[New NIP]: Neblio version of MetaMask extensions for Orion or new name NeblioMask

[IWantMoreDecred]

Proposal Description

I thought i'd try this proposal system out with an old idea i had tossed to Neblio team a couple of times on their twitter but nobody responded.

I believe one of the major edges that Ethereum has over all of it's competitors is that it has this extremely popular web connector extension called Metamask that allows webpages to communicate & transact straight within webpages so that dapps like Uniswap & Kishuswap can do DEX swaps within your webbrowser.. Tons of Defi uses this to issue & pay back loans. People use it for payment processing in store-front websites. The whole web is becoming dependent upon wallets like these which is keeping Ethereum so darn popular.

Cardano has a similar wallet known as Yoroi Wallet that is soon to release it's own connector that will function in the same way.

I feel that if Neblio community wishes to have this same level of attention.. people that have various websites may choose Neblio over Ethereum when deciding on the next web-based dapp to make. If You have no connector, then they will continue to choose Ethereum or soon, Cardano to build their dapps with if they need it on their webpages.

I think this is incredibly important tool to fuel Neblio adoption. Neblio NEEDS to be able to talk to websites.

Either this should be somehow part of Orion or a whole other project extension for webbrowsers will need to be developed.

Sure, it would be nice if a 3rd party did this, as i'm sure the Neblio team was hoping would happen, but it does not seem likely.

Now if there is someone or some group who wishes to come forward to take on this idea on behalf of the Neblio Team, then lets hear it. Otherwise, i foresee this is a job that Neblio Team will have to get stuck with doing if we wish to see it happen.

I am not able to fund or develop it, so this proposal is intended to direct the Neblio Team towards this path.

I am not really a developer. Just an ideas guy that supports Neblio. My coding skills are trash.

Proposal Voting Details

just pick a default block time range of 5 days, starting at a blocktime that is close to when this proposal is acceptable to vote on.

Other Information

I cannot provide you details on how it could be done.

[nebliodev]

This is something we would love to see on Neblio, but no one on our team has any experience in browser extension development. This would likely need to be a project developed by an outside developer or partner (perhaps Tomas has something like this in mind for VENFT?)

I'll add the Help Wanted label to this proposal. If we can find help, or at least something that points us in the right direction so that we can properly evaluate how feasible this is, then we can get a vote scheduled on this proposal.

[IWantMoreDecred]

yeah, that's what I thought might be the case.

Thing is, Tomas is so darn busy helping out Neblio in so many other ways. He has spotted one of my older twitter posts where i mentioned this idea and he liked it but had suggested that i discuss it with the metamask team & have them edit their code to support Neblio as well as ethereum, but i didn't bother because i'm pretty confident that their allegiance is to Ethereum's success & would likely not want to support a competitor on their application. The MM team is likely highly invested in Eth.

I wouldn't want to ask Tomas to do it because I dont know if he has that experience & i already know how much he's done for Neblio. he's just too busy juggling all kinds of stuff. So i think this may have only a chance if some other new group took it on.

If he had VENFT in mind to do it, then i'm sure he would have mentioned it to me back then, but no.

[nebliodev]

I'll tag @fyziktom in case he has any thoughts on this.

[fyziktom]

There are many ways how to create decentralized exchange. I think again, that these kinds of the usecases is better to write it first as second layer. It will allow you to do it between different blockchains too. I mean for example trade Neblio NTP1 tokens and ETH ERC20 tokens.

Now you can use multiple different NTP1 tokens in the VEFramework. Some programmer can easily create the own decentralized exchange based on the VENFT App template. Most of the parts are already there. The VENFT App now accept both VENFT and CORZT tokens:

The Metamask is not needed now. We found own way how to create payment gateway which can be used by any another app. One way is integration with API and other is just create link for direct buy NFT or share NFT. The VENFT will be able to handle multiple crypto (BTC, LTC, Rdd, etc.), so the connection of the metamask is not important.

