Some thoughts on current endgame, mustard, and prizes

[Code14715]

Vacuums, bonemeal, and logic levels are the only resources I'm gathering. Vacuums and bonemeal are idleable, and I'm autosolving logicat puzzles (which I'm aware messes with the game's balance, but, autosolving them or not, they currently are the grindiest and dullest resource in the game, simply because of the mass amount of puzzles that need to be done, and the inability to store a lot of them (still.)) These last few resources should last a long time, but the endgame is still in dire need of new content. Rather than make a new resource, ones like mustard should be expanded on.

Mustard is currently the most useless resource overall (it has some uses, but they don't last long.) It's among logic levels as one of the hardest to obtain in large numbers, as it requires active clicking, and each click only gives 24 mustard max. It also has the passive cost of being unable to use Automata Assemble. The option to use 20 mustard (not sure if per tool or not - can someone clarify?) to run AA, with the prize, gets rid of that, but still makes idling with mustarded tools disadvantageous.

It currently has one good use - Panther Rush. Bonemeal, however, is just so much easier to get that mustard very quickly comes to a point where it can't keep up. I currently require 4 mega mustard to level PR up once, which, with all tools mustarded, and doubletap, would require 165k clicks.

A way to expand on them, which is already somewhat done, is to use each tier of Molpy Downs and prizes as a way of either introducing a new resource, or shifting the focus to one that's not used much. We could then switch prizes around so that they are focused on boosting the resource for that tier, and then using the boosted production to boost other things. In this case, though, the prizes would likely have to be changed so that they aren't random, so that it's more easily balanced.

I had a few further thoughts on the matter, but I'm already rambling on quite a bit, and I wasn't really going anywhere with them, so I'll leave them out. Hopefully, at the least, this can spark some further discussion on the topic.

[eternaldensity]

Some good thought to help us rearrange prizes #724

[LucidCrux]

I think the real problem with the current endgame is that it wasn't really meant as the endgame. Or at least seems that way. I have a feeling players just got ahead of ed and his plans and that has kind of resulted in trying to balance things whos only purpose right now is to fairly straightfowardly get more of those same things. There really aren't any mechanics to the current end game. Look at the number of boosts for something like sand tools compared to anything beyond chips and blocks.

[MichealRein]

"when certain people (cough waveney cough) got too many castles I had to make up fictional prefixes to keep it going and we ended up with what we have now."

[Code14715]

@LucidCrux I feel like the game Waveney and I are playing is different than the one some others are playing. I don't mind the current gameplay at all. I really like it. Getting a resource to infinite, only to discover that theres another thats more difficult to obtain, and then coming up with new strategies to maximize production is a lot of fun to me.

As long as theres new mechanics behind the resource, I don't mind there being 100s of them to get to infinite. I suppose the problem lies in the mechanics behind the resources, though. Eventually coming up with new ones will be near impossible, and some of the new ones will be too easy, or too difficult. Which is what I figured to be the reason behind sand and castles having many more boosts. It'd have been too difficult to progress without them, much like Cookie Clicker.

[LucidCrux]

What I mean is that the stuff in now was never planned as endgame. It seems like waveney and maybe others are already getting the last couple 'stuff' to infinite only to find that there actually ISN'T anything after that. There may be a couple more odd boosts, but not content.

waveney had some good ideas for a 'meanwhile' or whatever mechanic that goes back toward the tool stuff, and there are hints of whatever it is ed wanted to do with dragon queen, hatchlings, etc. It's just not in yet. So I think trying to tweak and balance current 'endgame' is kind of an odd thing to do, since it isn't endgame, and whatever else is added might just take things in another direction.

There is another thread: #725, that I started so we might be able to chart things out a bit. If there is at least a vague outline of what we want content to be upto and including endgame, then it makes tweaking, adding new stuff, and whatever else a whole lot easier and meaningful.