Official KallistiOS Logo

[gyrovorbis]

I'm creating this issue to capture the urgent matter of us needing an official logo for the KallistiOS project. We're really active and are doing very cool stuff publicly these days, and I think the fact we don't have a logo on the repo, README, Doxygen, etc is something that should be addressed. Also in surveying other indie SDKs and toolkits, we seem to be the only one without one.

I'm adding this issue to the v2.1.0 milestone, as hopefully we can get one and resolve this issue before the next official release. Would be pretty nice to have a shiny new logo to go along with the new features, bugfixes, performance improvements, and modularization!

[darcagn]

Just to get this out of the way...

The project name is a nod to Discordianism, the mock religion dedicated to Eris, the goddess of strife and discord in mythology. Eris, being a troublemaker, was disinvited to the wedding of Peleus and Thetis, and in retaliation, threw a golden apple inscribed "Kallisti" (Greek for "to the fairest") into the wedding. Hera, Athena, and Aphrodite then fought over which of of them deserves the apple and the title. Zeus, wanting to stay out of it, asked Paris, prince of Troy, to arbitrate the disagreement. Each goddess attempted to bribe Paris with a reward for choosing her. Paris chose Aphrodite, which won him the love of the most beautiful woman on Earth, who was Helen, Queen of Sparta. The Greeks sailed to Troy to retrieve her, starting the 10 year Trojan War.

Therefore, we should either pick a logo that represents the theme of Discordianism, or abandon the project's name altogether and start with a different concept. The name of the project is what was inscribed on the golden apple so it really shouldn't be hard to come up with something related to that concept. There are already established images and concepts related to Discordianism to work with.

"Hand of Eris" symbol

modified "Hand of Eris" symbol which is used by NASA to represent the dwarf planet Eris

an illustration of the Apple of Discord

another

the Sacred Chao symbol

[kilgariff]

Here's one idea based on a few principles:

• Must look clear in silhouette, scaled down, and at low resolutions.
• Can't be too similar to an existing logo or brand.
• Can be used to evoke the Dreamcast, but can be adapted to other platforms.

This is just a rough version. The final one would need cleaned up with better colouring & shading, but it gives an idea.

[ianmicheal]

[gyrovorbis]

Should we add this to the repo somewhere? lol.

[andressbarajas]

Link is not working for me

[gyrovorbis]

Also @ianmicheal gave me this:

static const char * vmu_kos_xpm =
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++..+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++..+++....++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++....+++..++..+++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++..++++++....++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++++..++++++...++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++++++..++++..+++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++++++++......+++++++++.......+++++++++"
"+++++++++++++++++++++..++++................+++++"
"++++++++...........++..++......+++++++++......++"
"++++++.....................+++++++++++++++++...."
"+++.....+++++++++++......+++++++++++++++++++++.."
"+.....+++++++++++++++..+++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"..++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
".+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++++++..++++..++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++...+..++++++++.+.+++.+.+++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++.++.+++++++++++.+++++.+++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++.+.++++..+.++++.+++++.+++..+++....+....+..+++"
"+++..++++.+.+.+++.+.+++.+.+++.++.++.+++.++++.+++"
"+++.+.+++.++.++++.+.+++.+.+++.++.++.+++.++++.+++"
"+++.++.++.++.+.+.++.+..++.+.+.++.++.+++.+.++.+++"
"++...+..++..+.++.+++.+.+++.++..++..++++..+++..++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"+++++++++++......................+++++++++++++++"
"++++.........................................+++"
"+++.....+++++++++++++++++++++++++++........+++++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++"
"++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++";

I would've tried to PR it already, but I would prefer it get packed into an actual raw bitmap to not have it be 1.5KB of wasted memory (rather than 192B).

[darcagn]

I needed a logo to use to represent KallistiOS in my Rust work, so I made this AI generated one. I think it's pretty decent, so I figured I'd post it here.

Original: Trimmed with transparent background (probably could do better going over it again for smoother edges): Use with Rust:

[DC-SWAT]

Removed background by macOS quick actions. I'm not sure it's better or worse, I uploaded just in case.

