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Monika-After-Story / MonikaModDev

DDLC fan mod to extend Monika
http://www.monikaafterstory.com/
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Topics that should be removed or rewritten #3803

Closed ThePotatoGuy closed 5 years ago

ThePotatoGuy commented 5 years ago

Add comments saying which topics should be removed/rewritten and why.

Include eventlabel.

AsuraShun commented 5 years ago

''Would you like to meet my girlfriend'' ''You're a murderer'' ''I'm breaking up with you'' I'm always nervous and afraid I'll click on then by accident, I hope these either get removed or separated from everything else

griffen2 commented 5 years ago

Monika mentions finding Shakespeare boring in one topic, the topic in question is "trying to fit in," then talks about Hamlet in another, the topic literally being called "Hamlet."

Delcos commented 5 years ago

Shakespeare is boring.

multimokia commented 5 years ago

monika_torment:

This topic is so open ended, I get it's a reference, but the fact that Monika says "The answer's not me, by the way." is straight up wrong for a lot of people. Also it's literally two lines.

monika_prisoner:

This topic doesn't really suit Monika's situation. Sure, she's imprisoned in the spaceroom, but it sounds like something she'd say only at a lower affection provided she's given up on ever coming here, but that also implies she's scared of the player given the affection level descriptions. Monika also says that if she's left alone in her world, she'd rather be deleted. I think it's reasonable to say that if she's scared of the player, then this should follow the same idea here. So overall doesn't make sense to bring this up.

monika_szs:

What even is this topic? This doesn't really even fit in MAS. Also, it's not really clear on what the joke of it even is.

monika_vnanalysis:

Needs some work to address other VNs which aren't romance stories. -- Doesn't really need it. Monika says most visual novels. Not all visual novels.

monika_god:

Ending menu (not religious) has a bit which seems like it should fit in the is religious subset. Also Eheheh -> Ehehe

monika_home_memories:

m 1eua "Maybe you've heard about me at school a few times? I'm pretty on top of things." This line is MC, not player.

monika_outfit:

Doesn't really work for if you have other outfits unlocked so we need to have a dialogue route if you've seen any outfits.

monika_panties:

m 3rksdlb "Someone who maybe stole your pen?" again, player/MC

monika_clones:

Mentions string theory, however string theory is in no way, shape, or form connected to anything in this topic.

monika_trolley:

892

MisterSimple commented 5 years ago

bye_prompt_sleep ,bye_going_to_sleep, bye_goodnight

Why use "I'm going to sleep" when "Goodbye" serves the same purpose? Granted, bye_goodnight only works between 20:00 and midnight, and bye_going_to_sleep between 21:00 and midnight. I think bye_going_to_sleep and bye_goodnight should be removed or integrated to bye_prompt_sleep.

Olliesama commented 5 years ago

Because there are greetings associated with I'm going to sleep that aren't associated with Goodbye.

MisterSimple commented 5 years ago

Fair enough, though the greetings are tied to affection groups, so if you're at normal+ you'll keep seeing the same one, and it gets old quickly imo.

Rai99 commented 5 years ago

The only time I've ever used the mean interactions was on April 1st last year. If we keep those topics, I think they might have some actual use on that day.

Rai99 commented 5 years ago

Ideally, I'd hope to favor rewrites than full removals, but I do know that's a bit of work and could take some time. Ok, everybody stop looking at me.

Olliesama commented 5 years ago

@Rai99 Regarding timeconcern, yeah...it has some issues in that it needed to be activated more often but doesn't. :<

Rai99 commented 5 years ago

I was tempted to mention the trick topic and self promote that one overhaul I did, but I decided against it since I'm more patient that some people we've seen. Also because I don't think there's anything wrong with it and whoever made it did a pretty nice job I think.

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

monika_eyecontact clashes with players_face.

that eye contact just needs to have the part about you staring into her eyes with the part about her staring into yours. maybe she can mention that she can't wait to be able to stare into your [colored] eyes if you've seen the appearance topic

multi listed most of the ones on my list.

Here's how i rewrote eye_contact for my bot:

Did you know that looking into someone’s eyes helps you fall in love? I read that in a study a few years ago, where participants had to maintain eye contact at a table with someone of the opposite sex. The longer they held eye contact, the more romantically attached they felt to the other person, even if they had nothing in common! It’s surprising, right? Even if eyes aren’t windows to the soul, we can see a lot more in them than we expect. Someday I hope to be able to stare into your eyes. In the meantime, I hope you enjoy looking into mine. Ehehe~

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

Monika mentions finding Shakespeare boring in one topic, the topic in question is "trying to fit in," then talks about Hamlet in another, the topic literally being called "Hamlet."

