'Date Added' sorting sorts in unexpected ways for some users

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Prior to 0.71 the Date Added sort option was based on the date the movie
was added to Moving Pictures database. Now with 0.71 it is based on the
date modified timestamp on a file.

I find this less useful as this filestamp is not always accurate,
particuarly if the movie was extracted from an archive that was made years
ago - the file stamp will be unaffected from when it was put into the archive.

There was originally talk of a checkbox in the config to switch between
'date added = date modified' and 'date added = date added to MP'. I would
be happy if this functionality was added so that everyone can make their
own choice.

Thanks

Original issue reported on code.google.com by grimn...@gmail.com on 19 Feb 2009 at 2:50

[GoogleCodeExporter]

I always support choices... however, I do not support having the date added the 
only 
option.

As previously discussed, this is very limited in that if you reset your 
database you 
loose the date added and everything will be in order of alphabetical.

If both options are there, then there is no issue..

Original comment by elspa...@gmail.com on 19 Feb 2009 at 7:13

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Original comment by conrad.john on 19 Feb 2009 at 8:21

• Changed state: Accepted
• Added labels: Component-GUI, Milestone-0.8.0, Priority-Medium, Usability

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[deleted comment]

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Maybe it could also be called 'Date' in the GUI dropdown box ?

Not sure if there is a seperate issue for this, but, also changeable in the 
actual 
program rather than config ?

Last but not least ;) use 'date modified' as 'date created' appears to be wrong 
for 
the actual meaning of it in Windows... See other date thread for expalanation 
(issue 
333)

Original comment by elspa...@gmail.com on 21 Feb 2009 at 4:19

[GoogleCodeExporter]

I think we will not be changing the text in the GUI elspaldo. The purpose of 
this 
sorting feature is to sort in the order in which you added the files to your 
system, 
and the existing text does a good job describing this.

As for how this functionality will work, we have not decided on anything yet, 
and I 
think we need to think more on the issue. I think a manual setting is not the 
right 
way to go though, sorting is a simple feature and this is not something the 
user 
should have to configure to get their system to work right. Everyone has a 
common 
understanding of "date added" and it should work correctly for everyone out of 
the 
box. It should not depend on correctly setting some hidden advanced setting.

We are going to shelve this issue for a while though so hopefully we can come 
back to 
it with a fresh head when we implement it. Hopefully come up with a clever 
solution 
that works for everyone.

Original comment by conrad.john on 22 Feb 2009 at 5:00

• Changed title: 'Date Added' sorting sorts in unexpected ways for some users
• Added labels: Priority-Low, Type-Defect
• Removed labels: Priority-Medium, Type-Enhancement

[GoogleCodeExporter]

I am just throwing a suggestion your way.  I am more than happy with the way it 
currently works.  I have my system sorting/listing perfect :)  

Thanks for the work thus far with this issue.  I hope if it does change, its 
not 
going to affect the current method.

Original comment by elspa...@gmail.com on 24 Feb 2009 at 11:39

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Using the created/modified date creates an issue, as stated above, when the 
file 
comes from an archive. From what I can tell, the date modified does change if 
the 
file is copied or moved, which is probably the case for the vast majority. To 
that, 
I think using the date modified is the best solution for now, especially if you 
have 
to rebuild your database for some reason. 

The ultimate option is going by when the movie was actually added to m-p and 
recording that in a flatfile so that subsequent db rebuilds can pull from 
there. I 
think there's an effort to come up with a schema for such a file and store 
other 
info in it as well. That ought to take care of this issue for everyone. JM2c.

Original comment by jeremy.j...@gmail.com on 24 Feb 2009 at 9:13

[GoogleCodeExporter]

That sounds like a good suggestion. Keep an XML copy of the database perhaps, 
for
later importing/direct editing.

Original comment by grimn...@gmail.com on 24 Feb 2009 at 10:08

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Using created/modified date as 'date added' creates an issue when;

a) File has been stored in an archive (which is like most downloaded movies)
b) File has been corrupted in someway (often happens during re-format of OS)
c) File has been altered in some way (f.ex. adding subs to a mkv-container)
d) File gets altered by third-party applications

That's 4 reasons not to use created/modified date as 'date added'.

I think the only real good solution to this, is as stated above, to use the 
actual
time when the movies are added to the database, and use flatfiles to store it 
for
later use. There are two options to do this;

1) Store all dates for all movies in 1 file, stored at the same place as the db
2) Store date for one movie, in a hidden file, in the same dir, and with the 
same
name, as the movie

Original comment by joac...@tingvold.com on 16 May 2009 at 12:53

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Both solutions have pros and cons joachim. Using the date a movie was added to 
the 
database does not work retoractively for pre-existing collections. Plus it 
makes things 
difficult if you want to rebuild your database. The solution there would be an 
export/import system, but frankly I feel like this adds a lot of complexity to 
a fairly 
minor aspect of the plugin. Ultimately we will probably add an advanced setting 
so you 
can use one or the other, the date modified stamp from the file or when it was 
inserted 
into the database. Then in the future (another issue) we will add NFO file 
support 
which could be used to backup and restore stuff like this.

