Windows NT, 2000, XP - how to install them as guest?

Torinde commented 2 years ago

Question

Version 0.84.0 among other things "fixes problems with the IDE driver in Windows NT 4.0, Windows 2000, and Windows XP and allows them to boot properly"

At NOTES there are mentioned:

WinNT 3.1 - workaround making it possible to boot since long time ago
WinNT 3.51, NT4, 2000 - couldn't boot in the past
WinXP - copies a few files and gives an error

My attempts with 0.84.0 are unsuccessful so far. Following the NOTES files, after first installing MS-DOS 6.22 I ran "WINNT.EXE /b" from an NT4 ISO and setup finished properly - but on first boot I got a crash:

From what I see floppy emulation is still missing (#3436), correct? So, it's either via MSDOS and WINNT.EXE /b - or via CD.ISO boot, correct?

I get "El Torito bootable floppy not found" when trying "imgmount a -bootcd d" - for ISOs of NT4, 2000, ReactOS, Vista. Strangely OS/2 4.52 ISO was accepted as bootable, but crashes:

Haven't tried NT3.1, NT3.5 and XP yet.

After mounting some of the CDs and looking inside DOSbox finds only a README.TXT file stating 'your OS needs to support UDF', 'your OS needs to support Joliet' - not sure if I do something wrong? would be nice if DOSbox-X can read those directly.

Will there be guide(s) added to the wiki about those? @rderooy

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maxpat78 commented 9 months ago

That's the Dynamic VHD container header with its default, standard, omnipresent "Wi2k" signature: it's the raw disk container, it doesn't matter in any way with the underlying (=contained) partitions and/or file-systems you've created!

BridgeHeadland commented 9 months ago

There's something I've discovered lately: when I install Windows XP in the current version of DOSBox-X, both the official build and the developer builds, I don't get East Asian language files installed along the way anymore. among the last dev builds I've tried (haven't tried the last two), I can't even use the standard taskbar of the mentioned Windows (the green and blue one), the only one I can use is the classic one. I could maybe create a new issue for it, but no one has written anything on the last issues I've created.

BridgeHeadland commented 8 months ago

Again I installed Windows XP in DOSBox-X from yesterday's developer build, that is not only that I can't install East Asian language files, and can't use taskbar styles other than the classic one, but now I can't open Display, and can't use desktop backgrounds, other than the blue one, you know.

joncampbell123 commented 8 months ago

At least from my experience (the en-us builds of Windows XP) you have to install the east Asian support separately.

How are you immediately getting to the desktop? In my tests, Windows XP installs and boots OK but the OOBE thing never comes up and I have to use an activation crack to even be able to login to the desktop.

BridgeHeadland commented 8 months ago

@joncampbell123 It may be because I have converted from FAT32 to NTFS in the VHD file, which is 32000MB, there has never been a problem before. According to my calculations, something may have happened between the September launch and the October launch, and nothing has improved during the dev builds and the nightly builds since the last launch.

BridgeHeadland commented 8 months ago

@joncampbell123 I recently realized that I had to set machine to svga_s3, instead of svga_s3virgevx, which I usually do, vmemsize to 8, instead of 16, and convertdrivefat to false, so now everything is back to normal. Windows XP does not use S3 at all.

BridgeHeadland commented 8 months ago

Apparently not many people have noticed this issue, so I am linking to it here. It is related to Windows NT in DOSBox-X in general. https://github.com/joncampbell123/dosbox-x/issues/4822

Torinde commented 7 months ago

4907

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

In recent commits you should be able to El Torito boot the CD directly now if it uses "no emulation' mode as Windows 2000/XP/etc CDs do.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

In recent commits you should be able to El Torito boot the CD directly now if it uses "no emulation' mode as Windows 2000/XP/etc CDs do.

More recent than 1.3.24 release?

Torinde commented 7 months ago

More recent than 1.3.24 release?

