HASS.IO v0.97.1 Lovelace Card not displaying correct KNX Operation Modes

[G8YTZ]

In the States UI thermostats appear with the ability to select one of the 4 KNX Operation Modes. With 0.97 the Lovelace Card only displays 3 Operation modes and these do not work to change the Operation mode. The picture shows the Graphic that is incorrect, but the "drill-down" is ok.

[G8YTZ]

Now at 103.x and still this issue persists. Is there any hope of this ever being looked at? I think this "Architectural clean-up" caused some major issues.

[0x0FA8]

106.2 has the same issues.

Please make the operation mode (presets) worked as it was in the 0.96 version!

[G8YTZ]

I agree, it is most annoying that this bug as not been fixed for months!

Justin.

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On 3 Mar 2020, at 18:48, SergeRPM notifications@github.com wrote:

 106.2 has the same issues.

Please make the operation mode (presets) worked as it was in the 0.96 version!

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[elupus]

That is because it's not a bug. It may be a lack of the feature to set presets directly from GUI. But it's not a bug.

[G8YTZ]

It’s a design fault then, it uses to work perfectly and now this error prevents the worldwide professional KNX BMS standard thermostat working properly with Home Assistant.

That’s a massive hit to the usefulness of HA. Remember the majority of new homes built in Germany use KNX, it has massive penetration in the hotel industry. Heathrow Airport? KNX of course.....

Justin.

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On 3 Mar 2020, at 19:08, Joakim Plate notifications@github.com wrote:

 That is because it's not a bug. It may be a lack of the feature to set presets directly from GUI. But it's not a bug.

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[elupus]

My home run knx.. I know what it is. But pressing the more info button to get to profiles is not that huge a problem. Also, it should not be too hard to install the custom GUI https://github.com/nervetattoo/simple-thermostat to be able to control that.

[G8YTZ]

Actually that’s very fiddly to do on a touch screen interface. The plan was to use an Android desk phone for each room as a room controller, but this issue prevents that.

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On 4 Mar 2020, at 05:49, Joakim Plate notifications@github.com wrote:

 My home run knx.. I know what it is. But pressing the more info button to get to profiles is not that huge a problem. Also, it should not be too hard to install the custom GUI https://github.com/nervetattoo/simple-thermostat to be able to control that.

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[pvizeli]

@Julius2342 was the maintainer and is not active around that anymore. So you need to wait until a new developer or exists developer buys a KNX and will fix that. Since KNX is not just cheap, I don't think that will happen soon.

[cyberjunky]

@pvizeli, too bad @Julius2342 doesn't maintain the KNX integration anymore, I use KNX too. I also created the toon_climate custom component, and had to fiddle with the code too to get it working after 0.96. Alas only mode settings are available in lovelace main thermostat card, you need the three dot menu to reach presets. Or use simple-thermostats like suggested above and option:

control:
          - preset

But I see the modes are also not displayed correctly (at least on/off heating should be there?) Will have a look for what it's worth.

[cyberjunky]

Actually, simple-thermostat,js works like you want I guess. Below your example. above the simple-thermostat like this:

      - entity: climate.wohnzimmer
        control:
          - preset
        type: 'custom:simple-thermostat'

Never mind the bogus temp settings, my thermostat is working on other ga's.

[cyberjunky]

Frontend devs should add a preset control flag and icons to the thermostat card as well.

[Julius2342]

Two kids at home don't scale. @pvizeli : Is there anybody on hass team, who can help us fixing the Climate integration, mainly how to convert the new settings into KNX climate modes?

Or more specific: tell me what was changed on HASS side which broke the climate modes on KNX. From what i see, the core of the problem is, that HASS introduced new climate modes - and oriented on modern devices like NEST. These modes are incompatible with KNX Modes and all mitigations yet did not work. Or made it even worse.