Original comment by conrad.john on 16 May 2009 at 1:23

[GoogleCodeExporter]

In the upcoming version with filter-support, how would you be able to filter 
out the
20 latest movies added, or all movies added 'today' or 'this week' if you don't 
use
the date the movie was added to the database? (I'm not saying this would be a
supported filter in the first version, but I do hope it comes sooner or later)

Original comment by joac...@tingvold.com on 16 May 2009 at 2:14

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[deleted comment]

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Please keep discussion about filtering in the appropriate thread. This area is 
for 
discussion about date sorting. Also if you do not have an idea to add to the 
discussion, and are simply asking about what is planned, please stick to the 
MediaPortal forums. 

Original comment by conrad.john on 16 May 2009 at 5:27

[GoogleCodeExporter]

I also think it should be date added to the database and not the last time 
stamp on
the file system.  If the date added is in a field in the db (I assume it is but
haven't double checked), we could expose the date via movie manager and allow 
the
user to change the value if needed.

Perhaps the default behavior for an empty database (movie count ==0) is that it 
does
use the time stamp but after that its date added to db.

Original comment by gship...@gmail.com on 21 May 2009 at 2:06

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Do you realise that if you reset your database or loose it... that then all the 
work 
you have for dates will be gone?  I want my movies in the age date so that the 
newer 
ones are up the top.  The method you are suggesting that it is only date added 
and 
not time stamp means this would not be possible.

Original comment by elspa...@gmail.com on 22 May 2009 at 12:42

[GoogleCodeExporter]

To me it looks like the best hybrid system would be use the date the movie was 
added
to the database as the import date, but add an Export functionality (perhaps a 
simple
XML file) to backup the database in case of loss. Best of both worlds. In 
reality,
how often does anybody intentionally reset their database? 

Original comment by grimn...@gmail.com on 22 May 2009 at 1:20

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Every new version / reinstall... or if I setup a system for someone with old 
movies.  Then everytime I make a new database.  I dont want to export it, just 
re-
create it.

Original comment by elspa...@gmail.com on 22 May 2009 at 3:54

[GoogleCodeExporter]

New versions just upgrade over the top, no need to blank the database and 
re-scan.
The databases may be portable as they are - that I am not sure of - if you 
recreated
the same directory structure it uses for the MovingPictures DB and imagery on a
second machine. Could be worth a try.

I guess the ultimate solution is a tickbox to decide how dates are handled for
importing - by file creation/modified date, or by file addition to database 
date,
perhaps with the further addition of an export database function. Then the end 
user
can choose their preference, safe in the knowledge that either way their 
database can
be restored.

Original comment by grimn...@gmail.com on 22 May 2009 at 4:05

[GoogleCodeExporter]

To be honest, the way this works in the current version, that 'date added' is 
when
the file was modified last, has no function at all for many users. The only way 
to
solve this in a way that "everyone" is satisfied, is to make a checkbox of some 
kind,
so that each user can choose how it should work. This would be fairly easy and 
fast
to implement, and could hopefully be included in 0.8.0!

However, at a later milestone, as John mentioned earlier, the 'date added'-field
would be saved in a NFO-file, so that if the database is reset in someway, or 
you use
multiple computers or whatever reason it is, the 'date added' would be saved. 
The
'date added' in the NFO-file would depend on what you choose in the settings. 

Original comment by joac...@tingvold.com on 26 May 2009 at 11:47

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Original comment by conrad.john on 26 Jun 2009 at 6:33

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Sorry folks, I just don't think we will have time to look at this before 0.8. 
We are 
already behind on the release and we really need to get it out the door.

Original comment by conrad.john on 22 Jul 2009 at 10:32

• Added labels: Milestone-0.9.0
• Removed labels: Milestone-0.8.0

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Created an advanced menu option with three choices: created, modified, and 
current.

Original comment by gship...@gmail.com on 6 Nov 2009 at 9:05

Attachments:

• issue355DateImport.patch

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Original comment by conrad.john on 14 Nov 2009 at 7:07

• Changed state: Started
• Added labels: Milestone-0.8.0, Priority-High
• Removed labels: Milestone-0.9.0, Priority-Low

[GoogleCodeExporter]

Applied gshipley's patch in r898. So there is now an advanced setting to choose 
how the 
Date Added field is populated. Options are the file created date, modified 
date, or the 
date the Movie was added to the database (effectively the current date).

Also added a menu item in the Movie Manager to update the Date Added field for 
all 
EXISTING movies (modifying the advanced setting affects only future imports).

To anyone that is running a self-built SVN version of Moving Pictures, feedback 
would 
be very welcome.

And thanks for the patch gshipley!

Original comment by conrad.john on 14 Nov 2009 at 10:21

• Changed state: FixedCompleted