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Bisq exchange growth experiments
https://bisq.wiki/Growth_team
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Add Skrill - Multi-currency payment method #232

Open pazza83 opened 3 years ago

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

Skrill - Multi-currency

Website: https://www.skrill.com/ Fees: https://www.skrill.com/en/siteinformation/fees/#send-money-receive-money Terms and conditions: https://www.skrill.com/en/footer/terms-conditions/skrillaccounttermsofuse/ Skrill Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skrill

Background

Multi-currency payment methods are a good addition to Bisq as they increase accessibility to markets for more users.

Why

Skrill is an established multi-currency payment service.

Region

Multiple counties over 120+

Here is a list of all the countries that are not serviced by Skrill

Currencies

Multiple currencies including:

Chargeback risk

Low

Size of user base

Skrill has over 40 million users worldwide.

Duration

From 1-3 business days. Therefore, recommend 4 days as trade time.

Fees

Free for international transfers (using independent exchange rate provided by Reuters)

2% fee for sending money domestically.

Users will be aware what it costs to send.

Fraud risk

Low

Payment amounts

Within 0.25 BTC limit

Additional information

Payments can be funded by credit and debit card.

I originally discounted this payment method as no to Skrill to Skrill payment is possible, but expensive (1% to deposit funds, 1,5% to send funds, and 1% to withdraw funds).

However if technically possible my proposal is for Skrill to be a 'taker' account only. Similar to my proposal for WorldRemit

Skrill accounts would be able to take offers on any of the following payment methods:

SEPA (EUR) Faster Payments (GBP) Wire Transfer US (USD) National Bank Transfer (in any of the currencies above)

RififiCastorjunior commented 3 years ago

A foot note say this :

Important notice

As of 22 February 2021 the following Fees shall apply: Withdrawal Fee from a Skrill Account to a NETELLER Account – 3.49% per transaction International transfer send money Fee for the use of Skrill Money Transfer – up to 4.99% per transaction - applicable to international money transfers in the same send and receive currency only International transfer send money FX markup Fee - up to 4.99% per transaction.

Almost 5% of all transfer

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

A foot note say this :

Important notice

As of 22 February 2021 the following Fees shall apply: Withdrawal Fee from a Skrill Account to a NETELLER Account – 3.49% per transaction International transfer send money Fee for the use of Skrill Money Transfer – up to 4.99% per transaction - applicable to international money transfers in the same send and receive currency only International transfer send money FX markup Fee - up to 4.99% per transaction.

Almost 5% of all transfer

Yes the high fees for Skrill to Skrill transactions put me off at first. However, the way I have proposed to implement it means that these fees will not be payable.

Say if I was selling BTC for EUR, you would be able to send me any other currency from the list above to pay. The only cost would be the difference between the mid market exchange rate and what you were charged, Your fees would be very low likely 0.25-0.5%.

I would receive all the Euros in my bank and then could transfer them out for free.

Conza88 commented 3 years ago

I would receive all the Euros in my bank and then could transfer them out for free.

Yep, that'd be the way. No Skill to skill, but however best. For that low level fee's as taker only.

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

@bisq-network/dev is a 'taker only' payment method something that can be achieved?

sqrrm commented 3 years ago

How would this work? User sets up a skrill account, won't be able to create offers but it would match to sepa/faster payment/wire/national bank options while looking to take offers? Does the information for all those methods fit with the skrill side of things or is something extra needed?

Sounds doable to have a take only account type, but is that really what you want to achieve here? Isn't it buy only since the skrill user will be sending fiat?

Conza88 commented 3 years ago

Isn't it buy only since the skrill user will be sending fiat?

Yeah 'buyer of BTC' only seems more accurate, whether taking offers for BTC or making offers for BTC.

I'd be real keen for the universal fiat nature of it, in terms of opening up liquidity to all fiat markets essentially to take offers.

Is it just opening access to national/local banks? Or would others need to add skrill themselves - although technically could be tied into their local currency national banks? (that'd be more liquid, right?)

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

@sqrrm yes you are correct it is buy only.

How would this work? User sets up a Skrill account, won't be able to create offers but it would match to sepa/faster payment/wire/national bank options while looking to take offers?

Yes that would be correct.

Does the information for all those methods fit with the skrill side of things or is something extra needed?

Yes it does. Buyer (Skrill account holder) would just need to enter sellers payment details when making payment using Skrill. Seller would receive funds from Skrill's account.

