ghost commented 10 years ago

Bosses cant Parry and the Dodge is to low (5%): Exaple Mother Shahraz:

Warrior Tank: Pala Tank(0 expertise):

How it should be: Reference WoWWiki:

Introduced in patch 2.3 to replace Weapon Skill, each point of expertise will reduce the chance that a mob will dodge or parry your attack by 0.25%. ... Expertise against Bosses The dodge and parry chances for boss-mobs is currently disputed, but combat parses tend to point at around 6.5% dodge and as high as 12-15% parry.[citation needed] Assuming 6.5% dodge and 15% parry, a player would need 26 expertise (about 104 expertise rating) to negate a boss' dodge chance, and 60 expertise (roughly 236 expertise rating) to prevent parries.

wlfbck commented 10 years ago

I wouldn't be sure about the parry part (or better, i wouldn't take the number from wowwiki), but dodge should definitely be at 6.5%, as was very evident during wotlk where every melee dps was actually running with it.

brothell commented 10 years ago

Warrior tank got some expertise from Defiance talent.

Fleischi commented 10 years ago

from a rather exhaustive prot warrior guide(chapter 7, part d):

A normal default boss should avoid the attacks of a naked warrior as follows:

Player vs. Boss Miss: 9.0% Dodge: 5.6% (unknown, a best guess) Parry: 14.0% (unknown, a best guess) Glancing Blow: 25% (default glancing blow rate against a boss with white damage)

so if we assume that the person writing this guide did not just pull everything out of his/her ass, both tanks should have had at least some parry in the list. we did not have any parrys on azgalor aswell. cant say anthing about other bosses right now as i dont have data. but i would expect the results to be similar.

this would also explain why tanks in general generate so much aggro. back on retail i used to have aggro problems on a lot of bosses. here it seems to be a lot less problematic.

PS: the whole section of that guide is pretty interesting and deals with the topic in more detail. read it!

ghost commented 8 years ago

Dodge

Current situation

Most bosses got a dodge chance less then 6%

How it should be

All bosses should have a dodge chance of 6.5%

Sources

wowwiki

The dodge and parry chances for boss-mobs is currently disputed, but combat parses tend to point at around 6.5% dodge and as high as 12-15% parry.[citation needed] Assuming 6.5% dodge and 15% parry, a player would need 26 expertise (about 104 expertise rating) to negate a boss' dodge chance, and 60 expertise (roughly 236 expertise rating) to prevent parries.

A rogue need 103 expertise rating for cap but only each full expertise point count so you need 104 expertise rating. 104 expertise ratting is equivalent to 6.59% Dodge (Rogue Weapon Expertise Cap)

0/2 Weapon Expertise, non-Human: 103 1/2 Weapon Expertise, non-Human: 83 2/2 Weapon Expertise, non-Human: 64 0/2 Weapon Expertise, Human (wielding swords or maces): 83 1/2 Weapon Expertise, Human: 64 2/2 Weapon Expertise, Human: 44

A discusion in the wowone forum

"This seems to be slightly incorrect, as bosses’ dodge rate is thought to be (around) 6.5% and not 5.6% anymore. 26 Expertise would be the correct number for 6.5%, while 23 Expertise would be for 5.6%. The first post of the thread Roguecraft 101 (section “Regarding the Hit and Expertise Caps”) mentions 6.5% as well.

Dodge and Parry depend on what level the target is. I don't know if these values are accurate for 2.4.3, but I think they were never changed and always were like this (Data is valid since early WotLK): Level difference: Dodge / Parry +0: 5.0% / 5.0% +1: 5.5% / 5.5% +2: 6.0% / 6.0% +3: 6.5% / 14.00% So for HC bosses (Level 72, +2) 24 expertise is just fine for both DPS and Tanks, for Raid bosses (Level 73, +3) it will help if Tanks stack up more expertise (I doubt that 56 expertise are reachable at the current content/gear stage).

Parry

Current situation

Most bosses can not parry or for less then 2%.

How it should be

All bosses should parry with 14%.

Sources

wowwiki: Teron Gorefiend

As usual, melee DPS must stand behind him to avoid increasing his attack speed by parries

wowwiki:Mother Shahraz

never crushing, no swing timer reset on parry

wowwiki: Gathios the Shatterer

The melee damage dealers must be extra careful never to attack him from the front, since an increase of his attack speed (after a parry) can mean near-instant death for the MT

wowwiki: Azgalor (tactics)