Screen Savers broken function on 2+ monitor system in Ventura 13.3 beta (FB12023530)

[xmddmx]

Hijacking the top post, this is FIXED in macOS 13.5.

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macOS Ventura 13.3 beta 2 seems to severely break screen savers on multimonitor systems.

(This is not specific to Aerial, but describing it here in case others are wondering)

I just reported this issue to Apple as Feedback Case FB12023530:

To reproduce:

• on a M1 MacBook Air with a second monitor connected
• open System Preferences / Screen Saver and select the Message Screen Saver
• click the Preview button
• Expected behavior: screen saver should run on both monitors
• Actual behavior: screen saver runs on 2nd monitor only.
• Actual behavior: the screen’s rectangle seems to be offset by about 100 pixels (as if the NSView is not set to the actual screen coordinates)

Regression:

• this worked fine in 13.2
• this also affects third party screensavers such as iScreensaver and Aerial
• this doesn’t affect all first party Apple screensavers, e.g. “Hello” and “Flurry” work fine, but “Message” does not

[DSBlackHeart]

@xmddmx You mean Shifting Tiles or sliding panels?

[xmddmx]

My mistake, Shifting Tiles - See my prior post https://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1286#issuecomment-1542332240

[DSBlackHeart]

@xmddmx Thanks I will set it up and try and break it

[xmddmx]

Testing with 13.5 beta on 2 monitors, and still seeing the "5% failure" mode: 95% of the time it works fine, but 5% the original bug shows up: screen is 1 blank, screen 1's content on screen 2.

[DSBlackHeart]

@xmddmx CONFIRMED i tested it with a library that has 30K photos .... Its Broke

[glouel]

I also get slight delays here with Shifting Tiles but not as bad as other reports, though I do have a pretty small library on the mac I used to test it, so that could be it. This is also interesting because the "picture" screensavers from Apple have a special appex, they use iLifeSlideshows.appex(I love the throwback in the naming, considering it was "only" introduced in Catalina !) instead of legacyScreenSaver.appex which has lots of extra entitlements we don't get.

Anyway, it got me curious into how the heck they fixed Messages. I was under the impression that it was still a .saver, as Apple basically never use the new .appex API they built and last year's Monterey saver, for example, was released as a .saver. For the curious, those are stored in /System/Library/Screen Savers.

So I tried Messages again with Console open and was utterly surprised to see it was running Computer Name.appex which I didn't expect (or maybe I forgot !). Perhaps more interestingly, the Ventura screen saver is also an .appex, and that's definitely new.

For the curious they are stored in : /System/Library/Frameworks/ScreenSaver.framework/PlugIns/

This is what we have in all 13.x version (I went back and installed a 13.2 vm to be sure) :

• Computer Name.appex <- That's messages
• iLifeSlideshows.appex <- That's the bridge that is used by the picture savers I talked about above
• legacyScreenSaver.appex <- I believe this runs native arm savers on arm macs
• legacyScreenSaver-x86_64.appex <- I believe this runs x86 savers on arm macs
• Ventura.appex <- the new Ventura saver

So at the very least, unlike what I wrote a bit earlier above, it seems Apple is actually starting to use their new API. And that Computer Name/Messages had the exact same issue that legacyScreenSaver had, and they managed to fix that one. Are we closer to anything ? Nope, but maybe someday Apple will open up the .appex API.

At least seeing them start using it shows movement, which is news to me.

[xmddmx]

Doing a little archaeology, I see that as of 10.14 (macOS Mojave) the Message screensaver was called Floating Message.saver and lived in /System/Library/Screen Savers/

I wonder at which macOS version it changed to an .appex ?

[glouel]

Interesting that they changed the name to Computer Name (which is just the default), bit weird, old name was better (I mean I assume you can still set a custom message, didn't bother checking).

I seem to remember there was one in Catalina as an .appex but not really sure. I'll put a few restore images overnight to download as it got me too curious 😅

For the curious I use UTM : https://github.com/utmapp/UTM and these images : https://ipsw.me/VirtualMac2,1

[vinhtq115]

On 13.4, so far, I haven't encountered the "1 monitor working and 1 showing black screen" but now, video can be misaligned between two monitors. Previously, on 13.3, when Aerial worked with 2 monitors, it would aligned the video correctly. This is an example of it (mine is set to Cloned and Fit to screen):

[glouel]

@vinhtq115 that's intriguing with a 2 monitor setup. Does it happen 5% of the time roughly, or every time ?

