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adlnet / xapi-authored-profiles

Repository of official xAPI Profiles
https://adlnet.gov/projects/xapi/
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Creation of Audio profile #72

Closed johngriner91 closed 5 years ago

johngriner91 commented 5 years ago

Similar to the 'Video' profile, this would be for audio only content. Extensions and interactions that are present in the 'video' profile but don't apply to audio-only content have been removed.

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

Good Morning @johngriner91 and @jhaag75 would it be possible for you two to join the xAPI Working Group call on the 15th? This is a weekly GoTo meeting that begins around 2:30pm Eastern time to discuss changes to the xAP spec, suggested profiles, etc.

I believe this would be the ideal place discuss the addition of this profile to our vocab server

To join you can follow this link: https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/686232837

I hope to see you there!

jhaag75 commented 5 years ago

Yes, I'll be there. Thanks Florian.

On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 9:01 AM Florian Tolk notifications@github.com wrote:

Good Morning @johngriner91 https://github.com/johngriner91 and @jhaag75 https://github.com/jhaag75 would it be possible for you two to join the xAPI Working Group call on the 15th? This is a weekly GoTo meeting that begins around 2:30pm Eastern time to discuss changes to the xAP spec, suggested profiles, etc.

I believe this would be the ideal place discuss the addition of this profile to our vocab server

To join you can follow this link: https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/686232837

I hope to see you there!

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/pull/72#issuecomment-491299647, or mute the thread https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAEJSRW7TTW6WZ42TBNUHQDPUV535ANCNFSM4HLR46KA .

johngriner91 commented 5 years ago

It's on my calendar. Thank you.

jhaag75 commented 5 years ago

Some corrections were recently made to the video profile after our last Video CoP meeting: https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/tree/master/video/v1.0.3

Not sure if you want to update the audio profile to match these templates, but wanted to let you know.

Digitdev commented 5 years ago

Just a thought here but are we going to have profiles for each media format out there? There is a lot of overlap between this and the video profile per comments above. With verbs like paused do we really need one for every profile for example. Can't we just modify paused description to something like "paused the media or activity"

I think we add a lot of confusion for analytics and developers of content having verbs that essentially mean the same thing. Context activities etc... can be used to differentiate the media.

There was talk of another profile the other day for virtual reality that I think should just be in the serious games profile and I believe we could find 85% of what is needed already exists.

Stuart GBLxAPI profile

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

In response to Digitdev/Stuart - On the surface, adding 'audio only' may have seemed useful, but based on the way we use media files, I would suggest Stuart's point is important.

If we encounter any type of READ-ONLY media file in the wild, we simply determine the codec and apply an appropriate media player program. So perhaps we should adjust our thinking and apply a "Media File Player" Profile to handle "Media File Player" Activity Statements.

I believe it could handle any "recording" being "played back" using any identified "player." So audio might not use some of the verbs for videos, and next year when everything is XR objects in scenarios -- a few verbs might be added :) ... all in one continuously additive reference as … Media File Player profile. It might work well for legacy media systems as well... like laser discs, CD, DVD, movie reels or vinyl record discs, etc...

Regarding the stretching to XR... I worked on an XR performance tracking system project recently and found that Demo Mode was not much more than a fancy kind of recording being played for the learner. This "Media Player" happened to use AR/XR controls and allowed a 3D freedom for viewing... so perhaps an additional verb or extension etc...

To the mention of XR and serious games... Once in Performance Tracking Mode, this XR system required something more like the idea of ARLEM - too complex to be a "serious game" -- too virtual and restricted in scope to be a "simulator," and very AR heavy in structure... Needed Mixed Reality interface lingo without the additional structure of the game or the simulator. but that is a little off topic as INTERACTIVE and not a MEDIA PLAYER situation....

Regards.

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

While I am very pro media profile, I do need to ask how we would handle the current video profile, as it does have a community of practice. Having both a media profile and an active video profile may also cause confusion.

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

Thanks FlorianTolk.
Change is never easy, but it happens!
I am not at all familiar with the etiquette of proposing this sort of change. Are you?

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@DataBeeGood I am not familiar with the best way to handle these types of changes, but this is an excellent chance to set a precedent!