@Conza88

Is it just opening access to national/local banks? Or would others need to add skrill themselves - although technically could be tied into their local currency national banks? (that'd be more liquid, right?)

It would open up access to users wanting to buy in any of the following currencies irrespective of their location:

AUD

sqrrm commented 3 years ago

It sounds reasonable to add this. I haven't looked at the details regarding checks to not allow selling for some account types but I suspect it's won't be hard to implement.

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

Skrill has been scored for inclusion to Bisq:

Essential Desirable Definite No’s
Very low risk of chargeback No risk of chargeback < very low risk of chargeback
Way to verify the sender in the received payment Way to verify the sender in the received payment and ability to enter a reference No way to verify the sender in the received payment
Trade time less than one week Instant payment Trade time more than one week
Singular Fiat currency Multi-currency Not a payment method for fiat currency
Significant user base Large user base No significant user base
High usability High usability and great user experience < high amount usability
No KYC required for sending and receiving payments No KYC required for sending and receiving payments, allows users to trade with upmost privacy. Minimal identifying information as possible (no names, email, phone etc required) Some KYC required (proof of address, ID, selfie) for sending and receiving payments
Low risk of scam attempts Very low risk of scam attempts < low risk of scam attempts
Traders can provide evidence of payment / receipt Traders can provide evidence of payment / receipt and Verification of payment can be made using PageSigner or similar Traders will be unable to provide evidence of payment / receipt
Minimum limit at least equal to at least account limits protocols No minimum limits Minimum limit not able to achieve account limits protocols
Maximum limits equal to at least 0.01 BTC Large payment limits up to 2 BTC Maximum limit is less than 0.01 BTC
Likely to increase liquidity Likely to increase liquidity and open markets for different countries and currencies Likely to decrease liquidity
Low risk of mediation Very low risk of mediation < low risk of mediation
Low risk for traders from government agencies No risk for traders from government agencies < low risk for traders from government agencies
Fees should not be a barrier to trading No fees for transactions Fees will be a barrier to trading
Only minor changes needed to trade protocol No changes needed to trade protocol > Minor changes needed to trade protocol

Score: 25/32 Percentage: 78.13%

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

Skrill - Proposed National Currency Payment Method

I am proposing that Skrill be added as a national currency payment method.

@refund-agent2, @huey735, @leo816 please let me know if you have any questions as to how Skrill will be mediated / arbitrated. If you have any objection please let me know by 31 May 2021.

Date proposal being made: 02.05.21 Date feedback to be provided by: 31.05.21

Name of payment method: Skrill

Required fields (eg)

Currencies accepted

Signing required: No

Bisq Limits: eg 0.25 BTC

Maximum trade duration: Set by payment method purchased from

Payment method limits: Please create as a 'buy-only' payment method (see notes above). Skrill accounts would be able to buy from any other following offers:

Any relevant information for users: None

Screenshot of expected GUI: TBC

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

This payment method is a more complicated to add then the others.

User that sets up a Skrill account will only be able make offers to buy BTC AND take offers to sell BTC.

Make offers to buy BTC would be able to be taken by any of the following payment methods:

Take offers to sell BTC would be able to be taken by any of the following payment methods:

Limits, trade windows will be determined by the sellers of BTC not the buyer of BTC.

Here is the UX design:

Payment method - Skrill

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

NB: Design above should replace 'Email' with 'Account owner full name'

pazza83 commented 3 years ago

Information required for Bisq software strings:

Hi @jmacxx here is the information for the strings.

Let me know if you need anything else:

Special info about any of the inputs required for creating the payment account:

Please note Skrill is a payment method that allows users to buy bitcoin in multiple fiat currencies. It is not possible to use Skrill to sell bitcoin.

It is, therefore, possible to use a Skrill account to:

Please ensure to include your full name that matches your full name in Skrill. This will ensure that when you send funds they show from being from yourself.

Special items to be aware about when sending payments (for BTC Buyers):

Please send payment only to the payment details of the BTC Seller as shown in Bisq.

Please send payment in the currency that matches the market that the offer took place on.

It is recommend to use your full name that matches your full name in Skrill in the payment description / reason for payment field. This will ensure that when you send funds they show from being from yourself.

Special items to be aware about when receiving payments (for BTC Sellers):

BTC Sellers should expect to receive payment via a third party (Skrill partner bank). This payment should be in the currency for the exact amount traded. The payee's name should be shown within the payment description or payee information. This allows you to identify the payment as being from the BTC buyer.