I had call with the Consensys before few months and I have asked them for integration of Neblio in the Metamask and still waiting for the response. They have all the info what we need. Thats why we have found our way how to do it and I think it is easier.

If anyone knows how to write the web browser plugins and I can explain him what he should use from the VEFramework, to build own "plugin style wallet".

[IWantMoreDecred]

I figured you had some work-a-rounds. but would the website dapp creator even think to do this?

would it be simple to create this & do it your way over them choosing to build on Ethereum & tapping easily into all of those metamask wallet users?

If any developer comes to the landing page of nebl.io with it in the back of their mind that their goal is to create a defi webpage like oasis.app or a dex like uniswap.

Look how simple that is. You just go to that link oasis.app and then click connect to connect to the users EXISTING WALLET like MMask [so they dont have the trouble of moving funds around prior or installing other things] and after you do that MMask just pops up in your face, because it saw a connection has been made to show you your balance in MMask

Our Orion is pretty simple & should be the go-to wallet of choice when dealing with Neblio holdings since it is simple for most people.

Remember, Neblio is supposed to be all about simplicity. If the end-user's experience doesn't match or exceed the level of simplicity demonstrated within those screenshots.. in how simple an existing wallet can connect & talk to a website.. then we won't have mass adoption.

It also must be simple from the developer's side of things.. they shouldn't have to develop their own wallets per website to compete with existing wallets, which would require moving funds around prior. and the developer of the website dapp must Know and UNDERSTAND how EASY it is to create such a dapp on Neblio over Ethereum within mere minutes of skimming over the main landing page of Nebl.io.

If we can't capture their attention within 10minutes.. we've lost them. they will just turn to do what everyone else is doing on ethereum & put up with insane gas fees in hopes that eth2.0 will come to be. they will just give up trying to figure it out.. Whether or not there is a way, they won't search for it.. they don't have time often to track these things down. Most people have short attention spans or are short on TIME.. Pressured deadlines.. Especially if it's a DEFI dapp with a lot of money on the line.

If you claim to have the solution, then Neblio team needs to market that solution & SHOW THEM. It needs to be in those devs face the moment they come to their website.. cuz in the back of their minds they are going to have this already instilled image of simplicity in their minds of how Metamask is done..

They might go clicking on "Orion" wallet and will think "oh, maybe that's the metamask equivalent we are looking to see if the end-user will likely use".

[IWantMoreDecred]

oops. edited that last line.. I had typed "They might go clicking on "Oasis" wallet and will think "oh, maybe that's the metamask equivalent we are looking to see if the end-user will likely use"."

when i meant to say "They might go clicking on "Orion" wallet and will think "oh, maybe that's the metamask equivalent we are looking to see if the end-user will likely use"."

[IWantMoreDecred]

You say we can do this without doing "extensions".. so. demonstrate for us how ORION could do this level of communication perhaps?

[IWantMoreDecred]

Otherwise, if there is no SIMPLE option on both the devs & the end-user's side of things. then we may need to find & copy the source code of Metamask or some other existing simple wallet connector like it.. then gut out the ethereum language & adapt it for Neblio's use.

[IWantMoreDecred]

Lets see if more simple or complex Extensions, from my understanding, are like websites that have extra privileges to know info about another webpage. So when i originally made this post I had envisioned an extension that wrapped up a version of Neblio's ORION to grant it these permissions.

How to Create Extensions in Opera, which is based on Chrome. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q49NGstRvnY

[fyziktom]

Thank you for all this info. I will check this, but I am not sure if the plugins will be modern way how to use the crypto. I will explain why later. Now just few points to think about:

At first place it does not make sense to create new plugin if there is already plugins like Metamask or Trezor. We are communicating with Trezor time to time and we are trying to reach them. I think it makes much more sense to add Neblio and NTP1 to Trezor. Then all pages and people who owns the trezor will be able to use it as they are familiar with it. They dont need to install anything new.

