"nb device active for boiler" remains zero. My boiler won't turn on when vtherm ask for heat.

[djiwhy]

Hi everyone,

I have a problem with the control of my oil-fired boiler (switch.chaudiere). When it's 17°C in the office (external sensor : sensor.temp_bureau), and I ask the Vtherm (climate.vtherm_bureau) for 22°C, the underlying thermostat is modified to heat to 22°C as well. However, in the central configuration, "nb device active for boiler" remains at zero.

However, in the central configuration, the entities are correct, the services: switch.chaudiere/switch.turn_on and turn_off work, but as a result, my boiler won't start, even though my vtherm is set to "Heat" and the threshold is set to 1.

Version of the custom_component

release : 5.4.2

Configuration

My VTherm (climate.vtherm_bureau) attributes are the following:

hvac_modes:
  - "off"
  - heat
min_temp: 7
max_temp: 35
target_temp_step: 0.1
preset_modes:
  - none
  - frost
  - eco
  - comfort
  - boost
current_temperature: 16.7
temperature: 22
preset_mode: none
is_on: true
hvac_action: null
hvac_mode: heat
type: null
is_controlled_by_central_mode: true
last_central_mode: Heat only
frost_temp: 15
eco_temp: 17
boost_temp: 22
comfort_temp: 19
frost_away_temp: 15
eco_away_temp: 17
boost_away_temp: 17
comfort_away_temp: 17
power_temp: 13
target_temperature_step: 0.1
ext_current_temperature: 11.4
ac_mode: false
current_power: null
current_power_max: null
saved_preset_mode: none
saved_target_temp: 7
saved_hvac_mode: "off"
motion_sensor_entity_id: null
motion_state: null
power_sensor_entity_id: null
max_power_sensor_entity_id: null
overpowering_state: null
presence_sensor_entity_id: null
presence_state: null
window_state: "off"
window_auto_state: "off"
window_bypass_state: false
window_sensor_entity_id: binary_sensor.ouverture_fenetre_bureau
window_delay_sec: 30
window_auto_enabled: false
window_auto_open_threshold: 3
window_auto_close_threshold: 0
window_auto_max_duration: 60
window_action: window_turn_off
security_delay_min: 60
security_min_on_percent: 0.9
security_default_on_percent: 0
last_temperature_datetime: "2024-02-18T22:26:44.209366+01:00"
last_ext_temperature_datetime: "2024-02-18T22:33:20.569063+01:00"
security_state: false
minimal_activation_delay_sec: 10
device_power: 1
mean_cycle_power: null
total_energy: 0
last_update_datetime: "2024-02-18T22:39:59.978562+01:00"
timezone: Europe/Paris
temperature_unit: °C
is_device_active: true
ema_temp: 16.73
is_used_by_central_boiler: true
is_over_climate: true
start_hvac_action_date: null
underlying_climate_0: climate.bureau
underlying_climate_1: null
underlying_climate_2: null
underlying_climate_3: null
auto_fan_mode: auto_fan_none
current_auto_fan_mode: auto_fan_none
auto_activated_fan_mode: null
auto_deactivated_fan_mode: null
auto_regulation_use_device_temp: false
friendly_name: VTherm Bureau
supported_features: 401

Error Logs: `Cette erreur provient d'une intégration personnalisée

Logger: custom_components.versatile_thermostat.pi_algorithm Source: custom_components/versatile_thermostat/pi_algorithm.py:60 Integration: Versatile Thermostat configuration (documentation, issues) First occurred: 22:19:59 (3 occurrences) Last logged: 22:22:43

Temporarily skipping the self-regulation algorithm while the configured sensor for room temperature is unavailable`

I'm trying to: Activate the switch for the boiler with the service: switch.chaudiere/switch.turn_on when a Vtherm ask for heating

And I expect: A solution =)

But I observe this .... It didn't work :/

I read the documentation on the README.md file and I don't find any relevant information about this issue.