Every week there is a GoTo Meeting https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/686232837 that acts as an open forum for the xAPI community of practice.

This profile was discussed at our last meeting, and while I believe we are moving towards an agreement on how to handle situations like this, but I believe everyone would benefit from continuing this conversation at least for another week before making this merge.

This is a weekly GoTo meeting that begins around 2:30pm Eastern time and I'm sure everyone would gain some value from having more people weigh in on this issue.

Hopefully @jhaag75 and and @johngriner91 won't mind another call before moving forward on this.

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

Thanks FlorianTolk,

Happy to share insights from my information systems perspective. I have been following IEEE groups, but have heard about other groups.
I also attended iFEST last year so I could get a grounding in the state of the art.

What day of the week? is the regular call?

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@DataBeeGood This is a regular call every Wednesday. I really look forward to seeing you there! hopefully you'll be able to help everyone find a compromise on a topic like this.

Obviously if you know anyone else who may want to weigh in on this conversation, please don't hesitate to invite them as well.

I look forward to hearing from you!

If there are any questions or concerns, please don't hesitate to reach out to me, I'll do my best assist!

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

Thanks again. I am noting that the Video Community of Practice has terminated their calls after 3 years of work -- as of May 9, 2019 - it figures... :) I will take a serious look at the work I did last year and see if I can use any of it regarding profiles. https://github.com/liveaspankaj/xapi-video-cop/wiki/43.-xAPI-Video-CoP-Meeting-Minutes-–-May-9th%2C-2019

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

As Yesterday was the 4th Wednesday of the week, our attendance was just 2 people, The discussion planned for the 22nd has been postponed to the 5th to ensure as many people get a chance to voice their concerns as possible.

If there are any questions, please don't hesitate to reach out me!

jhaag75 commented 5 years ago

You might want to send out a meeting invite if this is a recurring event. I thought last week was a one-time thing so I didn't have anything on my calendar this week. If this is a weekly meeting let me know and I'll update my calendar. But this still doesn't inform everyone else you want to be there. Thanks Florian!

On Thu, May 23, 2019 at 2:59 PM Florian Tolk notifications@github.com wrote:

As Yesterday was the 4th Wednesday of the week, our attendance was just 2 people, The discussion planned for the 22nd has been postponed to the 5th to ensure as many people get a chance to voice their concerns as possible.

If there are any questions, please don't hesitate to reach out me!

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/pull/72?email_source=notifications&email_token=AAEJSRR2E43F7ONSG6RUMMDPW3ZRJA5CNFSM4HLR46KKYY3PNVWWK3TUL52HS4DFVREXG43VMVBW63LNMVXHJKTDN5WW2ZLOORPWSZGODWDKKYI#issuecomment-495363425, or mute the thread https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAEJSRSHIFEPGBLLR7JH6XDPW3ZRJANCNFSM4HLR46KA .

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

@FlorianTolk I am sorry. Dealing with family illness. I intend to be there. Confirming... 5th at 230pm Eastern Time?

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@DataBeeGood That's right, I will try to send out an invite to everyone in this conversation today

Digitdev commented 5 years ago

@DataBeeGood Hello All - I just got back from overseas. It looks like there is a plan to have a call on June 5th - Is that correct? I can probably jump on to that based on my current calendar.

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@Digitdev, yes there is a meeting today at 230 Pacific Time

DataBeeGood commented 5 years ago

@FlorianTolk isn't that 2:30 Eastern Time?

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@DataBeeGood and @Digitdev My apologies, it is Eastern time. We had to cut today's meeting short, but will do it again in a week (6-12-19) same time and url as last time

jhaag75 commented 5 years ago

I will try to join as well. Can you please send out a calendar invite?

