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acemod / ACE3

Open-source realism mod for Arma 3
https://ace3.acemod.org
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Shooting limbs on AI will not kill them #833

Closed gienkov closed 9 years ago

gienkov commented 9 years ago

ACE3 Version: 3.0.0

Mods:

Placed ACE3 Modules:

Description: Shooting limb on AI with above settings (not tested others) will not kill them that quickly as one would think. It will not kill them at all. Even biggest caliber will only put them unconcious and you can shoot as many rounds as you want on those limbs - it will not kill him. Shooting torso or head however will kill them pretty quickly.

I think it should be looked into asap as one would have to make precise headshots or always hit torso to put down AI quickly. Please don't tell me this is made intentional. They should sustain more bullets maybe but get big penalty to aiming (arms hit) or movement speed (leg hit) which is working from what I saw already.

It's worth mentioning that I have Prevent instant death set to disabled. Enjoy watching videos below:

Warning, violent videos below! This was done for testing only, I'm not a sadist! http://youtu.be/f9e8wWJp2Co http://youtu.be/mU9CeFggjvM Different wounds are showing on limbs properly: http://youtu.be/Vv4nMkDg46A

Steps to reproduce:

Where did the issue occur? "Multiplayer", "Singleplayer"

RPT log file: Nothing inside

alganthe commented 9 years ago

Same settings as yours, here's my results: target: CSAT rifleman, classname "O_Soldier_F"

-7,62 x 52 NATO. one hit kill, all the time

-.338 norma magnum one hit kill each time

Now shooting the limbs:

-.338 norma magnum 10 to 20 bullets to the limb, shitloads of wounds, unit only unconscious dafuq

-.408 OH GOD AI Y U SO STRONK 3 shots to the same leg, 2 large avulsion 1 medium velocity, ai pass out from the shock then it wakes up and then pass out again because of the blood loss.

gienkov commented 9 years ago

Yup.

alganthe commented 9 years ago

above comment updated, ai limbs seems to be made of depleted uranium.

jaynus commented 9 years ago

Are these tested dedicated, mp self host or sp? Zeus AI or mission AI?

alganthe commented 9 years ago

on my case tested in editor with pre-placed units, setCaptive true in my unit init.

gienkov commented 9 years ago

I was testing on dedi and then hosted. Spawning AI using Zeus and VTS console. I suspect same effect on SP.

jaynus commented 9 years ago

Please test again in dedicated mission spawned. MP Zeus is not MP; the AI is still local to your system.

I suspect this is an AI locality issue for non-dedicated

gienkov commented 9 years ago

VTS console spawns them on server so they are not local to me then. And same things happens.

jaynus commented 9 years ago

Ok thanks will investigate

gienkov commented 9 years ago

No problem. I hope this will be fixed before first release :).

ulteq commented 9 years ago

you can shoot as many rounds as you want on those limbs - it will not kill him

I can not replicate that in SP.

Edit: Master branch (58395b166beb3be5ab3a8b012ae140bc8f065a44)

alganthe commented 9 years ago

what branch are you on ulteq ? Because I can replicate that pretty easily, they only die from losing too much blood, eventually. I managed to inflict 63 wounds on an ai and he was still alive, he died of blood loss 1 minute later. When only 2 of thoses wounds would kill an ai in the torso.

jaynus commented 9 years ago

I cannot replicate here or in the medical improvements branch

thojkooi commented 9 years ago

Please provide a version number, including commit hash.

ulteq commented 9 years ago

This issue is about Advanced medical for players and AI:

I managed to inflict 63 wounds on an ai and he was still alive, he died of blood loss 1 minute later.

This sounds pretty legitimate. Especially the he died of blood loss 1 minute later part of it.

alganthe commented 9 years ago

The issue ulteq is that the ai can only sustain 2 wounds on the chest before dying, so 63 on the right leg seems to be a "bit" too much in comparison. I had to inflict around 10 to 20 wounds before the ai passed out with 6.5 at point blank range.

version 3.0.0.1 commit #861

when I shoot the ai in the chest 1 or 2 rounds put them in an unconscious state, 1 more an they're dead, when I shoot their limbs I need a full mag to put them unconscious and an other to kill them.

edit: they seem to bleed out faster now, but the sheer amount of wounds I can inflict on limbs without them dying is just insane.

nicolasbadano commented 9 years ago

they seem to bleed out faster now, but the sheer amount of wounds I can inflict on limbs without them dying is just insane.

I'm not an expert or anything, but I believe you can outright severe a leg and still have the patient survive for at least a minute. Shooting a leg a zillion times won't make it bleed any faster than just cutting it so I think this is legit.

alganthe commented 9 years ago

The problem again is that you can take someone out in 3 shots otherwise by shooting in the chest. 1-2 to make the guy unconscious and again 1-2 to kill him. it's not really consistent.

nicolasbadano commented 9 years ago

The problem again is that you can take someone out in 3 shots otherwise by shooting in the chest. 1-2 to make the guy unconscious and again 1-2 to kill him. it's not really consistent.

Neither is reality. All your vital organs are located on the chest and head. None in the legs or arms.

gienkov commented 9 years ago

@esteldunedain Makes some sense, that can give more situations when you have to check lying bodies of enemy to know if they are alive or dead. Still, there should be some "threshold" of how many wound there can be, and more should equal faster bleeding out.

ulteq commented 9 years ago

Still, there should be some "threshold" of how many wound there can be

I've always suggested that.

more should equal faster bleeding out.

That's already implemented afaik.

jaynus commented 9 years ago

Limbs can only bleed so much, and a minute sounds tbh too fast for advanced medical.

A person can survive a severed, mutilated leg - at this point you are more worried about shock than bleeding.

I think this can be closed, pending the planned shock trauma implementation in 3.1

thojkooi commented 9 years ago

I agree. I have implemented a few minor adjustments on the medicalImprovements branch, but I think any other tweaks have to be done after 3.0.0 release.