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PygmalionOfCyprus / cmo-db-requests

Public issue/request tracking for the Command: Modern Operations database
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Add flares to KH-101 cruise missile #4109

Open TTZ32 opened 10 months ago

TTZ32 commented 10 months ago

DB Selector

DB3K

Affected DBID(s)

Kh-101

Summary of Changes

KH-101 missiles fire off flares to protect against manpads

Sources

https://github.com/PygmalionOfCyprus/cmo-db-requests/assets/99824301/6b256153-0926-4d20-88f4-fc9c5cb6899a

KLABDB3K commented 10 months ago

This would not be an update but a new variant. X-101 wasn't found with either the sensors or flare dispensers required to do this in the first versions It's an evolution of the design from a few months ago. https://twitter.com/aldin_aba/status/1740817039953105142?t=wYF7rPgSYmaYQcOiT4LxRA&s=19 https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-kh-101-cruise-missile-filmed-firing-off-decoy-flares

tbrandon517 commented 10 months ago

Additional

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russian-kh-101-cruise-missile-filmed-firing-off-decoy-flares?fbclid=IwAR1UrqSzGNdkDkhD84Vb28zOMK1SOfQ0MlXdg2llsxM31gJB8_luKhX2gjw

FrangibleCover commented 10 months ago

Can Command do programmatic deployment of flares rather than reactive deployment?

KLABDB3K commented 10 months ago

This seems to be a real rabbit hole as the Storm Shadow SCALP images have potential dispensers visible as well.

ghost commented 10 months ago

correction: new Kh101 uses L504 countermeasures suite with a mixture of flares and chaff to confuse both radars and IR seekers 24 total pods. They fire off all flare/chaff pods (4 at a time) at intervals of 6 times right before target approach - firing all 24 at 2 second intervals in 12 seconds total prior to impact (estimated from the available video footage posted on twitter)

https://theaviationist.com/2023/12/29/russian-cruise-missile-flares/

ghost commented 10 months ago

https://theaviationist.com/2023/12/29/russian-cruise-missile-flares/

This seems to be a real rabbit hole as the Storm Shadow SCALP images have potential dispensers visible as well.

Could be, but I believe it is possibly the first video case in action of a cruise missile dispensing decoys. It appears to not be just flares. but instead the L504 countermeasure suite which carries 24 combined chaff/flare pods to counter both radar guided missiles and infrared seekers (12 pods on one side/12 on other)

From the videos online, it seems the chaff/flare is released 6 times at 2-3 second intervals (12-18 seconds) right before impact. So in the final 12-18 seconds of flight. This makes sense considering the stealth of the missile, the Crotale, Gepard, Tunguska, Avengers, Igla-S, Stinger are the most effective SHORAD / MANPAD against cruise missiles when they are very close by, which is why the L504 suite activates only very close to target area to confuse their tracking radars and IR homing devices.

Instead I agree with the proposition to add a new KH-101 munition for the TU-95 and TU-160M which has these generic flares/chaff pre-programmed to automatically release at 2 second intervals in 12 seconds for a total of all 24 pods