If you can please send me a log (go into Advanced, enable debug mode, launch it once, then grab the log using the show in finder button). Please note the exact local time you saw it occuring too so I can check.

When it bugs for most people, you get the main screen shown on the secondary one, which is why you get the mismatch in size. It's surprising though to have it play correctly on 1st. Hadn't seen that one so very curious about the log.

[vinhtq115]

@vinhtq115 that's intriguing with a 2 monitor setup. Does it happen 5% of the time roughly, or every time ?

If you can please send me a log (go into Advanced, enable debug mode, launch it once, then grab the log using the show in finder button). Please note the exact local time you saw it occuring too so I can check.

When it bugs for most people, you get the main screen shown on the secondary one, which is why you get the mismatch in size. It's surprising though to have it play correctly on 1st. Hadn't seen that one so very curious about the log.

That's the first time I have seen that bug so I think that it is uncommon. I will send you the log when it happens again.

[vinhtq115]

Here's the log. It happened somewhere around 10:51.

AerialLog.txt.zip

[glouel]

Thanks @vinhtq115

Looks like you have a variation of the bug, because possibly of using clone mode. But it's the same root 5% issue with 2 monitors that we were talking about.

I believe looking at your right screen that even that one isn't correct (black bars at the bottom, not on top) so it's likely more mismatch. Everything is reported correctly in your logs just like in other cases.

Let's hope this get fixed quickly

[LeakedDave]

Just hear to drop sad face :(

My screens have been black for a week and I was wondering why... lmao GG

Updating to official 13.4 now but I don't think it will fix. Running 3 Pro Display XDR on Mac Pro. All screens black on 13.3

I don't wanna use Apple's screensavers D:

[GabeRoze]

Been bothering me a while:

Mac OS 13.4 (22F66) Apple M1 Max 2021

No matter the settings, I see a screensaver on my vertical monitor (only on the bottom half) If I set the rotation to 0 on the vertical monitor, than the screensaver only shows on that monitor.

3 Monitors

[eduzaka]

Been bothering me a while:

Mac OS 13.4 (22F66) Apple M1 Max 2021

No matter the settings, I see a screensaver on my vertical monitor (only on the bottom half) If I set the rotation to 0 on the vertical monitor, than the screensaver only shows on that monitor.

3 Monitors

Same configuration, same problem here.

[theeddie]

Im having the same issues, ive tried HDR none HDR. about 10% of the screen savers actually work

[glouel]

Again, my weekly recap, the bug is with macOS and all 3rd party screensavers, we're waiting for Apple to fix the issue.

• 3+ monitors will work around 5% of the time and fail otherwise.
• 2 monitors will work around 95% of the time and fail otherwise (* for most people, I've had one report on discord of things being more wrong for someone, we don't know why)

13.2.X doesn't exhibit the bug. 13.4 has the results above. 13.5beta1 doesn't improve things.

Hopes on beta2. I understand it's an annoying bug for a lot of people, I feel your pain, but there's nothing more I can do at the moment despite my best efforts, this is on Apple.

[DSBlackHeart]

System Version: macOS 13.5 (22G5038d)

Still not working, Why do I get the feeling Apple will release a new OS before they fix this...

[glouel]

System Version: macOS 13.5 (22G5038d)

Still not working, Why do I get the feeling Apple will release a new OS before they fix this...

At this point that's a pretty safe bet.

It's also my yearly prediction of "surely this year Apple will introduce the new Screen Saver SDK using .appex"

So keep an eye out on monday, this may be the most important Apple news out of WWDC, at least for me ;)

[Turbotailz]

Updating to 13.4 fixed this problem for me when using 2 screens, but when I use 3 the screensaver only appears on 1.

[panosru]

Oh ¢r@p! If 13.4 fixed the use of screens but not 3+, I guess I'll have to wait for macOS v16 with 7 monitors 🤣

[asportnoy]

Yep, Aerial built into macOS Sonoma

[glouel]

So that wasn't the screen saver news I was hoping for 😅

I'm waiting to install Sonoma to see what they did with their version, it will be interesting to see what they are doing and if it justifies continuing development of Aerial.

