Open theloras opened 6 years ago
GuybrushGit
commented
6 years ago The patch note states "this talent is now applied", meaning before 2.1.0 it didn't apply.
Could it be something that once worked in vanilla, then they broke it and then fixed it in 2.1.0? Maybe, but need evidence.
theloras
commented
6 years ago full disclosure here - i honestly dont know if imp sor scaled with spell dmg or not in vanilla i merely looked at what the evidence stated and then looked at what is listed under the "Effect" for the vanilla version and compared it to the TBC one in the end i could be wrong and it never did scale but hopefully we can get some answers from blizzard
theloras
commented
6 years ago The theory that Killerduki and I have regarding the 2.1 patch notes is this:
Improved Seal of Righteousness: The percentage increase in damage from this talent is now applied after all bonuses from items and effects which increase your spell damage. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/patch-notes/2-1-0
Because they specifically state "all bonuses from items and effects" rather than just spell damage from gear.
fidbugs
commented
6 years ago I think there is misconception about interpretation of 2.1 patch notes.
First of all regarding context - we have "A Guide to Paladin Tanking | 3/13/2006 2:52:11 PM PST" which states that it should be applied after spell power is accounted. That alone is quite indicative of correct behavior.
To strengthen that claim, lets take look at talents like mage "Piercing Ice" or warlock "Improved Curse of Agony" - they both take in base spell + spell damage than apply x% increase. If it was other way around those talents would basically be worthless.
Now we can for sake of analogy use numerous warrior, paladin talents that increase damage by x%(Two hand weapon specialization, Dual Wield Specialization, One-Hand Weapon Specialization, etc.). Saying that they should only apply to base damage, disregarding attack power bonus from gear - is same saying Improved SoR should only increase base damage, disregarding spell damage from gear.
In other words, if talents like above mentioned worked as Improved SoR is (not)working now - they would not be used, nor would be any kind of significant improvement.
Now we can look at patch 2.1 with more clarity and context. TBC brought some new abilities, items and talents on the table, that did not exist in vanilla - such as:
"Holy Guidance" - Increases your spell damage and healing by 7% of your total Intellect.
Reasoning for patch 2.1 fix is precisely talents, items and abilities like that, that were overlooked and not incorporated in "old" vanilla talent "Improved SoR".
Thus, text from patch notes should be interpreted in notion of indications we have from old vanilla talents and new TBC "items and abilities". Which would not lead us to conclusion that Improved SoR was not taking into account spell damage from gear at all until then(patch 2.1), but, on contrary, was taking into account spell damage all along but now incorporates new talents and abilities into calculation.
All that being said, with all indications from vanilla and correctly interpreted patch 2.1 notes - i can firmly claim that "Improved SoR" should take into calculation spell damage from gear before being applied.
vanilla-reforged
commented
6 years ago This should be fixed by now?
vanilla-reforged
commented
6 years ago "now applied after all bonuses from items and effects which increase your spell damage."
If it wasn't what Theloras described it would be simply be written as ".. scales now with spell damage"
vanilla-reforged
commented
6 years ago Still waiting for an Update on this?
Please name one Talent im the game which only affects the base damage of an ability.
An answer would be much appreciated.
theloras
commented
6 years ago well this is how it looks on the Classic Demo - at least as far as the data mining from Wowhead:
Effect Apply Aura: Modifies Spell Effectiveness (8) Value: 14% https://classic.wowhead.com/spell=20332/improved-seal-of-righteousness
I had posted this on the original LH github but wanted to repost here with some additional information:
Re: A Guide to Paladin Tanking | 3/13/2006 2:52:11 PM PST
Improved Seal of Righteousness - Tier Two: 5 Talent Points
Increases the damage done by your Seal of Righteousness by 15%. Our basic holy damage generator and our main proactive ability to hold aggro. While an additional 15% may only add 6-7 damage with a fast weapon at level 60, thats an additional 6-7 of holy damage thats helping you generate threat and keep that mobs attention. Also, the 15% is factored in after +spell damage is calculated, meaning that this bonus can potentially be much greater.
http://web.archive.org/web/20060531113342/http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com:80/thread.aspx?fn=wow-paladin&t=929373&p=1&tmp=1#post929373
@GuybrushGit had originally asked for additional evidence before so this morning I decided to look at the actual Effect listed for the spell in the database and compare it from Vanilla to TBC when it was confirmed without a doubt that it did in fact scale:
Improved Seal of Righteousness: The percentage increase in damage from this talent is now applied after all bonuses from items and effects which increase your spell damage. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/patch-notes/2-1-0
Vanilla Talent Improved Seal of Righteousness Rank 5 Instant Increases the damage done by your Seal of Righteousness and Judgement of Righteousness by 15%. Effect #1 (6) Apply Aura #108: Add % Modifier (8) http://classicdb.ch/?spell=20332
TBC Talent Improved Seal of Righteousness Rank 5 Instant Increases the damage done by your Seal of Righteousness and Judgement of Righteousness by 15%. Effect #1 (6) Apply Aura #108: Add % Modifier Value: 15 https://tbc-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?spell=20332
Based on this assumption, I asked a very knowledgeable Dev friend if he could take a look at this and to tell me if I was missing something - his reply - "I dont see any difference on those two pages, apart from the value of the modifier (8 vs 15 as you said)."