add hold key button to the AudioFileProcessor plugin

[Reaper10]

add hold key button so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume no matter how long it is. this way you can use lfo,filters,cutoff all loop mode buttons and reverse button,envelopes or anything you want so you don't need to the hold the keys donw yourself. without needing a midi clip to do it. the would be great for live keyboard players to make live soundscapes using samples.

[tresf]

Firstly, the AFP is changed in 1.1, so you should base your mockups on that.

Secondly, what do you mean by "autoplay"? I'm confused as to the desired functionality of this request. Can you explain further?

[mikobuntu]

"the audio file processor needs a autoplay button" Perhaps clicking on the waveform view would play the sample instead iirc this is the way FL handles it?

thanks Mikobuntu ;)

[diizy]

Why?

You can just click and hold any key on the onscreen piano, and it already does everything you describe... how would this be any different?

[tresf]

You can just click and hold any key on the onscreen piano, and it already does everything you describe... how would this be any different?

Oh... he wants a preview button? The piano roll does that for us and scales to all instrument plugins.

the only key that it works on is the one under the green box on the keyboard. every thing eles in audio file processor works with it.

Then use the green key (or just hit the "Y" on the keyboard). :)

If you feel there is something unintuitive about this, please explain so that we can discuss a general usability improvement. Otherwise, this will be closed as invalid.

-Tres

[tresf]

Note also, this instrument piano key press preview behavior is also consistent with our piano roll.

[Reaper10]

hope this helps

[Reaper10]

this way you don't need to hold the key it dose

[diizy]

On 12/01/2014 07:24 PM, Reaper10 wrote:

this way you don't need to hold the key it dose

Oh, so you want a switch of some kind.

I guess it could be marginally useful... but also potentially very annoying when the instrument window gets lost under other windows... also why only AFP? This seems to me like something that should be implemented rather in the instrument window, so it could be used for any instrument.

[Sti2nd]

Yeah, he wants to be able to use the B&B notes (which plays the whole sample regardless) in the Song Editor, with regular notes instead of placing drum notes.

[Reaper10]

this way you don't need to hold the key down it dose NOT A PREVIEW

[tresf]

Yeah, he wants to be able to use the B&B notes (which plays the whole sample regardless) in the Song Editor, with regular notes instead of placing drum notes.

Did he say this? I don't believe this to be true at all.

this way you don't need to hold the key it does

This sounds like he wants a stuck-key option, which may be useful when tweaking different aspects of a sample, but as @diizy said, this shouldn't be limited to the AFP, all instruments should be able to benefit from this.

That said, we do already have limited space on the instrument controls, so suggestions on where to place this would be good.

NOT A PREVIEW

Well, we're getting into semantics here, but it is a preview. Unless you have some other vision in mind, the only practical purpose would be for previewing your sample (preferably silenced when the window is closed), otherwise you'll have a bunch of hidden stuff playing at once.

-Tres

[tresf]

NOT A PREVIEW

If you are describing what @Sti2nd is saying then you are talking about better envelope controls as IIRC we currently have no way of holding the envelope forever. If this is your point, you have to be a bit clearer when describing these things and also note, that the loop points are indeffinite, so apply a bit of logic to your request and see if it will make sense. Holding a note for ever and ever is a tremendously terrible idea!! :)

[diizy]

On 12/01/2014 07:56 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:

Yeah, he wants to be able to use the B&B notes (which plays the
whole sample regardless) in the Song Editor, with regular notes
instead of placing drum notes.

Did he say this? I don't believe this to be true at all.

this way you don't need to hold the key it /does/

This sounds like he wants a stuck-key option, which may be useful when tweaking different aspects of a sample, but as @diizy https://github.com/diizy said, this shouldn't be limited to the AFP, all instruments should be able to benefit from this.

That said, we' have limited space on the instrument controls,

Not if we increase the instrument panel width to 350, which I've proposed for LMMS 2.0...

[tresf]

Not if we increase the instrument panel width

:+1:

[diizy]

On 12/01/2014 08:00 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:

NOT A PREVIEW

If you are describing what @Sti2nd https://github.com/Sti2nd is saying then you are talking about better envelope controls as IIRC we currently have no way of holding the envelope for ever.

