Shifter Zerus's transform timing is inconsistent

[Kybxd]

Transformed Zerus triggers before other start-of-turn effects,while untransformed Zerus triggers after other start-of-turn effects.(https://youtu.be/7Tpw3Iy9EIw)

I also guess battlefield effects and hand effects are resolved in different queues.I tested with 10925 but I didn't record the video: 1.Summon Resolution Step: I summon a beast,and my Starving Buzzard draws Knight of the Wild,the Knight's mana cost is reduced by 1. 2.Death Event: Loot Hoarder's deathrattle and Cult Master trigger.First I draw 2 Bolvar Fordragons,then their attack is increased. 3.Start of the Turn: (1)My Nat Pagle draws a Shifter Zerus,and it can transform. (2)Dominant player's Darkfisher draws a Shifter Zerus for the secondary player,and it can transform. (3)Secondary player's Darkfisher draws a Shifter Zerus for the dominant player,however,it can't transform.

So I think the trigger order might be Dominant Battlefield-Dominant Hand-Secondary Battlefield-Secondary Hand,but transformed Zerus seems not to apply to it...

[Patashu]

Woaaaaah. Mind blown O_O

[10925]

Ok, here is nats vs shifter zerus video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60f-OuRPOQg&feature=youtu.be

KYBXD(my opponent) is the Dominant player in the video. As you can see, the Shifter Zerus draw by my Darkfisher effect wouldn't transform. And Shifter Zerus draw by his Darkfisher and my Nat would transform.

[jleclanche]

I don't know how fixable this is. One of the transforms comes from Zerus himself, while the other comes from the buff he applies (OG_123e). Timings are bound to be inconsistent.

[Patashu]

Thank you for the videos. Very interesting results.

[Patashu]

Random thought:

I guess untransformed Shifter Zerus triggers in the relevant player's hand queue, and the attached Enchantment (OG_123e) is considered to be in PLAY, so it triggers in the relevant player's play queue. (Attached Enchantments even to entities in other zones are always considered to be in PLAY - see https://github.com/HearthSim/hs-bugs/issues/347 for an interesting consequence of this)

So that means that if Shifter Zerus immediately transforms into Nerubian Prophet (who also has a hand Start of Turn Phase trigger), it won't be able to queue and resolve.

But if Shifter Zerus (already transformed) transforms into Nerubian Prophet, it did so in the relevant player's play queue, meaning the hand queue can queue and resolve the Nerubian Prophet trigger.

So I guess the 'split queue' model of the Dominant Player Bug has become the 'quad queue' model.

[PattuX]

Further evidence: Competetive Spirit always triggers before Cursed! (the card created by Curse of Rafaam)

[Patashu]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veg98eft6VI&feature=youtu.be (video for above)

[Patashu]

Hey @Kybxd and @10925 , can you explain this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/4gzrjj/bug_with_shifter_zerus/?

'So I drew [[Shifter Zerus]] first turn of the match and it turned into a [[Nerubian Prophet]] as the first minion and it immediately got the cost discount so it went to 5 mana.'

Untransformed Shifter Zerus transforms in the Hand Queue, right? And Nerubian Prophet also triggers in the Hand Queue, right?

So if the first thing Shifter Zerus turns into is Nerubian Prophet, the trigger has not queued and shouldn't trigger. (And the next turn, Shifter Zerus's Shifting Enchantment will trigger in the Play Queue and Nerubian Prophet will never have a chance to queue.)

So why did Shiter Zerus get the discount?

[Kybxd]

Sorry I can't explain why this would happen...Maybe my opinion is wrong in a sense...

I've tested this:First Shadowstep a Nerubian Prophet and then Shadowstep a Shifter Zerus.And I can see from the log that prophet triggers earlier than Zerus,proving that untransformed Zerus(or prophet) doesn't have a special priority.

And I've also retested transformed/untransformed Zerus vs Alarm-o-Bot.The interaction of them doesn't change.

[culinko]

Do you have any footage of transformed/untransformed Zerus vs Alarm-o-Bot? I'd like to open an issue for it. Thanks!

[Patashu]

@Kybxd: Don't worry if you can't figure it out. The screenshot doesn't prove that Nerubian Prophet was the first minion Zerus transformed into, so they could have forgotten what the real first minion was. I just wanted to see if you could think of anything.

[Patashu]

Confirmed in 5.0.0.13030:

https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/4n7fvm/til_if_you_pull_shifter_zerus_with_nat_pagles_he/

[Kybxd]

@Patashu I've found an evidence of untransformed Zerus/Nerubian Prophet.(http://chuantu.biz/t5/13/1467436455x3738746523.jpg)

It can be seen form the record in the left that 'Nerubian Prophet' and 'Zombie Chow' are drawn last turn,and 'Nerubian Prophet' doesn't get a mana cost reduce.

Besides,if a transformed Zerus transforms into Nerubian Prophet,it will surely get mana cost -1.This is easily seen in Tavern Brawl this week.

[Maxman013]

Patch 9.2.0.21517 seems to have removed the Quad Queue

If this is still active, would anyone like to confirm?

[PattuX]

The quad queue (or even hex-queue now Blizzard mentioned in-deck-triggers still happen seperately) is still there according to Blizzard's explanations. It's just that triggers can't be added between the play-zone and hand-zone trigger.

The best example with any effect that i can come up with rn is the following: You draw Shifter Zerus, then play Lightwell, Auchenai and Howlfiend, which you then damage. At the start of your next turn, Zerus should transform first and then get discarded imo, but according to Blizzard this is not what happens.

edit: potentially better example: Bolvar (the GvG one) in hand with 4 Attack, then play Giant Anaconda and kill the Anaconda. Bolvar should gain the Attack first and be eligible to be pulled imo, but he won't if quad queue is still a thing.