Open SK53 opened 6 years ago
I work at BRC and we have a requirement to create a set of buffered Irish VCs to facilitate coastal and marine record searching on iRecord. I think the current Irish VC boundaries we use are sourced from you. I could buffer these to three nautical miles on the seaward side (to be consistent with the GB VCs we have in our VC layer) and the only thing that would require a bit of work is delineating adjacent extensions, but it shouldn't be too onerous to do this manually.
But I saw this issue and I wondered if there scope for me to contribute this work to your project or if we could work together in some other way, using whatever GitHub workflow you'd prefer.
Also on another separate by related matter, BRC will likely take on the hosting and maintenance of the GB Vice Counties and I like the idea of doing this via an iRecord GitHub project - much as you've done with the Irish VCs. I see you've noted some geometry problems with the currently available data (https://forums.nbn.org.uk/viewtopic.php?id=4319). I came across the same problems in QGIS (selecting some polygons cased crashing) and did some work on fixing them. It would be great to have your input on this project too.
If you want to email me, I am rburkmar@ceh.ac.uk
Hi Rich,
Very interesting.
I think, will have to check, that I created buffers (250m) for all VCs when I created H40 Co Down. There were particular validation issues with islands on Carlingford Lough on the BSBI site which I wanted to help resolve. I also wanted to keep the existing (notional high water) polygons in step with all the other OSM boundaries.
I see no reason not to work together, but I'll need a couple of days to check what I did. The workflow is still a little more complex than I like:
I had hopes that GitHub would show diffs between each version (hence using Geojson) too, but as the Geojson diffs are just naïve textual diffs this doesn't work. I now prepare a difference in QGIS to help inform people using the data.
Adding another set of buffers to take the distance out to 3 nm in OSM would be rather simpler than the complexity of merging with coastline. It may also be possible to keep these solely in GitHub, which might be better than adding them to OSM (which is needed for the inshore buffers because of coastline).
Another specific issue with Ireland is that at present, unlike in UK, we don't have good high quality sources of high & low water. It's a mix of digitisation from aerial imagery and old GSGS 3906 maps. My 250 m buffers are basically a proxy for low water. Therefore the actual perimeter is likely to change as (and when) we get better forms of data for coastlines (both OSNI & OSI have some openish data but as yet not clearly licenced in a form we can use on OSM. When I compared OSM data with OSNI townland data it was the coastline which was most likely to be out of kilter. I have actually done some preliminary planning for an internal OSM project for enhancing the coastline, so this might be the time to get it going.
Lastly, I just want to check that you are aware of he work of Tom Humphrey & Jim MacIntosh on Scottish VCs for BSBI (I think mainly adding missing islands, but perhaps fixing the original broken polys for some of the Island VCs).
Will email you with any further thoughts.
Thanks that's very useful. Is the work done by Tom and Jim publicly available?
Credit for the BSBI work that @SK53 referred to should go to Jim MacIntosh and Andy Amphlett (I was only marginally involved).
I'll check what's available - probably several fixes to invalid geographies and restoration of some missing islands. Would be happy to make available anything that might be useful (will contact you by email, so as not to derail this issue thread).
@japonicus thanks for this. Should have guessed Andy was involved too.
Yes many thanks @japonicus.
One issue with using OpenStreetMap is that the coastline is, broadly speaking, the MHWM (high tide line), but in many cases vice county recorders will have data from both the littoral and sub-littoral zones (e.g, Eelgrasses, Brown Algae, salt marsh plants, snails & other molluscs).
Also there are no good sources for either the low or high water mark, and OSM is only as good as available aerial imagery and perhaps GSGS3906 mapping. In places with high cliffs, such as the W end of Achill Island aerial imagery is more-or-less useless for even remotely accurate coastlines. In other areas the coastlines have not been re-visited since original creation from landsat or PGS. Therefore the accuracy of the coastline is not of the same order as boundaries based on inland features (mainly mapped as Townland boundaries).
Therefore there are two related problems:
There are two potential ways of dealing with this:
In general I have decided in favour of the latter approach, for the following reasons:
As a starting point I have created a single example coastal buffer for County Down. This is based on the OSM coastline with a 250 m buffer and manual inclusion of large inshore areas such as Strangford Lough. The polygon has been added to OSM. This should meet current needs regarding any potentially missing off-shore islets or drying rocks.