Guidelines for using Backdrop name, domain names, logo, mascot?

[alanmels]

Years would take until the Russian-language Backdrop community would grow, and that's despite the main English-speaking Backdrop community - to my view - is evolving quite dynamically. However, seeing from the whois information for backdrop.ru, that someone's registered it back on 1994-04-07 and had not actually been using it, but offering for sale, I thought it would only be good if the domain served Backdopr's cause and decided to secure the name and announced it on https://backdrop.zulipchat.com/#narrow/stream/218635-Backdrop/topic/https.3A.2F.2Fwww.2Ebackdrop.2Eru (and thanks to @BWPanda's pitching it's since become https://the-day-backdrop-starts-thriving-this-will-be-just.backdrop.ru ;)

I was just following examples of dozens of Drupal communities in different languages around the world, e.g https://drupal.ua, https://drupal.ru, http://www.drupal.bg, https://www.drupal.de, https://www.drupal.no, https://www.drupal.fr, so on and so on. Later I've realized I never looked at the above domain purchase through prism of the differences between the two brands, communities, philosophies and principles, never checked if there were any policies with regard to purchasing backdrop domain names, if it complies with the community's understanding and its consensus about this.

I know the English-speaking community itself is just getting traction to potentially become one of the most popular CMSs, but that at this stage it needs concentration of efforts and can't be dealing with administering multiple domain names throughout the world. Therefore, my believe was that those community members who speak in various languages are just ok to take over the domains, containing the word "backdrop" in their names, and try to disseminate the Backdrop cause in different countries and different languages.

On the other hand, despite it's an additional burden, maybe the Backdrop community wants to own (and manage them by just assigning the same persons who speak those languages) all the backdrop.tld domains? I would gladly transfer the rights to the domain name to the community. And with this regard I wonder:

(1) AFAIK, Backdrop community is offering the CMS to the public as GPL 2 licensed software, has the Software Freedom Conservancy as the fiscal sponsor of Backdrop, but has not formed any kind of non-profit organization. Will there be any such intentions in the future?

(2) To which entity the non-monetary properties like domain names should be transferred? I just want to express my opinion here, that I didn't like lot's of things which took place in Drupal community, but above all I didn't like the trademark "Drupal" and the domain name "drupal.com" ended up belonging to a single person. I will follow wherever the community consensus leads to, however I do hope Backdrop can avoid repeating some of Drupal community's mistakes, which broke the hearts of many.

(3) Regardless to the answers to questions 1 & 2, what are the guidelines, recommendations to those who will want to create local Backdrop communities in different countries? I believe it's never too early to discuss this kind of matters.

[alanmels]

There is a nice relevant page on https://backdropcms.org/presskit that, unfortunately, does not answer the above questions.

[stpaultim]

@alanmels Thanks for asking these questions. I've been a part of some discussions on these topics and am a member of the PMC. But some of these discussions predate my involvement in the community. Right now, I'm speaking my understanding of our policy (to the extent and wherever we have one - there may not be an official answer to all of your questions).

1) Our relationship with the Software Freedom Conservancy is intended to avoid the need to form our own non-profit (is my understanding). There are no short term plans to form our own non-profit and it is my understanding that we are hoping to avoid that as long as possible, just to avoid the work necessary to start and maintain a non-profit.

Having said that, I do think it possible that in the future we decide to go that route. But, I have not heard anyone advocating for that at this stage in our development.

2) It is my understanding that we are also trying to avoid the Drupal example of having the trademark in the hands of an individual. At the moment, I believe that Nate and Jen hold the trademark for Backdrop CMS, but that they wish to transfer it to the Software Freedom Conservancy to hold on behalf of the Backdrop community. Work is underway to make this happen right now.

I am not entirely certain who owns the domains right now, but it is my understanding that the intention is to make sure that the community owns all of these properties. Right now, I believe that would mean putting them in the hands of the Software Freedom Conservancy on behalf of the community and under the supervision of the PMC.

There are stipulations in our agreement with the Software Freedom Conservancy on transferring any intellectual properly back to us at our request, should we form our own non-profit in the future.

3) There have been discussions about how others use the name Backdrop CMS and our logo. We don't seem to be too worried about it as long as credit is given and there are links back to the official site. Having said that, I think it would be in our interest to form a more formal policy on this - although that does not necessarily mean a more restrictive policy.

4) For now, the community seems content to have language groups own and maintain their own domains. Mostly, I think, because we lack the resources and infrastructure to manage them ourselves. However, as a member of the PMC, I would be interested in whether or not these groups would prefer to have additional support and/or participation from the broader community. I think that we should at least make clear our willingness to manage these assets as requested.

For example, I've wondered if having individual foreign language sites is really the best path forward or just the easiest. Would it be better for us to make our main properties multi-lingual? And if so, do we have the resources to make this happen? I defer to the various foreign language groups for advice in this regard.

In my view, I welcome the individual efforts that have begun to happen by foreign language groups to build community, at the same time I'm open to planing a greater role in coordinating these efforts if that would be helpful. What I do not want to do - is get in the way and prevent this activity from happening with unnecessary rules and regulations.

