Replace Disqus with something open source and more robustly archival

cboettig commented 11 years ago

Features I want in a commenting system:

Mathjax Anything displaying natively on the site should render mathjax no problem. Disqus doesn't.
Markdown input for users
Ability to maintain a local archive of comments in the notebook repository. (Archiving Disqus comments requires downloading a separate XML file, not easily preserved in archival versions of the notebook).
Open source solution

* Other issues / features *

I don't particularly care for threading and sorting disqus does. Referencing commenters by handle or name seems satisfactory and respects the provenance of the discussion better. Others have already expressed this critique far more eloquently...

Possible alternatives to disqus

Static comments

Several Jekyll sites have proposed static or semi-static commenting systems. (See my exploration below).

A fully static system essentially uses a templated email link, and the comment is composed in the reader's email client. The email is then (semi?) automatically imported into the post using a Jekyll plugin and some liquid code.

While this simply and elegantly addresses all the problems above, I worry that the a-typical workflow, moving a user off the site and into their email client, might discourage conversation?

Open-source Disqus clones

Juvia might be an option?

Requires a subdomain to host a Ruby on Rails app using Phusion Passenger.
Good news is that Dreamhost provides free subdomains and one-click support for Passenger on those domains.
Bad news is Phusion doesn't work on subdomains, though another developer's fork might fix that: https://github.com/phusion/juvia/issues/13

Not convenient that I've never deployed a rails app, but the documentation looks passable...

Looks like a simple mysql database setup within the config file.

Unfortunately I am having issues executing the setup commands:

> bundle exec rake db:schema:load RAILS_ENV=production
Could not load sequel gem, so WordPress import will not work.
rake aborted!
No such file or directory - /home/cboettig/Documents/code/thirdparty/juvia/config/application.yml
/home/cboettig/Documents/code/thirdparty/juvia/lib/app_config.rb:76:in `block in <class:Railtie>'

Not sure what to try next, suppose I should file an issue?

cboettig commented 11 years ago

Well that was silly. https://github.com/phusion/juvia/issues/26#issuecomment-15939513

Other issues may be harder to overcome. ruby 0.9.3 doesn't seem to be on the dreamhost server, perhaps I can request that? Or install without root privileges, e.g. rvm? All this is seeming a bit complicated for an open source commenting solution. Might stick with exporting disqus comments for now.

cboettig commented 11 years ago

Alternative route: https://github.com/mpalmer/jekyll-static-comments

Would need some adapting. Simplest thing would be to replace comments button with an email link, and manually add comments to the _comments YAML database used by the plugin.

cboettig commented 11 years ago

Troubleshooting Pat's disqus to jekyll plugin, not working yet. see https://github.com/pathawks/jekyll-disqus-comments/issues/1#issuecomment-16544543

Tried this but am hitting errors on empty strings. Continued tweaking on static-comments branch.

sckott commented 11 years ago

Not sure if you have seen this yet, but what about using github issues for comments? http://ivanzuzak.info/2011/02/18/github-hosted-comments-for-github-hosted-blogs.html

sckott commented 11 years ago

Also, this seems more far fetched, but what about using app.net as a commenting system. They have free accounts now, so low barrier to entry, and I think you could build a plugin that supports markdown easily. just a thought

cboettig commented 11 years ago

thanks for the ideas. @NoamRoss talked me out of anything that requires having a particular account or introduces delays though... May just try and get that rake script working to pull an archival copy from the Disqus API...

Also, this seems more far fetched, but what about using app.net as a commenting system. They have free accounts now, so low barrier to entry, and I think you could build a plugin that supports markdown easily. just a thought

— Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHubhttps://github.com/cboettig/labnotebook/issues/83#issuecomment-19432372 .

sckott commented 11 years ago

agree, low barrier to entry is key

opattison commented 11 years ago

Not that I'm a fan of Disqus (in fact, I didn't have an account before I posted a reply on your blog yesterday), but in some important ways it is no less accessible than something like app.net (future-friendly issues aside for a moment). You could argue that app.net has a low barrier for entry, but so do Twitter/Facebook/Google authorization Disqus in some ways. Your most-used account or email address ends up being your authentication passport, giving the illusion of a de-siloed web for a brief moment. Or providing yet another reminder of the problem, in other cases!

Comments are a really tough problem to solve. I'm interested to see how you settle it. I've pretty much ruled out comments entirely for a couple of projects that I'm working on, both because of the permanence and authentication issues, and also because it is usually quite difficult to cultivate an active and productive community in The Comments.

One propriety solution I've recommended is simply saying "talk to me on Twitter/your network of choice" which is about as impermanent and fractured a solution as one could come up with. The only way I can justify it is by taking the problem to a larger scale and framing it as "is the purpose of comments to have comments or to connect individuals and carry on some conversation beyond an article or note?" I realize that's a bit of a cop-out, ultimately, but it does save me from having to hack Disqus or come up with some other sub-optimal solution.

I'm looking out for innovative solutions for comments/collaboration, like Jeremy Keith's machine tag illustrations, but more open and distributed.

cboettig commented 11 years ago

@opattison Interesting ideas, particularly the machine tagging. Not clear to me what is actually identifying the tags - e.g. does Jeremy's site need to query the Flickr API to identify if any photos have been tagged (obvious limitation of having to know where to look for the tags e.g. Flickr).

I've been convinced that there is a need for a real time commenting system. Leaning towards just pulling my disqus comments in XML from their API...)

opattison commented 11 years ago

Yes – Jeremy Keith's idea is more of a hacky proof-of-concept that there are still innovative ideas in commenting, at least as I see it. I barely know how it works, but it is a neat concept. It's actually pretty surprising that the feature survived since 2007 on his site.

And as far as Disqus API, go for it.

FooBarWidget commented 11 years ago

If you're looking for a hosting option that supports Juvia, maybe Heroku or RailsMachine is an option for you?

cboettig commented 10 years ago

Currently opting for keeping an archive of the exported disqus XML so at least comment data can be independently preserved. Crude but simple. Archive in assets/comments

cboettig / labnotebook