I need your help please :/

Thx

[jmcollin78]

Hello @djiwhy

Temporarily skipping the self-regulation algorithm while the configured sensor for room temperature is unavailable`

This means you have an issue with the temperature sensor and so nothing will work. Fix this, and see if the issue is still there.

[djiwhy]

Hello @jmcollin78

I can't correct this error. My temperature sensor (aqara) works with mqtt. Even in verbose mode, it does not return any communication or sensor unavailability errors.

So I tried another sensor (netatmo). Same thing. It doesn't seem to want an external sensor

So I ask VTHerm to take into account the underlying thermostat which is integrated into my trvs, but that doesn't trigger my boiler either.

This error is returned when I use a différent sensor rater than the trv integrated sensor (different from the climate sensor). However, the sensors are not in error 😮‍💨

[jmcollin78]

Hello @djiwhy ,

For the temperature sensor, you should have sensor entities, which should be visible in the Development Tools / State. Can you show me what you see in the Development Tools/ States for your temperature sensor ?

[djiwhy]

Sure @jmcollin78 .

This is an aqara zigbee temperature sensor that operates in zigbee via zigbee2mqtt. Do you think it's possible that the fact that the temperature is sometimes updated every hour (because the sensor only communicates if the temperature changes) is the cause of the problem?

No communications errors in z2m logs. And same issue with the trv sensor and another wifi sensor (netatmo). The temperature of the netatmo wifi sensor is taken from a climate over a template sensor with device_class: temperature and unit_of_measurement: °C.

[jmcollin78]

So all seems correct.

I see your parameter for security mode is security_delay_min: 60. So your sensor should send temperature at least every hour. Else your VTherm will come into security_mode. It was not the case, in your first post: security_state: false

Your update dates of temperature seems corrects, so I wonder if this error is relevant: Temporarily skipping the self-regulation algorithm while the configured sensor for room temperature is unavailable

Do you still have this error continuously ?

[jmcollin78]

Why do you give me the Polele à granulé thermostat ? Does it have something to do with the issue ?

[djiwhy]

Yep! Each Time I (re)start HASS. For the climate of my "poêle à granulés" it's a mistake sorry.

When I use another integration to regulate any room temperature with an aqara sensor as a external temp sensor, it seems to works correctly. When I Ask VTHerm to use the TRV integrated sensor, it's the same issue.

However, when creating the thermostat, I have to specify a different temp sensor, even if I have to use the TRV one. That's the only error I can find in the logs. I have nothing weird with z2m, the temperature sensor or the TRVs. Nothing either about the versatile thermostat integration. This is really the one and only error returned by HA. I've tried using ZHA or Aqara integration for a change, to be sure that z2m doesn't cause any problems. Again and again, this error. 😅

[djiwhy]

3 occurrences of this error because i have 3 configured climates with VTHerm.

When I Ask for 35°C, the VTHerm climate open the TRV correctly, but doesn't ask for the boiler Switch. Nb active for heating Always zero.

[jmcollin78]

Hello @djiwhy,

Je vais switcher en Français ce sera plus facile.

Yep! Each Time I (re)start HASS.

De ce que je lis, je pense que l'erreur sur la non dispo du capteur de température est passagère, ne se produit qu'au démarrage et peut donc être ignorée. Cela arrive en fonction de l'ordre de démarrage des intégrations par HA lui même. Si ce n'est pas qu'au démarrage, tu peux ignorer ces erreurs.

Si on regarde ton premier post, on voit bien que les températures remontent normalement:

last_temperature_datetime: "2024-02-18T22:26:44.209366+01:00"
last_ext_temperature_datetime: "2024-02-18T22:33:20.569063+01:00"

... even if I have to use the TRV one ...

Il ne faut pas utiliser le capteur de température du TRV lui-même. Je suppose que c'était juste pour un test.

Je te propose d'oublier cette histoire de capteur de température qui est une fausse piste, je pense.