Again, these are a combination of my opinions and my own interpretation of previous discussions on this topic. Given that we are starting to see more activity by individual groups representing language groups within our community, it may be time that we think more seriously about this.

[stpaultim]

I think that this would make a great topic at our next Backdrop CMS LIVE event. https://backdropcms.org/news/events/backdrop-live-1

[alanmels]

Tim, thank you very much for the detailed information. Makes the subject matter much clearer.

I appreciate the wariness with which the community leaders like yourself are addressing all the organizational questions. I just hope that all those "your personal opinions and your own interpretation of previous discussions" will be firmed into concrete and publicly available policies. Disclosing the official stand on all of that kind of sensitive matters upfront will only attract more contributors who prefer fairer communities.

For example, I've wondered if having individual foreign language sites is really the best path forward or just the easiest. Would it be better for us to make our main properties multi-lingual? And if so, do we have the resources to make this happen? I defer to the various foreign language groups for advice in this regard.

If the decision will be to demonstrate internationalized features of the system and to have one single portal, but in different language versions (detected by domain names), then I would take proper care of Russian version.

[klonos]

To clarify things: unless I'm terribly wrong re that, Backdrop CMS is already a non-profit (otherwise we wouldn't be able to acquire a .org domain). What Backdrop is not or has not is the respective entity that the Drupal Association is.

...I welcome the individual efforts that have begun to happen by foreign language groups to build community...

I'm on the same boat 👍

I think that this would make a great topic at our next Backdrop CMS LIVE event.

Yes! 👍

...I would take proper care of Russian version.

Thanks for offering to maintain that @alanmels ❤️

[alanmels]

I only mentioned Russian, because it's one of the official languages of UN as apparently a single portal can not cover all languages in the world. Otherwise, we have human resources in AltaGrade to take care of Azeri, Turkish, Kazakh, Kyrgyz and Uzbek languages too.

I think that this would make a great topic at our next Backdrop CMS LIVE event.

Yes! 👍

So far didn't want to participate in events where I'm useless, but in this case I'm putting this into my calendar.

[alanmels]

What Backdrop is not or has not is the respective entity that the Drupal Association is.

From my perspective, Drupal Association is often time hungry, angry and undemocratic (they kick out long-time users for expressing views which don't play into their hands) entity. I hope Backdrop community maintains that welcoming, friendly character it has developed so far, however at the same time we have to have some kind of legal entity to tie monetary and non-monetary properties to. As for as I've taken from Tim's explanation above, the terms of the agreement with Software Freedom Conservancy sound instrumental, however I am not really sure if it's the best way.

@stpaultim: There are stipulations in our agreement with the Software Freedom Conservancy on transferring any intellectual properly back to us at our request, should we form our own non-profit in the future.

I wonder is it possible for the community members to have access to the full text of the agreement?

[alanmels]

Couldn't find any mentions of Backdrop becoming Conservancy's Member Project on https://backdropcms.org/news?page=3, but found on https://sfconservancy.org/news/2018/may/08/backdropjoinsSFC/

[stpaultim]

To clarify things: unless I'm terribly wrong re that, Backdrop CMS is already a non-profit (otherwise we wouldn't be able to acquire a .org domain). What Backdrop is not or has not is the respective entity that the Drupal Association is.

One does not need to be a non-profit to get the .org domain name. I have had the domain politalk.org for years and have never been a registered non-profit.

It was my understanding that we (BackdropCMS) are NOT a non-profit on our own, but maybe that needs to be clarified.

EDIT:

I found this at the bottom of this page - https://backdropcms.org/about:

Backdrop CMS is non-profit. Backdrop is a project of the Software Freedom Conservancy. Software Freedom Conservancy is a not-for-profit charity that helps promote, improve, develop, and defend Free, Libre, and Open Source Software (FLOSS) projects. To make a donation, please visit the Contribute page.

I read this as BackdropCMS is not a profit based organization and has non-profit status through Software Freedom Conservancy.

[docwilmot]

See: https://sfconservancy.org/about/

FLOSS projects whose applications are accepted become part of the Software Freedom Conservancy (akin to a separate department of a large agency). Once joined, the “member project” receives most of the benefits of existing as a non-profit corporate entity without engaging in the arduous work of forming a separate, new organization. Conservancy aggregates the work of running a FLOSS non-profit for its many members.

[oadaeh]

So far didn't want to participate in events where I'm useless, but in this case I'm putting this into my calendar.

@alanmels you would not be useless. The idea of of the LIVE event is for people to come together to discuss various topics, some about basic functionalities of the product, some about bigger ideas. You have a perspective that most in the community do not have, and so your input in various discussions could be quite useful and insightful, even in topic areas that are not specifically related to your business.

[alanmels]

@oadaeh thanks for your warm words. During today's VUG I tried to explain what I'm busy with now and also what I'm heading to. Unfortunately, time constraints simply won't allow me to participate in the community as actively as I really wish I could. However, at some point when most of the things settle down for me, I will try to participate and contribute more than I'm capable at the present.

[oadaeh]

@alanmels I understand your situation. I am in a similar place.