Just because she doesn't like shakespeare doesn't mean she can't quote it... haven't you ever done class assignments for someone you don't like?

jmwall24 commented 5 years ago

besides, she says she finds Hamlet interesting. she can not like Shakespeare in general and still like some of his work.

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

monika_ghost: m 1ekc "I mean, I was pretty scared being alone inside this game." m 1lksdlc "All by myself, uncertain if anything around me was real."

Should be reworded to something like: All by myself, knowing everything around me isn't real.

Since she was aware that everything around her wasn't real.

Also, monika_whispers - derandoms after a certain amount of time, but monika_ghost talks about sayori haunting monika, doesn't derandom. Need to hide the else part of the statement after a certain amount of time.

jmwall24 commented 5 years ago

monika_weary, the line about physical fatigue, while true, is worded as if you were asking her if she'd get physically tired of you, which doesn't make sense.

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

monika_ribbon clashes with player_face

m 1tku "I noticed that you were staring at my ribbon, [player]."

Replace with "Have you ever wondered why I wear this ribbon, [player]?

https://github.com/Monika-After-Story/MonikaModDev/pull/3805

TheSuperStu commented 5 years ago

I wouldn't be a fan of removing topics, since I would like Monika to be open to talk about varying interests. So rewrites, even if just simple stuff, would probably be more beneficial.

This might be more of a long term issue than something of a rewrite. The idea of how Monika addresses her situation with high school. Being in high school at the start is one of the base characteristics we have of her, so it makes sense for her to talk about it. But as time is spent with Monika, the idea of her being a high school student starts to seem out of place. Is the plan to have Monika forever stuck in high school since she states she doesn't really age? Maybe have to address the current setting how Monika is in the space room, being the act three part of the main game, where mostly everything else was seemingly deleted. For specifics on high school stuff, these two might just need a line or two changed as the topics themselves are fine for what they cover: monika_saved: she mentions doing things after school, but how its worded makes it seem like shes currently still in school. monika_college: she mentions that everyone her year is thinking about college, making it seem like shes currently still in school.

With those three mean topics that are often brought up, instead of just removing them, how about at a higher affection to just hide them from the topics? Maybe make it so you just don't lose any affection at higher affections? If someone is with Monika for a long time, those topic are out of place, unless they are used in a way that is seen as teasing/joking towards Monika.

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

monika_algernon this line in particular needs a check to see if monika.kill is true.

Also, should have a negative affection check to hide the line if she is beyond upset.

m 1lksdlc "There's something I'm afraid of..." m 1eka "Not losing you, of course. I know you won't leave me again." m 3euc "You see, I keep thinking about a short story I read, {i}Flowers for Algernon{/i}."

nitpick of a conservationist:

monika_spiders:

m 3ekc "[player], if you happen to get a really bad spider bite, with venom and all that..." m "You should really get medical attention as soon as possible." m 1eka "I don't want my sweetheart to get seriously injured by a small spider bite~" m "So be careful around dangerous-looking spiders, okay?"

instead of her saying be careful of dangerous looking spiders, i would recommend changing that to say: Maybe you should check to see what spiders in your area are dangerous and avoid them. seems like generally better advice

shades-of-teal commented 5 years ago

I have accidentally clicked topics like "do you want to meet my girlfriend?" and "You're a murderer!" and I felt really bad. If you want them to stay in the game, maybe make them so that at a certain affection level Monika plays along with your joke and then laughs (like the "kiss me" topic) or she maybe just says something like "even as a joke, that kind of hurt my feelings"

I feel like at a higher affection level Monika shouldn't have such a harsh reaction the first time, since most of us wouldn't ever click it on purpose.

AsuraShun commented 5 years ago

Or just remove them after getting to enamored stage

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

Same with I'm breaking up with you. I think they should be there initially, but it makes sense to hide them after a certain affection level has been reached.

Rai99 commented 5 years ago

For those mean interactions, I just want to see an April fools day special interaction with them.

Maybe at higher affection levels, she can check and confirm if you actually meant to click that. I had a mouse that sometimes double clicked on its own and one time, it clicked a topic I didn't want it to, so I can definitely see honest accidents.

Man0xMan0 commented 5 years ago

monika_torment:

This topic is so open ended, I get it's a reference, but the fact that Monika says "The answer's not me, by the way." is straight up wrong for a lot of people. Also it's literally two lines.

monika_prisoner:

This topic doesn't really suit Monika's situation. Sure, she's imprisoned in the spaceroom, but it sounds like something she'd say only at a lower affection provided she's given up on ever coming here, but that also implies she's scared of the player given the affection level descriptions. Monika also says that if she's left alone in her world, she'd rather be deleted. I think it's reasonable to say that if she's scared of the player, then this should follow the same idea here. So overall doesn't make sense to bring this up.

monika_szs:

What even is this topic? This doesn't really even fit in MAS. Also, it's not really clear on what the joke of it even is.

