ADDI7013 programming - Githubissues

Greetings, I couldn't find a better way to communicate with you. I bumped into this AstroCam project accidentally because I've been searching for information on ISTAG CCD drivers like ADDI7013 or ADDI7015, I'm trying to design astronomical CCD camera. While Analog Devices is ignoring my e-mail inquires on this matter, I was wondering if you could share some guidance on how to program them? Sorry for bugging you.

Interesting, my hobby project has been to make my own astro camera. ;-)

Yeah, what I found was that the ADDI701x docs aren't very helpful and the support nonexistent. The guy that drove the creation of those chips has left the company, so there's also that.

How far are you on yours? I've gotten side-tracked quite a bit, so my project is still on-hold.

PKE

On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 3:18 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Greetings, I couldn't find a better way to communicate with you. I bumped into this AstroCam project accidentally because I've been searching for information on ISTAG CCD drivers like ADDI7013 or ADDI7015, I'm trying to design astronomical CCD camera. While Analog Devices is ignoring my e-mail inquires on this matter, I was wondering if you could share some guidance on how to program them? Sorry for bugging you.

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Hi, nice to meet you. The camera I'm designing is at a very early stage. I've got lucky to obtain a giant KAF-16803 sensor and would like to build a camera as compact as possible, hence my interest in Analog Devices AFE, it replaces a lot of discrete electronics. BTW, I've designed and built a couple astronomical cameras before.

So, I had this question for you if you don't mind. What is the output file of ISATG software and how you load it into AADI701x chip?

Cheers!

On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 5:52 PM engstad notifications@github.com wrote:

Interesting, my hobby project has been to make my own astro camera. ;-)

Yeah, what I found was that the ADDI701x docs aren't very helpful and the support nonexistent. The guy that drove the creation of those chips has left the company, so there's also that.

How far are you on yours? I've gotten side-tracked quite a bit, so my project is still on-hold.

PKE

On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 3:18 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Greetings, I couldn't find a better way to communicate with you. I bumped into this AstroCam project accidentally because I've been searching for information on ISTAG CCD drivers like ADDI7013 or ADDI7015, I'm trying to design astronomical CCD camera. While Analog Devices is ignoring my e-mail inquires on this matter, I was wondering if you could share some guidance on how to program them? Sorry for bugging you.

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.

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Nice to meet you!

As far as I remember (but I will check closer this weekend), the CCD drivers are running sort of an assembly language, backed by a very simple "CPU" (though state-machine, is probably a better term). This is what drives the horizontal drivers. I tried to run their DOS tools to create these assembly programs, but that didn't work for me. I also tried to reverse-engineer the assembly format, but there were definitely bits in there that I don't understand. Either way, what I came to conclude was that I would only use the ADDI7013 for read-outs, not for running the horizontal/vertical drivers. I'm already needing an FPGA in order to turn the LVDS signals into storage, so the FPGA can just as well drive the sensor. In terms of programming the chip, it seems to be a fairly standard SPI interface to set internal registers. You just need to know the right addresses to set, because there are many!

Maybe you could help me out too? I'm still not 100% clear on how the CCD sensor works, especially with respect to the substrate, as well as the timing. I'm working with a Sony IXD something CCD, and their documentation of the horizontal/vertical timing is pretty horrible. What was the best "general" description of driving the CCD sensors? Who can answer things like, "if you want to take long exposure, how should you setup the timings?", "if you want to take a short exposure, but many (say 10 frames-per-second), how do you set it up?".

I'm also quite out of the depth in terms of what I need for the read-outs. Some designs are using two transistors, presumably to increase the current (?), while Analog Devices seem to use a specialized chip for it (current amplification?)

PKE

On Wed, Mar 6, 2019 at 5:04 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Hi, nice to meet you. My name is Denis. The camera I'm designing is at a very early stage. I've got lucky to obtain a giant KAF-16803 sensor and would like to build a camera as compact as possible, hence my interest in Analog Devices AFE, it replaces a lot of discrete electronics. BTW, I've designed and built a couple astronomical cameras before.

So, I had this question for you if you don't mind. What is the output file of ISATG software and how you load it into AADI701x chip?

Cheers! Denis Nikitin

On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 5:52 PM engstad notifications@github.com wrote:

Interesting, my hobby project has been to make my own astro camera. ;-)

Yeah, what I found was that the ADDI701x docs aren't very helpful and the support nonexistent. The guy that drove the creation of those chips has left the company, so there's also that.

How far are you on yours? I've gotten side-tracked quite a bit, so my project is still on-hold.

PKE

On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 3:18 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Greetings, I couldn't find a better way to communicate with you. I bumped into this AstroCam project accidentally because I've been searching for information on ISTAG CCD drivers like ADDI7013 or ADDI7015, I'm trying to design astronomical CCD camera. While Analog Devices is ignoring my e-mail inquires on this matter, I was wondering if you could share some guidance on how to program them? Sorry for bugging you.

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Thank you for the information. I guess I will stick with the ADDI idea for now and should I have no luck with it, I will definitely follow you path.

Yeah, I might be able to help, I understand CCDs pretty well. Could you specify what kind of sensor you use. Should be ICX... something if it is Sony, not IXD. They all are somewhat different so it's better to be more specific. Interlaced sensors should have the most nasty timing diagrams. I will tell you everything about substrate and clock signals ones you tell me the exact component. In general you can't use ADDI7013 directly with a CCD, that's because CCDs use strange voltage levels like 0V to -7V for vertical clocks, so you need to use a voltage level converter in between, which also should have an ability to drive high capacitance, that's because the CCD inputs have tens of nano-farads of input capacitance.