If you need to just click and pay (like payment gateway) this is already solved in the VENFT App. Just create request payment link in account tab. Then you can use it like model for your page and just add payment/checkout link. It is very well tested with WooCommerce on PoC dogeft.com. We did all buy of NFTs based on this.

Here is the link:

https://ve-nft.com/payment?add=NWHozNL3B85PcTXhipmFoBMbfonyrS9WiR&msg=SentwithVENFTApp&curr=NEBL&amnt=10

Here is link for buy the NFT:

https://ve-nft.com/buynft?utxo=5bbba86188886bcf854b3bc463f43dceec99843763565c9f152d746097761e62&index=0

It will open the VENFT App, if you have it (similar as you need to install metamask/trezor plugin) and thats it. If you do not have enough Neblio or Dogecoin on your wallet you cannot process the payment. If you dont have the VENFT App it will redirect you to the main page, and you can create it. This is fully working solution of payment gateway (same system is available to buy NFTs) and it does not need to be plugin which is usually dependent on the browser. This runs on all browsers.

[IWantMoreDecred]

The way i see it, we shouldn't limit ourselves to one method. Trezor.. Ledger, Mobile dapps, Orion.. Neblio QT.. There should always be many EASY ways people can connect existing wallets.

The problem with Trezor idea is not everyone has one.. it cost money. So right there we have a minor barrier for entry. It is good to see Defi/Dex's of future supporting all methods but there should always be a main way..

Orion is free & universal. Zero barrier for entry.

Guess what is also Zero barrier for entry? Metamask cost nothing to eth users.. and is available in most browsers via their extensions.

What if i am staking Nebl in Neblio QT & want to connect to some future defi/dex? What are the steps? Well, if we have requirement that all things must be through Trezor, then i gotta send nebl to that and then find my physical Trezor device and it's cables and get it all plugged up to do something.

If i instead send that same NEBL to an extension that could be NEBLIOMASK.. then i have only to open up any of my webbrowsers right there.. i dont need to find any cables or device. cost me nothing to have & takes almost no time.

METAMASK is the number 1 reason Ethereum is such a devastating force. Because it brings in the laymen + lazy people.. regular people. Cheap people.. People craving simplicity. No hurdles.. no complications. No learning new wallets every time they wish to interact with a website dapp.

You've got to think it from the perspective of the person who is not tech-savy. Its about getting it so simple that even Grandma & Grandpa can use.

How can we have a future of lending platforms if we make it only so rich, Tech-savy people can use them?

Reducing barriers for entry should be Neblio's goal.

You should notice something with your introduction of Dogecoin into VENFT.. Neblio actually started to gain a little bit of thunder when you did that.. WHY? Because Dogecoin is a coin that is used by a lot of laymans who do not care about tech. If they did care about tech they surely wouldn't invest in or use that buggy coin.

Meme's can be highly attractive to more simple people who don't think about tech. They aren't interested in TPS, Code.. or features.. THey just want something that is easy.

You helped simplify that for them in their NFT purchasing ability. So that is a good thing. You started a little bit of a flood gate to open for the simple-users.

I am always thinking in terms of how things can be made more simple. This is why i still arrive to the conclusion that having something like a Nebliomask is a better solution as it would be ONE universal wallet.

Yes, it is very good and interesting thing to see VE-NFT with the wallet ability & with multiple currencies. This can be strong feature for some DEX platform to build on for trading coins around in the future. But that solution is not what most would like to use.. not good for all instances. Such a system should also have support for a Universal wallet like NeblioMask so that a connection can be made to a common wallet, from common people.. who may not actually TRUST VENFT's methods of using a built-in wallet.

Here is the problem. See, although it is very neat and interesting to see that VENFT can have this wallet ability built in, many people do not want to have to send funds into systems where they lose control over those funds.

Now, you can say that VENFT is local memory only, but remember, it is a .com address. If someone were to hijack VENFT.com & edit something in the code or put a different dapp there that IMITATES VENFT dapp.. users may have funds stolen.

