Jarrrk / HighLife

Open source feature configuration and issue tracker for the FiveM server HighLife Roleplay
https://highliferoleplay.net
70 stars 45 forks source link

Discord Discussion Page and Server, my thoughts #2934

Closed RyanJamesSmith closed 3 years ago

RyanJamesSmith commented 3 years ago

Hello, my name is truly Ryan James Smith, I'm 23 years old, I live in Houston, Texas, and I have actually only been playing Highlife for a couple weeks and now, an I've had so much fun I've already became a Bronze Supporter. With that being said, I just want to express how I feel about the Discord Discussion Thread and how its handled.

To begin, I understand the stupid people who come into the discord angry looking for answers, and they'll curse, mock, and berate until the server is back up, that's going to be just inevitable unfortunately.

This is quoted from someone who had typed this in the discussion thread. "Just feels like we are supporting no progress. in better words. I support to see stability and fixes. and it seems like in the months I've supported no progress is being made." Mrbaldbeast's word aren't harsh, they are honest and truthful, and is nearly exactly how I feel. I've only been playing a couple weeks and this is the 2nd time the servers been down for a long period of time, and honestly that isn't the problem. Things go wrong and problems occur and I FULLY UNDERSTAND that, but what you guys need to have is more transparency when these problems occur. You have 1000+ people donating $10+ to better the server and pay Staff, devs, Etc. and when the server goes down and people ask why, you act almost annoyed that we would even ask, Of course the idiots complaining that Double the problem, but you then go one to lock down the chat, resulting in everyone getting punished, including the ones who defend and donate to your cause. On top of this, when you do lock down the chat, you make it seem like its not a big deal and that we should get off the PC and "Open and the windows an get some fresh air." Some people have strict schedules that only allow play time at obscure times. Its like you try to belittle your supporters and members, by making it seem like they have no self preservation and that they need to "Go take a shower" or "Go have something to eat" "Go outside" all I see is them acting like everyone has nothing better to do. You guys need more transparency when it comes to these problems is the main thing I would like to see. What's wrong? Why'd it happen? How long? You answer those three questions and I bet half of your members will stop asking in discussion about the server.

rundmctv commented 3 years ago

This isn’t really the place for this and it doesn’t follow the format so it will probably get closed just so you know, but games go down all the time. The comments about going outside, getting something to eat, etc are usually jokes target more at the individuals who basically live in this server. I used to grind the server for 8-10 hrs a day like a lot do, so the comments, I’m sure, aren’t intended to be belittling, but more a reminder that this game isn’t life. If anything it’s just the staff saying, don’t forget to take care of yourself which is never a bad reminder. Also, the staff usually do tell us what’s going on with down times, however, you cannot expect that information 5 minutes after it goes down. It takes time to source and troubleshoot issues. Jarrrk had been extremely transparent with downtime’s and improvements. At some point recently he even talked about migrating the server because of service issues from a provider. I’m sorry, but as you’ve said, you’ve only been around for a couple weeks. As a gold supporter I feel my donated money is going towards helping bring improvements and building a better server for everyone to play on. Closing down discussion doesn’t punish anyone, it’s the right call because some children don’t know when to stop posting nasty, uncalled for messages in chat, and need to learn that that behaviour isn’t tolerated. There are other forums for people to talk in, there are so many specified channels in the discord, that I’d be surprised if you can’t find one that’s associated to what you want to talk about or a dm or a private discord someone made that probably has a bunch of people from highlife in it. Jarrrk and the staff all work incredibly hard, so far as to sacrifice their own sleep schedule sometimes when the server goes down or has issue. Anyone who knows even just a little knows that fiveM is a fickle create and has its own issues being that it’s a basically an unofficial add on to GTAV, it’s experimental, always changing, and that all effects how servers run and function. Perhaps just try being patient next time, because the servers always come back up eventually, it just takes time sometimes.

Jarrrk commented 3 years ago

Staff are all voulenteer, contracted work is occasionally sought out and required for things I'm not knowledgable, mainly webdev.

I don't want to sound like some sob story, but no one seems to realize how difficult it is to make unique content for people that have been here a long time and experienced nearly 100% of what highlife has to offer, it's like maxing on runescape, once you've done everything, there's nothing left to do, the game is boring, you rely on updates to make it fun again, which I understand, and eventually myself found out how to enjoy the server without there having to be new features every day, but that's me at the end of the day.