In terms of readout, again it all depends on specific CCD component. But normally any CCD has an open drain output amplifier stage, that kind of output stage produces current which depends on the light intensity in pixels. To convert that current into voltage that you measure with your ADC you need to connect the output to a load. Sometimes the load is built in the CCD sensor, like in some Sony chips, in that case the next stage will be a emitter follower based on BJT transistors. If the load is external, it can be just a resistor with emitter follower based on BJT transistors. Or it can be an active constant current load, like the one from Analog Devices. Active load has an advantage that it is more linear than the resistive one and also allows for faster readout , however it is also more noisy.

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 11:22 AM engstad notifications@github.com wrote:

Nice to meet you!

As far as I remember (but I will check closer this weekend), the CCD drivers are running sort of an assembly language, backed by a very simple "CPU" (though state-machine, is probably a better term). This is what drives the horizontal drivers. I tried to run their DOS tools to create these assembly programs, but that didn't work for me. I also tried to reverse-engineer the assembly format, but there were definitely bits in there that I don't understand. Either way, what I came to conclude was that I would only use the ADDI7013 for read-outs, not for running the horizontal/vertical drivers. I'm already needing an FPGA in order to turn the LVDS signals into storage, so the FPGA can just as well drive the sensor. In terms of programming the chip, it seems to be a fairly standard SPI interface to set internal registers. You just need to know the right addresses to set, because there are many!

Maybe you could help me out too? I'm still not 100% clear on how the CCD sensor works, especially with respect to the substrate, as well as the timing. I'm working with a Sony IXD something CCD, and their documentation of the horizontal/vertical timing is pretty horrible. What was the best "general" description of driving the CCD sensors? Who can answer things like, "if you want to take long exposure, how should you setup the timings?", "if you want to take a short exposure, but many (say 10 frames-per-second), how do you set it up?".

I'm also quite out of the depth in terms of what I need for the read-outs. Some designs are using two transistors, presumably to increase the current (?), while Analog Devices seem to use a specialized chip for it (current amplification?)

PKE

On Wed, Mar 6, 2019 at 5:04 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Hi, nice to meet you. My name is Denis. The camera I'm designing is at a very early stage. I've got lucky to obtain a giant KAF-16803 sensor and would like to build a camera as compact as possible, hence my interest in Analog Devices AFE, it replaces a lot of discrete electronics. BTW, I've designed and built a couple astronomical cameras before.

So, I had this question for you if you don't mind. What is the output file of ISATG software and how you load it into AADI701x chip?

Cheers! Denis Nikitin

On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 5:52 PM engstad notifications@github.com wrote:

Interesting, my hobby project has been to make my own astro camera. ;-)

Yeah, what I found was that the ADDI701x docs aren't very helpful and the support nonexistent. The guy that drove the creation of those chips has left the company, so there's also that.

How far are you on yours? I've gotten side-tracked quite a bit, so my project is still on-hold.

PKE

On Wed, Feb 27, 2019 at 3:18 PM dn76 notifications@github.com wrote:

Greetings, I couldn't find a better way to communicate with you. I bumped into this AstroCam project accidentally because I've been searching for information on ISTAG CCD drivers like ADDI7013 or ADDI7015, I'm trying to design astronomical CCD camera. While Analog Devices is ignoring my e-mail inquires on this matter, I was wondering if you could share some guidance on how to program them? Sorry for bugging you.

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Looked it up, it's a ICX825AQA, chip. 12V/-7V, with vertical drivers (VT1-4), and two sets of horizontal drivers (RG, LH1, H1S, H1T, H2S, H2T) and two outputs (it's split in left and right). The Sony data-sheet recommends to do something like this:

For driving the vertical lines (and the substrate control), I'm using a CXD3400N):

For the output, it's suggesting:

I'm not sure if I am supposed to additionally, or instead, use a ADA4800...

I'm gonna try to find a more meaningful description of its timing diagram. Bear with me.

I was able to find a schematics of a popular about 10 years ago Arthemis CCD astrocamera. It's based on ICX285 which is a slightly older version of your ICX825

http://www.pmdo.com/artdownloads/UnpopulatedBoards.pdf

See page 39. The output of the CCD is connected to the gate of a FET, which means the CCD output amplifier has built in load.

Also, I'm not sure if you're aware but Sony has discontinued most of its CCD sensors, so I'd recommend you to switch to the ON semicanductor CCDs, which is actually ex Kodak business.

Cheers

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 6:22 PM engstad notifications@github.com wrote:

Looked it up, it's a ICX825AQA, chip. 12V/-7V, with vertical drivers (VT1-4), and two sets of horizontal drivers (RG, LH1, H1S, H1T, H2S, H2T) and two outputs (it's split in left and right). The Sony data-sheet recommends to do something like this:

[image: image] https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/4720457/54002729-7a5b7700-4104-11e9-85fe-7aed5a17e370.png

For driving the vertical lines (and the substrate control), I'm using a CXD3400N):

[image: image] https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/4720457/54002602-0f11a500-4104-11e9-9170-006b73118d9f.png

For the output, it's suggesting:

[image: image] https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/4720457/54002390-3a47c480-4103-11e9-9e68-7e248094af16.png

I'm not sure if I am supposed to additionally, or instead, use a ADA4800...

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engstad / AstroCam

ADDI7013 programming #1