[gyrovorbis]

Removed background by macOS quick actions. I'm not sure it's better or worse, I uploaded just in case.

So what do we think of this one? It looks like we were zeroing in on an Apple design with a K in it... What do we think of this revision?

...I was going to have one of our VMU developers make us a VMU icon once we've decided on it. lol.

[DC-SWAT]

I think we can do better. Maybe replay the criteria a little, replace gold with yellow, made it in a flat design, render "K" letter as a tree with apples or something else. I would stick to the principle of the Dreamcast logo, where there is a graphic element, and under it the full name KallistiOS.

Quickly rendered what I'm talking about:

[gyrovorbis]

What are we thinking here, guys? To be honest, I'm easy-going. I have liked some aspect of pretty much all of these and would totally use any of them. I'm just thinking that it would be a shame to not get one picked out in time for this big upcoming release!

[enfilade99]

Hey everyone, thought I would upload my vision for the KOS logo. I had 2 goals: make the logo feel dreamcasty and be able to reproduce the logo on the vmu.

I feel like I achieved that with this. Although I haven't made the actual vmu icon yet, I'm confident it won't be a problem.

This is the logo in its most basic form. Gradient, shadow and color can be added. Larger resolutions of course.

[andressbarajas]

Over all I like it! I understand the dreamcast triangle light on the bottom of the logo but not sure why they are 2 more instances of it making the logo look like it has horns.

[enfilade99]

Over all I like it! I understand the dreamcast triangle light on the bottom of the logo but not sure why they are 2 more instances of it making the logo look like it has horns.

Long answer: Well it's one large triangle if you allow your eyes to view it that way instead of 3 seperate triangles. But I was thinking triangles are an important design aspect. Look at your DC lid, the triangle lines continue all the way from the light to the back of the lid. This is what this was supposed to represent. Horns? Lol

Short answer: symmetry, it could spin 360 degrees as a load screen, ect

[enfilade99]

Oh yeah, I like logos that are more than meet the eye as well.

The logo itself spells KOS if you can find it ;)

[andressbarajas]

Oh okay. Thanks for the explanation. Great job :^)

[enfilade99]

Here's a variant for example and any font can be thrown in there

[enfilade99]

in this one i was thinking the white circle instead of black makes it look like more of a swirl

[Kazade]

Over all I like it! I understand the dreamcast triangle light on the bottom of the logo but not sure why they are 2 more instances of it making the logo look like it has horns.

Long answer: Well it's one large triangle if you allow your eyes to view it that way instead of 3 seperate triangles. But I was thinking triangles are an important design aspect. Look at your DC lid, the triangle lines continue all the way from the light to the back of the lid. This is what this was supposed to represent. Horns? Lol

Short answer: symmetry, it could spin 360 degrees as a load screen, ect

This is amazing! Could you do a version where the top triangles are outlined? They seem quite heavy in comparison to the bottom one.

[enfilade99]

Over all I like it! I understand the dreamcast triangle light on the bottom of the logo but not sure why they are 2 more instances of it making the logo look like it has horns.

Long answer: Well it's one large triangle if you allow your eyes to view it that way instead of 3 seperate triangles. But I was thinking triangles are an important design aspect. Look at your DC lid, the triangle lines continue all the way from the light to the back of the lid. This is what this was supposed to represent. Horns? Lol Short answer: symmetry, it could spin 360 degrees as a load screen, ect

This is amazing! Could you do a version where the top triangles are outlined? They seem quite heavy in comparison to the bottom one.

yes, anything can be changed. i did this variation the other night

[darcagn]

My issues with this logo are

• It's highly Dreamcast-oriented, when we have voted to keep KallistiOS platform-agnostic and Quzar started some of the work to resurrect the GBA arch support
• Most importantly to me, it in no way honors the Discordian namesake of the project

We've been over this in chat many times since we've started this logo business, so I'll say my piece one last time here and go away: For what my opinion is worth, I strongly reject any logo that does not honor the namesake of the project.

