possible.
Other than the heater cartridge the machines are 100% identical in terms of hot-end set up.
The 0.4mm machine just can't seem to hold temperature or get to temperature when cooling is on.
I run 2 Ender 3 model printer, just the regular ancient Ender 3machines, one I run on 0.8mm nozzles for some less detailed jobs and the other I run at 0.4mm.
After years I've finally upgraded them to all metal hot-end's, now that I'm mostly printing PETG or other CoPolyesthers - I used Bi-Metal Heatbreak inserts for this (titanium/copper). (I tried microswiss hot-ends but they just were to finnecky to get dialed in with PLA and kept jamming even with all the recommended tuning to retraction printing temp and print speed etc.).
In general this seemed to work great on my 0.8mm machine, only with PLA I still had too many issues, especially when printing at lower speeds due to heat-creep. So after some searching online I concluded that I had to switch out the hot end coolling fan. I went from the Stock Ender Fan to a cheap 4020 fan producing roughly 9.7 CFM @ 0.1A 24V. Which eliminated the issue for the most, but still there was an occasional jam, with heat-creep being the culprit again. So I upgraded the fan to a 16.2 CFM @ 0.2A 24V and that worked perfect.
However on my 0.4mm machine I noticed when running it that at first I had a lot of underextrusion, printing PLA @ 200C. I figured this was reasonable as it is recommended to turn up the temperature a bit when going all-metal. When printing at 225C it printed perfect again with PLA. Then on one occasion I was monitoring a specific print and I noticed the heating cycle of the 0.4mm machine took quite long, I also noticed that when the machine had reached the printing temp. It instantly dropped to 195-200C within the first two layers, never getting back up to 225C again...
Because of this I've ran several tests to figure out what's wrong, but it's throwing me for a loop... It seems regardless of what temperature I choose it now permanently hovers 5-15C lower than any temp I assign it to, with part-cooling on even as much as 25C. When I run a diagnostic without any cooling at all (no hot-end fan on or part-cooling on) the hot-end heats up to any desired temp, no issue at all. It's almost as if the hot-end is not getting enough current or something?
What I've tried so far in more or less chronological order.:
re-tune PID Did not make a significant difference.
replace the stock heater cartridge and thermistor - suspecting one or both to be damaged. Worsened the issue since stock is 40W and I only have 30W as spares. Ran the test with and without part cooling, both tests with hot-end cooling on. Hot-end was not able to get even close to 260C maxing out at 220C.
Put in a 12V 50W cartridge I had lying around, and tested it with hot-end cooling on as well as max power on the part cooling fan. - assuming the cartridge is still the culprit. Firstly, I am aware of how stupid and dangerous this is and that @24V, you're running a 200W unit, but it was just to test and under controlled conditions. It did however heat up and maintain temp (with some 6-9C jumps) without any issue at all.
Run a diagnostic with no cooling at all. To see how severe the influence of cooling would be. Which worked, printer was able to attain all desired temperature settings with decent ease. Leading me to believe that maybe the power of the hot-end cooling fan was the issue and that 16.2CFM is simply too much, or the hot-end cartridge is still to anemic.
Changed the geometry of the hot-end housing I designed so that less air is blowing directly on the heat-block. Ran another diagnostic with the improved hot-end housing, both with the 9.7 CFM fan and 16.2 CFM. The printer was completely incapable to get up to temp (target 260C), this was worse with the more powerful fan of course. So the geometry change made no real difference unfortunately. Everything is using a silicone insulating sock on the heater block as well.
It's really confusing, since the 0.8mm machine which has the exact same set-up than the 0.4mm machine, has none of these issues. The 0.8mm machine heats up to 260C with the 16.2CFM fan as a hot-end cooling fan and a 9.7CFM fan for part cooling both at full blaze. And it does so in less than 5 minutes. It 'maybe' drops 2C at most @ 260C. The most infuriating, is that the 0.8mm machine runs a 30W heater...
So I'm a bit lost, the only thing I haven't looked into is how old both machines exactly are and if they're running different boards. Or if the boards produce different currents. Or if it's maybe firmware related.
The 0.8mm machine is one I bought new in 2019 and I have update the firmware in 2021 on it. The other printer I bought second hand and have no idea how old it is and what firmware it runs exactly.
Has anobody got any suggestions? So far what I'm going to try still is put a heavier heater on there, I've ordered both 50W and 70W @ 24V. Although I don't want this as a permanent fix because of safety tbh. Maybe the board is toast? Or is the firmware messed up? - I really have no real issue where to look especially since my electromechanics isn't up to par.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
TL;DR Upgraded my two Ender 3 printers to all metal, one machine is running without issues, other machine cannot get up to temp not even to save it's own life. One runs 0.8mm nozzle the other 0.4mm, the 0.4mm machine has issues.
I swapped out: The heat break for a titanium/copper heatbreak. The hot-end Fan for a 4020 CFM 9.7 fan and later for a 4028 14.6 CFM unit The heatercartridge on the 0.8mm machine from 24V 40W to 24V 30W - other machine runs stock 40W cartridge. A custom housing for the hot end to direct cooling as much towards the heatbreak and heatsink as possible.
Other than the heater cartridge the machines are 100% identical in terms of hot-end set up.
The 0.4mm machine just can't seem to hold temperature or get to temperature when cooling is on.