The 'hire more devs' is not going to work for a few reasons.

a) There's no competant developers on the FiveM platform I'm willing to work with (the ones that I had high hopes for, IllusiveTea for example, (super cool guy) was simply never interested in roleplay, nontheless a great developer) paying someone to work on something they don't enjoy is not how you create a great product, I've been in countless jobs where I've not enjoyed working on the product which has lead to the work being sub-par or corners being cut to meet 'deadlines', this is common in the software development industry.

b) This could really just be still the first point, but if someone takes time out of their own day, proves they are a great support to the project, then

Last week stability pissed me off, just like it did the majority of the players I'm sure, anyone that's been around for long enough will tell you, with time it'll always recover, just, patience on the internet is not something you can easily find. It's always usually me vs the problem, and when I'm sick, both physically and mentally, still trying to do this because people are complaining is hard, not to mention it severly degrades my motivation.

I want to work on the fun stuff just as much as everyone else wants it, but in-game, aside from assets, it's still a one man band production when it comes to gameplay. Container system is on it's 4th rewrite now, which I think I'm giving up on soon as the scope creep of it has severly spiralled out of control and what, for people to realistically notice no difference when it's completed, that's depressing.

Ultimately I haven't had a single break from anything work related, not even just highlife in 5 years I think now, my announcement (this one: https://discord.com/channels/366897352012988418/383239736212586497/794296579959422996) never happened, the UK is slowly turning into an authoritarian shithole, but I won't start throwing politics into feedback lol + resolving the small things and doing fixes ultimately brings more stability to then add more things which follows my design philosiphy of fix before feature - contrary to popular belief as well, I still work on highlife everyday even if there's nothing to show in repo-updates+I redact a lot from it that people don't need to know like AC additions and exploit fixes etc blah bleh.

Morale of the story, if you think you've got skills, come apply, help out (applications are in basic info), I don't mind paying people if they prove they're worth it, I'm not about to start hiring idiots that have no idea what FiveM is or no interest in game-dev/any development experience. Much like you wouldn't hire a customer service employee to fly for an airline.

Jarrrk commented 3 years ago

Missed this, final response to this:

What's wrong?

The first issues with timeouts were related to an internal networking problem causing high packet loss due to socket exhaustion due to bad net transmissions in the highlife server component, basically, a 'memory leak' but for network resources.

Why'd it happen?

Server growth, 300 players, exponential growth that happens the bigger we get, old methods need optimizing, net optimizations need to be carefully considered for new features and need to be tested against 300 players.

How long?

As long as it takes? There's no estimate when I don't have a progress bar in front of me that tells me when the server will be fixed (contrary to popular belief) problem solving takes time that I can't estimate, and even when I can, it usually means I found the problem so then isn't worth providing "hey, I found the problem and it'll be up in 3 minutes", typically when I find the problem I'm knowledgable to put a fix in place pretty quickly as 95% of the total codebase is written by myself, other than like dpemotes and some UI things that are soon to be deprecated and made new.


Then the next two times it happened, sometimes when I do a manual restart I forget to reinstate the cronjob that automates restarts, that's just a 'my bad' as I was tired and forgot.

Next day happened again, why? Something called a 'lock file' which is used to prevent programs from running multiple times in certain circumstances where you wouldn't want it to, like, I wouldn't want the server to start caching new assets when it's doing a big asset update which would then lead to cache corruption and no one would be able to join (not the same as when the server never restarts after it kicks people out) but usually again this is due to a manual restart where I forget to remove the lock file, human error is real and realistically, staff don't know how to do this.

I may start using pterodactyl.io, I contributed to this years ago when it was first becoming a thing and forgot all about it, now it's feature complete this will probably be viable for admins to have access to and remove my janky, but effecient (when I'm not involved breaking things) methods.

Jarrrk commented 3 years ago

Alright, actual last one just because I missed this.

Just feels like we are supporting no progress

I recommend going to play other servers, I know I shouldn't say that and I don't mean it in a "I don't like your comment leave my palace" kind of thing lol, honestly though, go play some other servers, you might find something better that suits your needs more. I'm just not the same as every other server that insists of scraping the latest fivem forum releases for half-assed resources that just feel janky or have ass performance.