[enfilade99]

It's all good guys I'll repurpose the logo for a Dreamcast project ✌️

[enfilade99]

My issues with this logo are

• It's highly Dreamcast-oriented, when we have voted to keep KallistiOS platform-agnostic and Quzar started some of the work to resurrect the GBA arch support
• Most importantly to me, it in no way honors the Discordian namesake of the project

We've been over this in chat many times since we've started this logo business, so I'll say my piece one last time here and go away: For what my opinion is worth, I strongly reject any logo that does not honor the namesake of the project.

Ironically you are wrong though. Unbeknownst to me, my logo was designed exactly like this discordian symbol. Especially if I flip the triangle vertically.

Just thought that was an interesting coincidence to share with the group

[darcagn]

Except that's the Eye of Providence, a symbol of of the Illuminati, who strive for world control and are in opposition to Discordianism.

[enfilade99]

I woke up with an idea the other morning and after many revisions later I finally felt like I had something worth sharing. This time the goal was:

• honor the KallistiOS heritage
• add a sprinkle of dreamcast vibe
• be able to recreate the logo on a vmu (this version might be too detailed to recreate it exactly as shown)

@darcagn

[enfilade99]

revision 7

[enfilade99]

[DC-SWAT]

Nice boobs :D

[enfilade99]

Nice boobs :D

Hahahaha omg 🤦 I've already edited the hand of Eris symbol so it looks closer to the original (didn't want to copy and paste the original so I drew my own) but now that you mention it .... Maybe it needs to be rotated 90 degrees lol

Also kinda looks like ass cheeks 😂

[DC-SWAT]

Also kinda looks like ass cheeks 😂

Exactly, I just choose a slightly more modest option :D

[sizious]

Okay ppl, what’s the status regarding this one? Should we move forward for 2.1.0 release?

[DC-SWAT]

I'm in favor of taking the logo from the 2000s :) Just remove "dreamcast homebrew".

[enfilade99]

I moved on to other projects due to the lack of communication/engagement in this group. Feel free to use any of the logos that I created above. However I don't give permission to use the logos if they are going to be altered.

I will make alterations to the logos by request.

[DC-SWAT]

I moved on to other projects due to the lack of communication/engagement in this group. Feel free to use any of the logos that I created above. However I don't give permission to use the logos if they are going to be altered.

I will make alterations to the logos by request.

It's not about communication/engagement. There's just no real understanding of what it should be. That's what makes it harder. It's easier to run away, of course ;)

[enfilade99]

XD watch the comments poor in now.

I disagree it takes very little effort to communicate with collaborators on a project such as this. And what do you mean there is no understanding of what the logo should be? Darc made that perfectly clear. Yet still no feedback.

[DC-SWAT]

XD watch the comments poor in now.

I disagree it takes very little effort to communicate with collaborators on a project such as this. And what do you mean there is no understanding of what the logo should be? Darc made that perfectly clear. Yet still no feedback.

Don't wait from him, wait from many. Your variants are not bad, but apparently many want something else.

[enfilade99]

And that's totally fine, I appreciate you letting me know

[darcagn]

Darc made that perfectly clear. Yet still no feedback.

Well, I did say in a prior reply 😜 :

I'll say my piece one last time here and go away

The problem is that the only KOS staff that I believe have any complete authority on this topic are BlueCrab, the current lead maintainer who is sort of on hiatus while completing his PhD, and kayateia, the project's original founder who is no longer actively involved with the project. Neither have chimed in here.

So I am simply a contributor with an education background and passions in both Computer Science and Classical Studies/Greek/Latin -- this project is both -- making me very opinionated about honoring the project's namesake. The original iteration of KallistiOS was for x86, it supported multiple platforms even though only the DC build is supported right now, and the staff last year voted to keep the project structured to return to multi-platform support in the future, so it bummed me out to see all these highly DC-specific logos being picked, but I feel alone in that, so that's why I kinda chose to check out...

Anyway, my votes would be for either the last of your logos or the golden apple K logo. I'm concerned about how any of these logos might translate to a 48x32 VMU screen though.

[enfilade99]

Bluecrab? Wow I didn't know that. I've had positive interactions with him in the past. He was so awesome when I needed help with my PSO save data.