Yes, https://github.com/joncampbell123/dosbox-x/commit/4120aec57ee614813ded3aeafd43a9c5b6d0ec40

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

I've just tried with the latest commit issuing:

IMGMOUNT D D:\SWSETUP\FD13LIVE.iso -ide 1s
BOOT D:

but it does not work.

Please notice that, when I was experimenting my El Torito patches with previous DOSBox-X revisions, FreeDOS was the only NoEmul ISO that booted correctly (NT/2K probably need more accuracy with some interrupts).

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

Like this:

IMGMOUNT D D:\SWSETUP\FD13LIVE.iso -ide 1s
BOOT -el-torito D:

You have to tell BOOT you want to use the El Torito extensions.

Torinde commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 - from the CHANGELOG:

The BOOT command now supports El Torito "no emulation" booting from a CD-ROM drive, which is needed to boot install CDs for Windows XP, Linux, etc. or Linux-based live CDs. Note that at this time, BOOT only supports "no emulation" and IMGMOUNT only supports "floppy emulation" (joncampbell123).

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

Like this:
IMGMOUNT D D:\SWSETUP\FD13LIVE.iso -ide 1s
BOOT -el-torito D:
You have to tell BOOT you want to use the El Torito extensions.

Ok, @joncampbell123: NT 4.0 Wks CD-ROM now boots, and setup goes on well (FreeDOS' one too, obviously) - but a crash occurs at NTFS conversion step after 1st reboot, as reported by @BridgeHeadland. Windows 2000 CD-ROM Setup starts as well.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 FAT to NTFS conversion is performed successfully by NT 4.0 Wks setup if the disk size is 1 GB (with 2 GB it raised the infamous BSOD). Also, I used Dynamic VHD format emitted by DOSBox-X without problems @BridgeHeadland.

However, 2 issues remains: 1) DOSBox-X has to be rebooted manually (the command issued by setup causes the VM to power-off instead of reboot); 2) I can't IMGMOUNT/BOOT the VHD just converted in NTFS, due to DOSBox-X requiring FAT file-system: any suggestion about how to boot the "raw" partition?

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

IMGMOUNT won't mount the image, not even with -fs none?

VHD images as far as I know record the geometry of the image as part of the header.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

In case the time will smile, I installed all three pre-2000 WNTs in IMG files and it went without a problem, as expected, but as someone who prefers VHD over IMG, mostly due to the storage limitations in IMG, which VHD does not have. I recently used StarWind Software to convert the three IMG files to VHD, both fixed and dynamic, I also converted all the fixed VHD files with pre-installed pre-Vista WNTs, as well as all Windows 9x, to dynamic , with Hyper-V (I could also use StarWind). Even the fixed VHD files of Windows Server 2003 Datacenter Edition, Windows Longhorn 4015 and Windows Home Server, which are currently semi-installed, have been converted to dynamic ones. Now I have all the Windows from Windows NT 3.1 to Windows Home Server pre-installed (completely or partly) in dynamic VHD files, except for Windows Vista, where I'd rather settle for an early beta. Currently, only Windows 9x can be run, since they are in the FAT32 file system, the Windows NT ones I can't run. If anyone is interested, I have now uploaded images of the results of what happens when I try to run Windows Nt 4.0 and Windows XP in dynamic VHD files.

For those who don't know: here is my tutorial on how to install Windows NTs in DOSBox-X. The first post will be updated eventually, and possibly corrected if necessary. https://github.com/joncampbell123/dosbox-x/discussions/4907

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 Ok, confirmed.

NT 4.0 CD-ROM setup starts correctly with:

IMGMOUNT D NTWKS40IOEM.iso -ide 2m
BOOT -el-torito D:

After the text-mode part, to access the GUI phase, system has to be restarted with:

IMGMOUNT D NTWKS40IOEM.iso -ide 2m
IMGMOUNT 2 nt.img -ide 1m -fs none -t hdd
BOOT C:

Actually, VHD must be avoided, since, again, something does not work with it if NTFS is chosen, and requires further investigations (NTLDR not present error if used "plain", or converted from good IMG; "Unaccessible boot device" BSOD if converted to IMG and booted).