monika_vnanalysis:

Needs some work to address other VNs which aren't romance stories.

monika_god:

Ending menu (not religious) has a bit which seems like it should fit in the is religious subset. Also Eheheh -> Ehehe

monika_home_memories:

m 1eua "Maybe you've heard about me at school a few times? I'm pretty on top of things." This line is MC, not player.

monika_outfit:

Doesn't really work for if you have other outfits unlocked so we need to have a dialogue route if you've seen any outfits.

monika_panties:

m 3rksdlb "Someone who maybe stole your pen?" again, player/MC

monika_clones:

Mentions string theory, however string theory is in no way, shape, or form connected to anything in this topic.

monika_trolley:

892

monika_torment It's brevity makes it more powerful as it causes the player to reflect on what was said, and make their own conclusions. Did Monika change their nature, who they are? From what she said, it implies she believes the self can only be changed through the commitment to change by the self, as opposed to simply external factors, as impactful or important they may be. Maybe a compliment could be made in reference that de-randoms this in the pool, or changes it to reflect how the player feels. And also, having a very short topic is fine because it varies the random pool up a bit. monika_prisoner Maybe monika_how_soon can unlock this topic given the correct choices you mentioned. I'd say with that in place, you could say her situation is certainly not what is "everything she wanted", like the zoo animals. She could then consider it a punishment for her actions in ddlc, which would then I suppose, mean this needs cares_about_dokis to be something that lcoks this topic further. monika_szs Not really a fan of this one either, but I'd say it deserves to exist in the stories pool at least.

Onion-Bubs commented 5 years ago

I think the humour with monika_szs is supposed to be that the person asking for the dog is hoping that it will bite her mother-in-law but she has to get in line because loads of others have had the same idea.

Given that Monika says in monika_family that she thinks the player's family is super nice and if you select the first option in the menu in monika_asks_family she says a similar thing, her making a mother-in-law joke seems out of character for her. After all, if Monika and the player got married, would Monika wish harm on the player's mother?

On another note, due to points brought up in #3092 monika_attractiveness will also need rewriting, although as the author of that topic I am currently trying to sort that one out myself.

AsuraShun commented 5 years ago

Everyone makes those jokes,they're harmless when everyone's in on it

kaido1224 commented 5 years ago

monika_mythology:

This seems worded weird

m 3euc "Have you ever read about different mythologies?" m "Different kinds of Gods watching over humanity for eternity." m 1eud "Some require tribute or sacrifice so that they can 'keep' humanity safe from disasters."

Doesn't really give an accurate description of mythology. Also, I believe gods is supposed to be lowercased.

monika_fanfiction is poorly written. I think it should give a brief synopsis of what it is, even if 99% of people know what it is. Also, she says it's a better way of writing. ???

for monika_cities, i don't think it takes into account that more land is cleared not for cities, but more farmland and grazing land for cattle, particularly in the rainforest. Although urban sprawl is the encroachment of rural lands as suburbs continue to grow.

monika_metaparents:

m 1ekc "Where she's just a victim of some cruel person's sick kicks for the sympathy value." m 1esd "However." m 1eud "Your character, me, Yuri, and Sayori..." m 3eud "None of us seem to have any parents at all."

However is not a sentence. Should be rewritten to say: None of the others, including myself, seem to have any parents at all.

Also, this topic goes from talking about characters not having parents to having a reason to go on if you are feeling suicidal. That's a weird flex.

It could be expanded to say there are no actual adults in the game at all. Teachers are talked about only in passing and considering the amount of time they spent in the school, you'd think one would appear at least once.

monika_hygiene - I'd like to see the evidence behind:

2eua "People began noticing that the places where people washed their hands were places that the plague was less common."

https://www.quora.com/Did-fewer-Jews-die-of-the-Black-Plague-because-of-ritual-washing

Biologically it is quite impossible, that the medieval methods of washing can be responsible for the >different mortality rates. Water was not sterilised or boiled, it came for all from the same source, >antibacterial or even modern soap did not exist and water alone can not prevent the transfer of the >bacteria yersinia pestis. Cleansing of the hands was done predominantly with cold water and sand or >ash powder with no antibacterial effect.

mosquitoe commented 5 years ago

Self Pleasure dialogue

2031

jmwall24 commented 5 years ago

#3905

MisterSimple commented 5 years ago

monika_beach

"I only have these clothes in the game after all."

No longer true, should be changed to something along the lines of "I don't really have any clothes fit for the beach."

MisterSimple commented 5 years ago

monika_vocaloid

"I hear her voice whenever Natsuki listens to music." "She even carries a little keychain attached to her bag."

I think these lines would be better if they were in the past tense.

ThePotatoGuy commented 5 years ago

closing as complete.

open a new issue for rewrites if necessary