I'm quite experienced with vmu icons. And I'm pretty confident I could reproduce the logos I made. I've done some complex stuff like faces ect. The apple with the k in the middle would be the easiest to reproduce.

Since your favorite is the last variation I made I will look at the logo again and see if any ideas pop up. Perhaps I will touch up the hand of Eris symbol at the least.

And then I will do the vmu icon for that logo and the apple with a k in the middle just to show you guys and to have something for comparison

[darcagn]

Sounds great! Thanks!

[enfilade99]

You are welcome! I started on this tonight and will upload as soon as I can

[enfilade99]

So while working of course another idea spawned in my head, so here is one more variation to consider. And these are the key points and my thoughts:

• I wanted to somehow incorporate an apple inside of a K

• Apple is shaped like a moon because I thought it went well with the Eris story, the moon being a symbol of "feminity, darkness, mystery, renewal & transitions"

• A bite is taken out of the apple

• The Hand of Eris symbol is "etched" inside of the apple

• The stem of the apple extrudes from the Hand of Eris symbol, which is the heart and core of the apple

• leaves coming off of the stem to make it feel like an apple

• little teeny tiny splash of Dreamcast hidden meaning = The small triangle which lines up with the Hand of Eris symbol to also form a larger triangle, which is pointed to the right like the ntsc Dreamcast jewel case releases

I believe because of the deep history this project has with Dreamcast, that it should be shown in the symbol. And in the example below I tried to hit the right amount of feel.

edit: a variation of this could be just turning the logo 90 degrees and getting rid of the stem/leaves

[enfilade99]

2 more variations to consider :) and now I will focus on the vmu icons

[enfilade99]

[DC-SWAT]

Filled (golden) apple looks the best on VMU LCD.

[gyrovorbis]

so I've kind of refrained from voting on anything, because I am honestly just wanting a logo so badly that I will accept anything we can agree on... but... in the interest of moving things along...

Personally, I've loved everything that has been presented from @enfilade99. I'm not really of the opinion that our logo can't be DC-centric or DC-related, even if KOS itself gets ported to other platforms, as that is its origin and where it started from... I think a GC game booting up with a little KOS logo looking Dreamcast-y is actually kind of cool, but that's just me.

I also do like the designs with the Apple and more focused on the mythology as well, so it's fine if we don't want to go with something Dreamcast-y.

Sounded like maybe everyone was leaning towards the golden apple? What do you guys think?

[LobotomyTH]

I like the idea of having an icon and a logo, both separate in design but referential to each other. The first abstract Dreamcast style example of the last three @enfilade99 provided, or the "Circle-around-a-Triangle" one he made, would look better on a 2D splash screen. The Golden Apple would look excellent as a VMU icon, Save File icon, KOS' go-to example "teapot/monkey head" 3D mesh, and a smaller bottom corner symbol, like the one that Esppiral mocked up for the GTA port splash screen.

Fact (opinion) is, gold isn't a good full screen color, unless you wanted to do something like have a spinning environment mapped 3D apple (a la the Nintendo 64 bootscreens), as it would be far more dynamic than merely a picture of the fruit itself. For a two-dimensional, solid background, full-screen image, I'd want to stick to a mostly flat, black, white/DC eggshell, and maybe the regional Dreamcast colors of orangered and blue. I really do love both the Abstract Dreamcasty designs, and the Apple, but I think both have their optimal use, and both ideas should be used.

As for the more Dreamcast-styled designs, I like seeing that paired with the Hand of Eris, rather than the Serif K, because serif fonts clash with the Dreamcast design language, but again, works well in the form of the apple, as serif fonts are derived from the Roman and Greek alphabets. If I could pick only one thing, I'd go with that.

[enfilade99]

I don't think I hit the nail on the head with any of these logos. The first one I created was the best but very dreamcast-y. As the last thing I try, I will see how that first logo translates to the vmu.

The golden apple translates very well to the vmu! So if this is the choice I will make some variations to the vmu icon I made and everyone can pick out the best one

[darcagn]

I like the first two in this comment. The other newer ones are too complicated IMO.

[enfilade99]