Edit : Still not available here. I've heard it's pretty basic regarding options, so I'll likely try and push Aerial towards a more full featured option. Will keep you posted.

[xmddmx]

Downloading 14 beta now - would it make sense to start some new threads for Sonoma issues?

[glouel]

Yep please report anything Sonoma related in a new issue, unless it's this specific one I guess.

[xmddmx]

For initial Sonoma 14.0 beta 1 testing, please see https://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1305

[xmddmx]

Has anyone tested 13.5 beta 2 (which was released 31 May 2023) ?

Looks like I tested 13.5 beta 1, but missed beta 2, and now that I'm testing 14.0 beta, I can't seem to go backwards.

[DSBlackHeart]

I am using : Version 13.5 Beta (22G5038d) Still does not work, I am going to try Sonoma, see if it works. I will advise :)

[glouel]

I took the opportunity to talk to DTS at Apple about the issue tonight, here's the latest update I can share :

• engineering is aware of the issue, it's an issue on their end
• because they are changing things (you know...), and it's wwdc time, they can't promise a resolution date
• they are committed to fixing the issue

Last thing, if you are affected as a user of Aerial, I was told it was a good idea to contact https://getsupport.apple.com as this can help bugs get prioritised. So please consider doing so. If you do so, I would recommend mentioning that you have the issue with multiple 3rd party screen savers.

Edit :

Has anyone tested 13.5 beta 2 (which was released 31 May 2023) ?

Missed your comment but yes, same story with beta2 as beta1.

[glouel]

No change in 13.5beta4 FYI.

[brianburkett]

Just chiming in that this is a major issue for OLED displays.

I run a triple monitor setup, and just noticed for the first time yesterday that this bug is causing burn-in on my OLED panel.

I run 3x 4k monitors. The main monitor is an OLED display.

Every single time, the screensaver only shows in lower lefthand corner on the OLED screen (covering ~60% of the screen), while the other 2 displays are blank.

This bug now has caused a noticeable burn-in on the main monitor (fortunately fixed via a pixel refreshing tool on the monitor) — but if you have an OLED, be weary of this issue until it's resolved to avoid an expensive problem.

[glouel]

Can anyone test 13.5beta5 and get back to us ? Based on some activity on my radars, I believe the fix may have been implemented in that beta, but would need confirmation. Thanks a lot !

[royvella]

Not seeng beta5 to give it a go… only beta2 actually. On Jul 10, 2023 at 13:29 -0400, Guillaume Louel @.***>, wrote:

Can anyone test 13.5beta5 and get back to us ? Based on some activity on my radars, I believe the fix may have been implemented in that beta, but would need confirmation. Thanks a lot ! — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or unsubscribe. You are receiving this because you are subscribed to this thread.Message ID: @.***>

[glouel]

I sent my message early, it may take an hour to be available, until it propagates through their CDNs, but yeah it's beta5.

In any case, you should definitely NOT be stuck on beta 2 !

[spawnofbill]

Can anyone test 13.5beta5 and get back to us ? Based on some activity on my radars, I believe the fix may have been implemented in that beta, but would need confirmation. Thanks a lot !

Downloading now on my secondary machine, will let you know.

[zeromhz]

Can anyone test 13.5beta5 and get back to us ? Based on some activity on my radars, I believe the fix may have been implemented in that beta, but would need confirmation. Thanks a lot !

Downloading now on my secondary machine, will let you know.

The issue appears to be fixed on 13.5beta5!

[glouel]

The issue appears to be fixed on 13.5beta5!

A well deserved, FINALLY!

This has been a few hectic months, I can't wait for 13.5 to go final so that I no longer have to give support, at least twice a day, to people about that issue 🎉

[DSBlackHeart]

Great news :) , Beta 2 was mentioned earlier and destroyed my I-Mac, I am currently back in Monterey. I was waiting to hear we have something stable. Thanks

[gman-wa]

Can anyone test 13.5beta5 and get back to us ? Based on some activity on my radars, I believe the fix may have been implemented in that beta, but would need confirmation. Thanks a lot !

