Mikusch / friendlyfire

A plugin that fixes mp_friendlyfire in Team Fortress 2
https://forums.alliedmods.net/showthread.php?t=342166
GNU General Public License v3.0
16 stars 2 forks source link

Turns "friendly fire" into "teamless deathmatch" #17

Open 0n-s opened 2 months ago

0n-s commented 2 months ago

"Friendly fire" means (at least to my understanding) that you can damage your own teammates. Consequently I would expect, e.g. the sentry gun to not target teammates, but be able to damage teammates if they are in the way of its target.

I suppose this is more of a philosophical issue with the plugin, where what is meant here is actually "free for all teamless DM" & not "friendly fire", as this is only one instance…there's also:

Mikusch commented 2 months ago

This is a very subjective matter, but I've originally created this plugin for a FFA gamemode where the default friendly fire just wasn't good enough. I believe most people would not want to heal someone they are trying to fight with their crossbow, nor their dispenser to provide cover and healing/ammo to them. The use case of using it in a team-based gamemode while allowing your own teammates to shoot you hasn't come up. I'm also not opposed to making this configurable via a sm_friendlyfire_teammates_are_enemies convar similar to what CS:GO had, but I have a very busy life and can not really spend much time on maintaining all my plugins anymore.

0n-s commented 2 months ago

I believe most people would not want to heal someone they are trying to fight with their crossbow, nor their dispenser to provide cover and healing/ammo to them [in an FFA gamemode].

Completely agree. But then I would at least say the name of the mod is misleading, as detailed in the 1st post. Whether you'd like to change the mod to fit the name or change the name to fit the mod is your call, of course.

[Also, the game has been developed without friendly fire for most (all) of its life, so whether the crossbow should heal or damage teammates is one of those debates that will last your entire life; I would argue in favor of healing, in the interest of keeping things interesting]

The use case of using it in a team-based gamemode while allowing your own teammates to shoot you hasn't come up.

Not thoroughly surprised at that, TBQH (c.f. how CTF is "played" generally).

My usecase is just a standard Highlander match but with friendly fire, mostly as a fun experiment to see how it would change the balance of the game. Nothing too serious, but at least more technically interesting than DM, I would say.

I have a very busy life and can not really spend much time on maintaining all my plugins anymore.

Sure, no pressure.

Mikusch commented 1 month ago
  • Manmelter change
  • dispenser & teleporter change
  • crossbow change
  • spy cloak change
  • etc.

I would like to work on implementing the sm_friendlyfire_teammates_are_enemies convar. What else should it cover? I am not sure on some things e.g. should teammates be able to destroy friendly stickybombs, or to reflect friendly rockets?

0n-s commented 1 month ago

Thanks a lot for working on this!

What else should it cover?

I'm mostly going off of the README, so I'll mainly list stuff from there, TF2 wiki, & random stuff that comes to mind right now:

I am not sure on some things e.g. should teammates be able to destroy friendly stickybombs, or to reflect friendly rockets?

Yes, & yes.

I will test more mechanics in about a week, when I figure out how to control puppet bots.

But here are the general rules I suggest:

The intention of those rules is that: friendly fire does not fundamentally change the team-based nature of the game, it simply makes it so that you can hamper your team if you're not careful, but they're still a team, with the same tools at their disposal to buff each other & such (medigun, crossbow, extinguishing, Soldier banners, etc.).