[jmcollin78]

Sur le problème initial de la chaudière centrale qui n'est pas commandée, le compteur de devices actifs doit passer à 1 lorsque l'attribut is_device_active du VTherm devient true. C'était bien le cas dans le 1er post: is_device_active: true

Cet attribut passe à true lorsque le climate sous-jacent (climate.bureaudans ton cas), a son attribut hvac_action sur autre chose que Idleou Off.

Si je regarde les attributs de ton climate.bureau, je ne vois pas de hvac_action :

Le code qui fait ça est là:

@property
    def is_device_active(self):
        """If the toggleable device is currently active."""
        if self.is_initialized:
            return (
                self._underlying_climate.hvac_mode != HVACMode.OFF
                and self._underlying_climate.hvac_action
                not in [
                    HVACAction.IDLE,
                    HVACAction.OFF,
                ]
            )
        else:
            return None

En l'absence de hvac_action, je n'ai aucun moyen de savoir que le device est actif ou pas. C'est ce qui explique que ça ne marche pas dans ton cas.

Et je ne vois pas comment faire sans : je ne vois rien dans les attributs qui pourrait m'indiquer que le device est actif. Si je me base que sur hvac_mode, tu risques d'allumer la chaudière alors qu'aucun TRV n'est actif -> risque pour la chaudière.

Tu m'en vois navré. La seule solution serait de changer les TRVs (les Shelly TRV sont ce que je recommande)... C'est quelle marque que tu as ?

[djiwhy]

OMG ! En réalité c'est d'une logique imparable, j'ai passé plusieurs jours à tenter de chercher le pourquoi du comment côté code mais pas côté vannes ! Le pire, c'est que j'ai déjà été confronté à ce problème quand je tentais (en vain) de faire ce que tu propose à coups de scripts et d'automatisations des enfers. Je suis désolé de t'avoir fait perdre du temps là dessus.

J'ai des vannes de radin, des MOES TV01-ZB en gros les vannes à piles qui régulent très mal, fabriquées par une usine obscure et vendue sous différentes marques chinoises.

Bref, une de plus à rajouter à la liste des incompatibilités.

Merci de ta patience pour mon cas. Et tu m'en vois encore navré pour la perte de temps de ton côté. Acheter chinois c'est bien, mais une marque reconnue c'est quand même mieux... Go remplacer tout ce petit monde par des Shelly alors. Quoi que les NETATMO sont en promo chez mon CastoMerlin du coin... Bonne continuation ;)

[jmcollin78]

Les Shelly ont l'avance qu'on peut commander le pourcentage d'ouverture directement depuis HA et donc depuis VTherm avec le type over_valve. C'est la meilleure façon de réguler.

[djiwhy]

Merci de ces précieux conseils. J'en prends bonne note. Toute manière, je ne les voyaient pas si peu chères ces vannes. Enfin pas chères, tout est relatif mais pour les fonctionnalités et la qualité de ce que propose la marque habituellement... Bref. Merci encore, les Shelly sont commandées 👍

[jmcollin78]

Tu me feras un retour quand tu auras tout configuré, ça me permet de donner des conseils pertinents aux autres. Donc il faudra que tu changes tes VTherm over_climate en VTherm over_valve.

[tbrasser]

Can I get an English summary of what's discussed here? I seem to have the same problem.

[jmcollin78]

Can I get an English summary of what's discussed here? I seem to have the same problem.

Yes sorry but sometimes it is more simplier to talk with the native language to be sure we understand each other. My English is not my best skill.

In one word: hvac_action of the TRV is not set. So VTherm cannot works because it need this information. So I suggest to buy Shelly TRV in which you can control directly the valve open percent. This is done via Vtherm over valve type and it is the best way to regulate and save money.

If you need more details, Google translate is your friend: https://translate.google.com/?hl=fr&sl=fr&tl=en&op=translate