[cyberjunky]

What I noticed just now is that KNX climate doens't have hvac_action() implemented, which should return something like this (pseudo code)

    @property
    def hvac_action(self) -> Optional[str]:
        """Return the current running hvac operation."""
        if self._heating:
            return CURRENT_HVAC_HEAT
        if self._off:
            return CURRENT_HVAC_OFF
        else:
            return CURRENT_HVAC_IDLE

Will have a look

[cyberjunky]

Looking at config page and code, it all seems to work as designed (to new lovelace/climate standard)

climate presets: All presets are available (but only via three dot menu, this is by design, unless changed) Can be made more user friendly using simple-thermostat and control preset setting. or by change in design of lovelace thermostat. (frontend devs)

climate operation modes: In my first attempt, and in some screenshots above only the auto mode icon is visible. But if you specify on_off_address and on_off_state_address the device is seen as on_off capable and also shows the heat and off icon.

If not correct, please specify clearly what is missing/wrong, the long thread above is difficult to read through.

[G8YTZ]

I still don't understand why this Lovelace bug has not been fixed. Why can't we just roll back to as t was in 0.96 when it worked perfectly? Nobody asked for this change.

What people would like is an integrated scheduler (including thermostats where the operation mode change is available in the scheduler and with a decent user interface for the wife to use.

[elupus]

Because it's not a bug

[G8YTZ]

Everything worked perfectly before 0.97 and then it did not - so its a bug or fault my book. Faulty design perhaps. The designer failed to understand the consequences for a proper professional smart building solution like KNX and the power of knx operation modes in energy management.

[elupus]

You can then easily afford the time to write a custom Lovelace card to support your need for direct touch access to profiles. They work perfectly fine from the sub menu.

[G8YTZ]

If I was a coder... Which I am not, but system integration and telecommunications I do well.

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On 29 Apr 2020, at 13:02, Joakim Plate notifications@github.com wrote:

 You can then easily afford the time to write a custom Lovelace card to support your need for direct touch access to profiles. They work perfectly fine from the sub menu.

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[stale[bot]]

There hasn't been any activity on this issue recently. Due to the high number of incoming GitHub notifications, we have to clean some of the old issues, as many of them have already been resolved with the latest updates. Please make sure to update to the latest Home Assistant version and check if that solves the issue. Let us know if that works for you by adding a comment 👍 This issue now has been marked as stale and will be closed if no further activity occurs. Thank you for your contributions.

[G8YTZ]

No, I’m afraid the issue is still present on 0.113.3. It’s a real problem that requires fixing as the Lovelace Thermostat is more or less useless.

Justin.

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On 29 Jul 2020, at 06:13, stale[bot] notifications@github.com wrote:

 There hasn't been any activity on this issue recently. Due to the high number of incoming GitHub notifications, we have to clean some of the old issues, as many of them have already been resolved with the latest updates. Please make sure to update to the latest Home Assistant version and check if that solves the issue. Let us know if that works for you by adding a comment 👍 This issue now has been marked as stale and will be closed if no further activity occurs. Thank you for your contributions.

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[marvin-w]

@G8YTZ You should have a read through https://github.com/home-assistant/architecture/issues/22. This was the architectural design decision that forced us to implement a proper mapping to the available HomeAssistant HVACModes in the backend.

Please also read specifically this comment that makes it clear that we actively participated there: https://github.com/home-assistant/architecture/issues/22#issuecomment-454539431

From an architecture perspective this has been a tremendously huge change involving a lot of integrations and will not be rolled back (as it was a perfectly fine move from HA to streamline the climate entity).

Let me clarify this: The old lovelace card is not going to come back, you will always need to use the presets in order to do what you are trying to achieve.

Consider moving to the custom card mentioned by @cyberjunky if you can't afford to open the three dot menu.

I think there still is some weird issue with the duplicated HVAC_HEAT_MODE that should be fixed with the next release of xknx (if I recall correctly).

From my perspective the issue reported here is not an issue, but rather a result of a new architecture (and the related frontend changes).