So VENFT is good, but many people also come from the perspective of "Can i trust this?"

This is why having an external solution as the wallet is better for many of those people. With Metamask.. you always have:

1. your funds in one wallet so there is no need to move stuff from wallet to wallet per dapp.
2. MetaMask may be communicating with the website but the website can do nothing to steal funds from it. It Protects the user. Lets say if, from my earlier example, oasis.app got hijacked & you try to connect to the now, malicious version... you won't lose your funds until you accept any kind of loan or whatever. The Metamask has higher authority that the webpage cannot steal from. It limits what information is revealed of your funds & grants no control over those funds. The only thing the webpage can do is send a request & you have to accept that request from within metamask.. which you can reject if you suspect the website is suspicious.

With VENFT, if i send my funds to that wallet address, who is to say that you haven't decided to become a malicious bad actor or that someone didn't hijack your website to modify code or make it have the appearance of being honest dapp?

Now imagine if all Neblio website dapps in the future are based off of VENFT wallet abililties.. So each website visitied would have to earn the users trust. In the end-user's mind they are thinking "hm, can i trust importing my private key into this dapp?" "and how about that one?" "or what about that other one?"

if the user experience is to deal with hundreds of dapps to play games.. borrow money.. trade.. buy stuff.. whatever they do in their regular lives.. if they have the trouble of moving funds each time & then having to TRUST each and every one.. They are bound to eventually get hit by a bad-actor... a scam.. hijacked webpage.. something..

with so many dapps on ethereum it happens a lot. Metamask has protected many, while keeping those end-users safe.. at least up until they accept the transaction.

Now, there are some times where doing the VENFT method of having a built-in wallet is ideal.. because with a lot of DEXs like Uniswap & Kishuswap the end-user has to relinquish control of funds to provide something that earns them yield or interest when providing custody/Liquidity.

But there are many types of dapps this is not needed.. Like a Metaverse game. In such applications you may only want to do one acceptance of a simple transaction & do not want to risk your funds or private key just to play a game.

And since Trust is always an issue, Another reason people like using Metamask is because they know that each time it is updated it must be checked over for anything malicious by the browser's team. So each Metamask update on Opera browser extensions is checked over by Opera team to insure safety for the end-user. Same thing from Google Chrome team and Microsoft Edge team.. & so on for all browsers.

Most of these extensions are very similar so it does not take much work to support a good many browsers & updates usually don't need to happen frequently for such a wallet.

I cannot think of a more simple way.

What i'd like to see is NeblioMask to be practically identical in design to MetaMask... OR for there to be a general "Connector" extension that links up to existing Neblio wallets inside or outside of the browser environment.

Something else i had considered.. i was thinking of when i bought a video game from Steam the other day & i used my Paypal account to pay.. where i clicked the Pay Now button on Steam's website & it automatically opened another browser window with Paypal login screen.. because it wanted to send instructions for the payment to paypal & then i accepted it and the window automatically closed an i continued with the purchase on the Steam side of the transaction to finish the transaction. This level of simplicity is what i see the future of blockchain transactions could be like.
If we went with the Paypal method.. then we'd have to trust transaction details to cookies i think. so there may be some issues with end-user fully trusting the experience.. but imagine if it were that simple to send a payment to a popup window that then opened up neblio's ORION in a little window instead of Paypal.. with all transaction detail.. then we have only to log-in and accept.

It is great what Neblio team does to create simplicity on the backend/dev side of things but it's the end-user experience that is what will form adoption ultimately.

The end-users matter most to the adoption and future of neblio. They've already got the best dev tools.. but this end-user barrier is killing them.

The end-users do NOT go where the devs are. The devs go where the End-users are.

devs follow the sheep.

This is why so many devs HATE working on ethereum yet they feel stuck with it.. because so many SHEEP flock to it because of the end-user experience from Metamask.

Think about that.