Quality takes time, I know that and won't lean on that as if that's my saving grace as that's arrogant coming from me, but whatever, the only thing I can do is push myself, get some crackhead level motivation or just simply do better, which ultimately I'll try and do all of those and maybe everyone will be happy.

It's hard making everyone happing, pleasing people and giving them what they want all the time.

Leo2324421 commented 3 years ago

a) There's no competant developers on the FiveM platform I'm willing to work with (the ones that I had high hopes for, IllusiveTea for example, (super cool guy) was simply never interested in roleplay, nontheless a great developer) paying someone to work on something they don't enjoy is not how you create a great product, I've been in countless jobs where I've not enjoyed working on the product which has lead to the work being sub-par or corners being cut to meet 'deadlines', this is common in the software development industry.

While I do agree and believe it's hard to find a knowledgeable and trustworthy person to hire as a developer, I don't necessarily think it's impossible or that hard. Highlife has been a thing since 2018 I have heard? 2017? That's at least 3 years and till this moment the only person who has been working on the project (code-wise) is you. It's one of the most popular RP servers with hundreds of new people joining every week. Every server I have played on, and much smaller servers than Highlife (yes, I won't be like the rest who compare HL to NoPixel, that's no match), they have at least 2-3 people. That makes things a lot easier for everyone. Surely the income goes down since they would want to be paid (and it looks like you have no issue with that), but the pros heavily outweigh the cons.

You said you haven't stopped working on this project since 2016-2017. That's something we all respect, but imagine if you had at least one more person helping you out. You would be able to take a break, have different responsibilities each one of you etc. Because right now you are burned out, and this will never stop unless you take a long break, which means no updates/fixes for a while. For me the whole ''I have been working on this project alone'' is not a positive thing, yes, it's respectable and shows your determination/dedication, but it should be a thing that is temporary and that has to change as soon as possible. It's by no means a ''wow, that's good!'' thing. I am not saying you haven't been looking for a developer or that you deny people who are interested, maybe you have been unlucky, but perhaps show a bit more trust, give people more chances and I am sure you will find a great helping hand.

Container system is on it's 4th rewrite now, which I think I'm giving up on soon as the scope creep of it has severly spiralled out of control and what, for people to realistically notice no difference when it's completed, that's depressing.

The thing is, if container system is that much of a work while at the same time being a number 1 priority (current one is literally obsolete and it limits the server a lot), have you thought about implementing a pre-made one? There are so many good container systems out there that many servers use with no issues. There nothing wrong with ''copying'' or ''buying'' stuff (considering you have the rights to) from other servers/developers, and being completely honest with you, 99% of the people do not care even a tiny bit if a X thing is 'copied' or if it's Highlife exclusive. I can assure you that, I am one of them. Most won't even notice to begin with. A regular player wants to have fun and not be limited by slow and buggy K menus, items disappearing when you put them in the trunk and whatnot. I would rather have a 'heavily used'/public working inventory system that opens so many doors than a brand new Highlife exclusive inventory that keeps getting postponed everyday and might not come even in months (which is understandable, it's a lot of work, especially if you are the only one working on it). Don't do this to yourself.

My 2 cents.

Jarrrk commented 3 years ago

I don't necessarily think it's impossible or that hard

Apps have been open for years, we've had people in the past but those have left, I'm not going to go out of my way and advertise a role as that negates my entire point which I made prior.

There are so many good container systems out there

I don't think you understand then as a quote "container system" is not just some inventory menu or system, a menu can take less than a few minutes to finish, and yes, there are multiple "inventory systems" out there, which, none are modular to fit out needs, nor allow the functionality of what I want to bring. Not to mention, if there's ever an expansion in the future, i.e 'SixM' the container system will just work if the CFX team keep similar scripting implementations (which is highly likely) - meaning, aside from a client menu or interface, the container system will just work magically without much tweaking, much like a lot of highlife that is made with the future in mind - HighLife is designed like an engine in the sense that a lot of the designed features are very native and can be interchanged through multiple platforms, i.e a lot of HighLife actually works on RDR, or RedM with little changes needed, fun fact.

And, even if we did, it's extra manual migration which is unnecessary, not to mention whatever system will probably not handle the amount of traffic HighLife has.