Please also note one more thing: Due to the fact that XKNX supports literally all KNX devices for a specific type it's very hard to test if everything is working correctly since one usually doesn't own all needed devices from all vendors in all different variations in order to make a complete test.

[G8YTZ]

I still can’t understand a strategy that ignores a major worldwide standard in BMS systems in favour of the numerous smart home “toys” that come and go on the market. The fact remains that there was a perfectly working solution that now does not work.

Don’t get me wrong, I think Home Assistant is a fantastic project and I love the solution, but to ignore compatibility with such a major BMS standard is beyond comprehension to me and others who use KNX and it’s longevity and industrial strength qualities.

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On 23 Aug 2020, at 19:19, Marvin Wichmann notifications@github.com wrote:

 @G8YTZ You should have a read through home-assistant/architecture#22. This was the architectural design decision that forced us to implement a proper mapping to the available HomeAssistant HVACModes in the backend.

Please also read specifically this comment that makes it clear that we actively participated there: home-assistant/architecture#22 (comment)

From an architecture perspective this has been a tremendously huge change involving a lot of integrations and will not be rolled back (as it was a perfectly fine move from HA to streamline the climate entity).

Let me clarify this: The old lovelace card is not going to come back, you will always need to use the presets in order to do what you are trying to achieve.

Consider moving to the custom card mentioned by @cyberjunky if you can't afford to open the three dot menu.

I think there still is some weird issue with the duplicated HVAC_HEAT_MODE that should be fix with the next release of xknx (if I recall correctly).

From my perspective the issue reported here is not an issue, but rather a result of a new architecture (and the related frontend changes).

— You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub, or unsubscribe.

[marvin-w]

I mean it still is compatible, you just have to click one more button or just use that custom card that was mentioned.

We know the integration isn't perfect, but you have to make compromises in order to support multiple smart home solutions. Please test it. There will not be any improvement to the current lovelace card in terms of usability for KNX as this would break the integration for other climate platforms.

[G8YTZ]

Why not offer the old solution as an option? There are plenty of people who are not impressed with this change.

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On 23 Aug 2020, at 20:53, Marvin Wichmann notifications@github.com wrote:

 I mean it still is compatible, you just have to click one more button or just use that custom card that was mentioned.

We know the integration isn't perfect, but you have to make compromises in order to support multiple smart home solutions. Please test it. There will not be any improvement to the current lovelace card in terms of usability for KNX as this would break the integration for other climate platforms.

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[farmio]

This should be fixed. The default climate havc_mode is now "heat" since https://github.com/home-assistant/core/pull/35154 so it isn't viewed as "off" (grey) anymore.

[marvin-w]

You can always roll back to HA < 0.97 but this change will not come back. Feel free to use one of the alternatives provided or write your own custom lovelace card.

[G8YTZ]

I think it is time for a long term supported version. There are so many changes, constant changes to entity naming conventions for example it is difficult to keep a stable operational or supportable environment. An awful lot of investment in time is required where what’s really required is solution that once it is in an working stays working, even after an upgrade. Hopefully it will get there one day, but still this whole thermostat thing is a mess and before 0.97 is was so good.

One of the reasons that I went for KNX in my home is because the solution just works, you out it in on day one, configure it and it will work for 25 years or so without touching it or ever upgrading any firmware or software. My KNX installation is now 20 years old, I commissioned it in my self-build house, built 2010.

I’m not a software engineer, my background is radio and electronics and telecommunications/telemetry and BMS systems, though I have dabbled with software since 1974 and given time can work out most things, I just love the range of integrations in Home Assistant, but boy I wish when an upgrade was pushed that old working integrations carried on working.

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On 23 Aug 2020, at 22:45, Marvin Wichmann notifications@github.com wrote:

 You can always roll back to HA < 0.97 but this change will not come back. Feel free to use one of the alternatives provided or write your own custom lovelace card.

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