Actually we do, but you need a sustain pedal (or a virtual MIDI-controller).

The only problem with it is that it doesn't support automation (as there is no model to automate) so the pedal state also can't be recorded in live play...

[tresf]

Actually we do, but you need a sustain pedal (or a virtual MIDI-controller).

Or could we set our envelope max values to relative values when dealing with certain instrument types?

[Reaper10]

the autoplay button should be able to use the B&B notes (which plays the whole sample regardless) in the Song Editor, with regular notes and you can use the loop and reverse modes buttons with it and the autoplay button turns autoplay on and off. the audio file processor is the only plugin that has it.

[diizy]

On 12/01/2014 08:10 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:

Actually we do, but you need a sustain pedal (or a virtual
MIDI-controller).

Or could we set our envelope max values relative to relative values when dealing with certain instrument types?

I'm not sure what you mean by this... temposyncable envelopes?

[tresf]

set our envelope max values to relative values when dealing with certain instrument types?

I'm not sure what you mean by this... temposyncable envelopes?

No, IIRC, the currently envelope will eventually drop off for very long samples. I could be wrong with this but I remember this being a limitation to the envelope length (AFP only)

[diizy]

On 12/01/2014 09:09 PM, Tres Finocchiaro wrote:

set our envelope max values to relative values
when dealing with certain instrument types?

    I'm not sure what you mean by this... temposyncable envelopes?

No, IIRC, the currently envelope will eventually drop off for very long samples. I could be wrong with this but I remember this being a limitation to the envelope length (AFP only)

Not that I know of... I mean, if you use sustain. Decay/release etc. of course have limited lengths...

[Sti2nd]

if you use sustain. Decay/release etc. of course have limited lengths...

But why mention that when you want to play the sample to the end. From noteOn to the end of the sample = the length of the sample (or length between loop points). Are the B&B notes using a method of long hold instead?

Understanding what he is asking about? :)

[tresf]

Understanding what he is asking about? :)

No idea. I think that is the problem. He says in his original bug report "as long as the button is pushed" which is ambiguous. Is this a button or a check-box? Is this just for preview, or a setting for playback?

This leaves you to speculate, me to speculate and the conversation to go off on default envelope settings which may be unrelated to this request. :sob:

[Reaper10]

envelopes are independent form autoplay button is not a sustain pedal it's a stuck-key option

[Sti2nd]

He says in his original bug report

Wow, after reading that (original bug report) I am really confused... I still think I understand. When he says "adding a autoplay button to audio file processor" he means "a continue to play to the end of the sample" -button, as he supports with the explanation: "a autoplay button that plays the sample all the way through".

When he is talking about play while holding the note, he doesn't mean that the user will hold this key, but are picturing what LMMS will do to achieve this effect. LMMS will hold the key down until the sample has been played to its end. "theautoplay button holdes the key under the green box on the keyboard as long as autoplay is on playing sample."

the only key that it works on is the one under the green box on the keyboard. every thing eles in audio file processor works with it.

No idea what this is supposed to mean, but maybe he is thinking ahead of the original request. I suggest changing the headline to "Play to End -button in AFP", a button which when turned on sends the noteOff signal only when reached the end of the sample.

[tresf]

"Play to End -button in AFP", a button which when turned on sends the noteOff signal only when reached the end of the sample.

The problem though is that this is a mythological button that only exists in fairy tales because in many cases, there is no end when it comes to looping (looping is a requirement in his original request).

But he's not a 3rd party to this conversation, so he should really step in and explain instead of posting confusing sentences like this, which I don't think directly address any of the questions that came before it.

envelopes are independent form autoplay button is not a sustain pedal it's a stuck-key option

Perhaps a real-world example (what you are trying to achieve) would be better than a hypothetical example (what you claim you want) because I can't make heads or tails of this.

-Tres

[Sti2nd]

there is no end when it comes to looping

True, that is just not possible.

[Umcaruje]

he means "a continue to play to the end of the sample" -button, as he supports with the explanation: "a autoplay button that plays the sample all the way through".