[IWantMoreDecred]

I'd like to see Neblio become the Nintendo of the blockchain world. If we ever got up to that level of simplicity, all the sheep would come flocking in.

[Pbizzler]

I fully support this proposal. Metamask is a brilliant tool and a Neblio version would unlock a lot of potential for users. VENFT is a great tool but it doesn't solve the same problems that metamask does for Ethereum IMO.

[fyziktom]

I agree metamask makes sense now, but I have asked them. I had call with business development director of Infura who is executive in Consensys too. They have our request about integration in Metamask (I asked also about store NFTs there), and still don have the answer from them.

Same story with Trezor. Fortunately, we have some similar friends, so I expect next year they should help us.

I think it is better to connect with already existing tool. The creation of tool like this costs lots of money on programming, adoption and marketing. I think if there are lots of projects who do this good makes sense to join them instead of wasting energy and money on same thing.

If anyone will find developers who will be happy to write this I can offer them my help with know-how I have. I am sure they can use the VENFT API or Drivers for build it very easily.

In our plans we have similar things like metamask, but little innovative way. Maybe it worth to wait until we will publish all our plans and then we can review this. I am sure it makes sense to talk about this kinds of features.

[IWantMoreDecred]

i can assure you that Metamask team will NOT help Neblio in the least. You just waste your time asking them. They are a team that is heavily invested in ethereum and they despise competitor chains to eth. They want to see cardano, neblio, dragonchain, neo, solana, zilliqa, etc all FALL flat on their faces and wither away.

We haven't got a chance in hell of getting integrated by them. So we are forced to come up with our own solution. I think their code is open source. Someone could likely just copy-n-paste that code & then remove the ethereum language to adapt it to Neblio. Then put in Neblio/Orion icon files/animation to make it look very different.

This is likely how we would have to go. If we can find a team to build this that is most likely the route that team would go.. because it could serve a good base to start with.

and because of Neblio having more abilities/less limitations than ethereum, perhaps NeblioMask could even do it better & outshine the original Metamask.

I bet it isn't that hard to even learn to create extensions based on that one video i watched. But i haven't the time, funds or coding skills to see it through. or else i would have long ago.

Imagine if one small team of devs put this together. then, after they finished it, built a couple of browser-based dapp games that were simple to play to demonstrate. Then the games would serve as bait to draw in a crowd.. When they go to the game's webpage, they'd see a link there that says "Please install NeblioMask extension by clicking HERE." and the link would take them right to the browser's extension page to show NeblioMask. That level of ease, on top of the bait of the games they could play, would spell easy quick adoption.

then Other 3rd parties would say "Hey, we noticed a lot of downloads for that NeblioMask extension.. i wonder why? OOOHH, it's so they could play that GAME... Well, since so many people ALREADY HAVE IT installed, lets build our own game.. Or a dex, or a lending platform or something to cash in on those people.. FOLLOW THE FLOCK OF SHEEP!"

[IWantMoreDecred]

NeblioMask would fuel the fire for browser-based dapp games, etc. Like metaverse games.

Then the games make more and more people download NeblioMask. As more and more people play those games & use NeblioMask, more 3rd party devs notice large spike in downloads of the NeblioMask extension as it becomes super popular. Then more & more dapps get made for NeblioMask support.

which in turn makes more downloads of NeblioMask.. a big snowball forming into an avalanche sized big boulder of a snowball.

Then all these sheep are using it.. talking about it.. requesting to EXCHANGES to add in Neblio support.. Then Coinbase comes knocking on Neblio's door & KuCoin wanting back in.

Then Volume is high on NEBL. Everyone wants it.

[IWantMoreDecred]

If we got this done, imagine if we used your work that got dogecoin support in venft also in the extension. By having dogecoin being supported, their massive army of people who have been itching to do stuff with dapps could then use their dogecoin in some of those. They could be a good catalyst to Neblio gaining attention. Your VENFT has already sparked their interest, so that was just a taste.