Downloading now on my secondary machine, will let you know.

The issue appears to be fixed on 13.5beta5!

Confirmed - fixed for me on 13.5beta5. Also other screensavers like Padbury Clock.

[DSBlackHeart]

Just curious how long till the GM/Production version is released ? If known Also do you guys think this will be the same fix to make Sonoma work or is that a different issue / animal

[glouel]

@DSBlackHeart

GM : I would expect soon, it's likely the last beta in this cycle.

Sonoma : Totally different beast, they broke/rewrote everything, see the other thread for more details : https://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1305

It's likely they broke Ventura in preparation for Sonoma. But Sonoma breaks things so so so much more profoundly, it's a whole different situation. It's early though.

Edit: 13.5 RC is out, the long nightmare will soon be over 😭

[DSBlackHeart]

Kinda what I thought, thanks for the quick reply, I was curious because Sonoma destroyed my I-Mac so I am back on Monterey for now, I was waiting for a Stable Ventura or Sonoma

Awesome to hear though

[patrickschaper]

OMG... 13.5 actually fixes the problem 🥳

[glouel]

I kinda missed it was released yesterday, I'll finally close this and keep it pinned so people can find it.

Again everyone, thanks for your patience and understanding, this was not a fun last few months 😩

Now, let's see if Sonoma gets fixed 😅

[jiclark]

Thanks Guillaume! Hang in there!!On Jul 25, 2023, at 7:06 AM, Guillaume Louel @.***> wrote: Closed #1286 as completed.

—Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or unsubscribe.You are receiving this because you were mentioned.Message ID: @.***>

[JohnHales]

So happy this is finally resolved! Thanks for all who pushed it with Apple!

John

Sent from John's iPad. Please excuse any typos.

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From: jiclark @.> Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 8:23:24 AM To: JohnCoates/Aerial @.> Cc: John Hales @.>; Comment @.> Subject: Re: [JohnCoates/Aerial] Screen Savers broken function on 2+ monitor system in Ventura 13.3 beta (FB12023530) (Issue #1286)

Thanks Guillaume! Hang in there!!On Jul 25, 2023, at 7:06 AM, Guillaume Louel @.***> wrote: Closed #1286 as completed.

—Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or unsubscribe.You are receiving this because you were mentioned.Message ID: @.***>

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHubhttps://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1286#issuecomment-1649943360, or unsubscribehttps://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AQHYMOFDOHTH333OYHGI36DXR7JFZANCNFSM6AAAAAAVMG4UTA. You are receiving this because you commented.Message ID: @.***>

[Retroghost-X]

Well done for sticking with it!

I confirm fixed on 13.5 on all my Macs, multiscreen beauty returns once again!

Great stuff...

On 25 Jul 2023, at 17:58, John Hales @.***> wrote:

So happy this is finally resolved! Thanks for all who pushed it with Apple!

John

Sent from John's iPad. Please excuse any typos.

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From: jiclark @.> Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2023 8:23:24 AM To: JohnCoates/Aerial @.> Cc: John Hales @.>; Comment @.> Subject: Re: [JohnCoates/Aerial] Screen Savers broken function on 2+ monitor system in Ventura 13.3 beta (FB12023530) (Issue #1286)

Thanks Guillaume! Hang in there!!On Jul 25, 2023, at 7:06 AM, Guillaume Louel @.***> wrote: Closed #1286 as completed.

—Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or unsubscribe.You are receiving this because you were mentioned.Message ID: @.***>

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHubhttps://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1286#issuecomment-1649943360, or unsubscribehttps://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AQHYMOFDOHTH333OYHGI36DXR7JFZANCNFSM6AAAAAAVMG4UTA. You are receiving this because you commented.Message ID: @.***> — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/JohnCoates/Aerial/issues/1286#issuecomment-1650203055, or unsubscribe https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/A77DBRLEO7ORYQ2TN7UQ363XR73LPANCNFSM6AAAAAAVMG4UTA. You are receiving this because you were mentioned.

[eduzaka]

Yes! Working again! 🔝

[RoyRao2333]

Well, I don't want to spoil the fun... But it still occasionally happens on 13.5...

Using HMDI 2.1 cable with 2K screen.