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 2:12 PM Florian Tolk notifications@github.com wrote:

@DataBeeGood https://github.com/DataBeeGood and @Digitdev https://github.com/Digitdev My apologies, it is Eastern time. We had to cut today's meeting short, but will do it again in a week (6-12-19) same time and url as last time

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/pull/72?email_source=notifications&email_token=AAEJSRUZVE7P24E5JOLCPK3PZAFYRA5CNFSM4HLR46KKYY3PNVWWK3TUL52HS4DFVREXG43VMVBW63LNMVXHJKTDN5WW2ZLOORPWSZGODXAXCVI#issuecomment-499216725, or mute the thread https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAEJSRVXEUZJ5V5PKO7LF2LPZAFYRANCNFSM4HLR46KA .

jhaag75 commented 5 years ago

Called in today for the 6/12 meeting but nobody was there. Let us know if I can support future meetings or if this meeting info has changed.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 2:12 PM Florian Tolk notifications@github.com wrote:

@DataBeeGood https://github.com/DataBeeGood and @Digitdev https://github.com/Digitdev My apologies, it is Eastern time. We had to cut today's meeting short, but will do it again in a week (6-12-19) same time and url as last time

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/pull/72?email_source=notifications&email_token=AAEJSRUZVE7P24E5JOLCPK3PZAFYRA5CNFSM4HLR46KKYY3PNVWWK3TUL52HS4DFVREXG43VMVBW63LNMVXHJKTDN5WW2ZLOORPWSZGODXAXCVI#issuecomment-499216725, or mute the thread https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAEJSRVXEUZJ5V5PKO7LF2LPZAFYRANCNFSM4HLR46KA .

gblxapi commented 5 years ago

Sorry I totally missed this. Is there a link to the call in info somewhere? If I don’t get it on my calendar it is gone ☺ Will do my best for the next one when announced.

From: Jason Haag notifications@github.com Reply-To: adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles reply@reply.github.com Date: Wednesday, June 12, 2019 at 2:09 PM To: adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles xapi-authored-profiles@noreply.github.com Cc: Subscribed subscribed@noreply.github.com Subject: Re: [adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles] Creation of Audio profile (#72)

Called in today for the 6/12 meeting but nobody was there. Let us know if I can support future meetings or if this meeting info has changed.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 2:12 PM Florian Tolk notifications@github.com wrote:

@DataBeeGood https://github.com/DataBeeGood and @Digitdev https://github.com/Digitdev My apologies, it is Eastern time. We had to cut today's meeting short, but will do it again in a week (6-12-19) same time and url as last time

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/pull/72?email_source=notifications&email_token=AAEJSRUZVE7P24E5JOLCPK3PZAFYRA5CNFSM4HLR46KKYY3PNVWWK3TUL52HS4DFVREXG43VMVBW63LNMVXHJKTDN5WW2ZLOORPWSZGODXAXCVI#issuecomment-499216725, or mute the thread https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAEJSRVXEUZJ5V5PKO7LF2LPZAFYRANCNFSM4HLR46KA .

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FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

@jhaag75 and @gblxapi the meeting just started and can be found at https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/686232837

The meeting begins at 2:30 Eastern Time.

Github won't allow me to add a calendar invite to this forum unless I zip it first. WeeklyxAPIWGInvite.zip

You can also find more information on this call here

johngriner91 commented 5 years ago

So, after some offline discussion, I wanted to give an update here. Current this PR stands up an audio profile that declares a new audio activity type and utilizes the video profile verbs.

In our discussion last week, we discussed just updating the video profile descriptions to be more flexible of the content type. However, in looking down that path, a couple statement properties clearly indicate the content is a 'video' type:

  1. The activity id explicitly notes a 'video' type. https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/blob/master/video/v1.0.3/video.jsonld#L64.

  2. The statement's objectActivityType: https://github.com/adlnet/xapi-authored-profiles/blob/master/video/v1.0.3/video.jsonld#L395

Not sure what the best path forward here is. One option is changing what is required in the statements. If having the id/objectActivityType be optional or have a flexible value is alright, then I can update the video profile to reflect that . Otherwise, we may end up needing to continue with this PR as is.

FlorianTolk commented 5 years ago

This is dependent of if you want to track the difference between video and audio (I would suggest allowing this) Then you can create an audio activity type, in addition to the video activity type.

Any instance where either value would work within the templates of this profile, I would suggest setting the profile to allow for both values.

Otherwise we'd have to replace the video activity type with a "media" activity type, which means we track slightly less potentially important information.