When he is talking about play while holding the note, he doesn't mean that the user will hold this key, but are picturing what LMMS will do to achieve this effect. LMMS will hold the key down until the sample has been played to its end. "theautoplay button holdes the key under the green box on the keyboard as long as autoplay is on playing sample."

You can achieve that by dragging the release all the way up in the Volume Envelope. Really long samples may cut off, but it works for percussion really well. I use that when I fool around with finger drumming while using my KMI QuNeo.

[musikBear]

cant see any substantional benefit in an autoplay-feature -imo, not an enhancement

[tresf]

not an enhancement

I still don't understand what he wants... If @Reaper10 can't explain this and other requests clearly, they will be closed out as invalid, sorry.

[curlymorphic]

Hmmm. Maybe I have an idea of what is being requested. When messing around with synths I sometimes place a weight on a key, to keep the note substaned, then just play with the dials, great for making atmospheric sounds. maybe this is a request for a digital version of this.

@Reaper10 Maybe you could post some video of what you want being done, on another piece of software or hardware.

[musikBear]

When messing around with synths I sometimes place a weight on a key, to keep the note substaned

..but, just insert n notes in piano-roll, and set it to play -you can manipulate any dial in any ui, and listen to the result -easy-peasy And you can make short long notes.. chords,, ..anything Cant understand this need :question: (or led-shots on keybd, for that matter :p

[curlymorphic]

..but, just insert n notes in piano-roll, and set it to play -you can manipulate any dial in any ui, and listen to the result -easy-peasy.

I agree in the digital world where sequencing is easy i would find this redundant.

or led-shots on keybd, for that matter :p

Hardware synth, with no sequencer or midi . korg ms10 was what i was referring to.

[Reaper10]

just improve envelopes so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume

[diizy]

On 12/03/2014 08:26 PM, Reaper10 wrote:

just improve env so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume

You already can.

[Reaper10]

not long ones

[tresf]

Reaper10 changed the title from adding a autoplay button to all pugins to mprove envelopes an hour ago

Oh that's much better. :laughing:

@Reaper10 I truly believe what you are looking to accomplish is understandable, but somehow you can't seem to explain it. Perhaps you should go back through this thread and answer the questions you've been asked rather than making a bad bug title even worse. :+1:

[Reaper10]

add hold key button so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume no matter how long it is. this way you can use lfo,filters,cutoff all loop mode buttons and reverse button,envelopes or anything you want so you don't need to the hold the keys donw yourself. without needing a midi clip to do it. the would be great for live keyboard players to make live soundscapes using samples.

[Reaper10]

or would help for all plugins to have it.

[tresf]

@Reaper10 Please offer explanations when you close out bugs if the reasons for closing are not obvious.

[Reaper10]

I tried to open it in a new one and make it easy erto understand. https://github.com/LMMS/lmms/issues/1398

[tresf]

I tried to open it in a new one and make it easy erto understand.

If you want to make it easier to understand, please do so in this thread. I still don't know what you are looking to do here from an enhancement perspective.

[Reaper10]

add hold key button so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume no matter how long it is. this way you can use lfos,filters,cutoff all loop mode buttons and reverse button,envelopes or anything you want so you don't need to the hold the keys donw yourself. without needing a midi clip to do it. the would be great for live keyboard players to make live soundscapes using samples. is that better?

[tresf]

is that better?

No, not really (Envelope does what you are describing already... do you understand envelope?). This bug report is a lost cause. If you can't get the devs to understand what you want, then the devs can't help, I'm sorry.

[Reaper10]

I tried to use the Envelope in all Envelope settings to try to play a long sample without the volume of the sample fadeing away without needing to hold the keys down myself and it didn't work. So can you just add hold key button so you can play all of the sample without any changing the volume no matter how long it is. this way you can use LFOs, filters, cutoff all loop mode buttons and reverse button, Envelope or anything you want so you don't need to hold the keys down yourself. without needing a midi clip to do it. the would be great for live keyboard players to make live soundscapes using samples.

[Sti2nd]

I tried to use to the Envelope in all setting to try to play long samples and it didn't work.

Why didn't you say that??? You are supposed to use SampleTrack to play long sample, but you can use AFP and make really long notes instead.