P.S. Comparing checksums of all 1536 files contained in the good IMG and in the "bad" VHD resulting from IMG->VHD conversion shows that no corruption occurred.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 @Torinde P.P.S.: the NT 4.0 post-CUI setup fails only if the VHD has been formatted with NTFS: if FAT is chosen during text mode setup, CUI and GUI stages both complete and reboot without errors. So the bug is related to some sort of interaction between DOSBox-X VHD and NTFS.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 It's correct, it's true that the corruption doesn't happen during the conversions. I have converted the dynamic VHD file with Windows NT 4.0 back to the fixed IMG file, to check if Windows is as good as it was to begin with, and it was.

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 Ok, confirmed.

NT 4.0 CD-ROM setup starts correctly with:
IMGMOUNT D NTWKS40IOEM.iso -ide 2m
BOOT -el-torito D:
After the text-mode part, to access the GUI phase, system has to be restarted with:
IMGMOUNT D NTWKS40IOEM.iso -ide 2m
IMGMOUNT 2 nt.img -ide 1m -fs none -t hdd
BOOT C:
Actually, VHD must be avoided, since, again, something does not work with it if NTFS is chosen, and requires further investigations (NTLDR not present error if used "plain", or converted from good IMG; "Unaccessible boot device" BSOD if converted to IMG and booted).

P.S. Comparing checksums of all 1536 files contained in the good IMG and in the "bad" VHD resulting from IMG->VHD conversion shows that no corruption occurred.

Ah, yes. DOSBox-X does not emulate the INT 19h "chain" of booting, meaning that if you don't respond to the CD bootloader prompt, and it calls INT 19h to boot the next device, INT 19h handling reboots the system same as it does on DOSBox SVN and all other forks.

EDIT: Hm, or apparently the Windows XP version of the CD boot prompt knows how to just load the hard drive and execute it without INT 19h.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 @Torinde This is the state of the art with Windows NT 4.0 Workstation setup and VHD in DOSBox-X.

VHDMAKE generated                   NTFS ok

IMGMAKE generated                   NTFS...
  Setup format NTFS                 ...boot sector "error reading disk" after NTFS conversion
  Setup erase previous part.        ...boot sector "error reading disk" after NTFS conversion
  Setup convert NTFS                ...boot sector "error reading disk" after NTFS conversion

So, the problem with VHD seems limited to IMGMAKE-generated VHD and arises with the NTFS conversion operated by NT setup after the first reboot.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 @Torinde @BridgeHeadland Ok, I've found what's the problem with NT 4.0 setup & VHD disks.

Given the 1GiB VHD, IMGMAKE calculates (and applies) the disk geometry 520x64x63, while NT setup 130x255x63.

As soon I've changed the C-H-S at runtime while debugging IMGMAKE program, the NTFS conversion magically took place and the reboot into GUI was successfully.

In other words, it seems that NT FAT-to-NTFS conversion routine does not like "real" DOS geometries with less than 255 Heads.

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

So Windows NT requires "LBA assisted" even for 1GB drives?

How did it work then with BIOSes that did the other modes of C/H/S translation? Or did Windows NT just not work with them at all?

https://retrocomputing.stackexchange.com/tags/chs/info

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

So Windows NT requires "LBA assisted" even for 1GB drives?

How did it work then with BIOSes that did the other modes of C/H/S translation? Or did Windows NT just not work with them at all?

https://retrocomputing.stackexchange.com/tags/chs/info

Allright. I've just committed #4941 to address the issue (in fact, IMG file format worked right with NTFS, so it had to be VHD related).

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

I have actually noticed that the VHD file of size 32000 (31.25 GB) I created earlier, which was originally fixed, converted to NTFS and where I installed Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005, now has the problem that I cannot start the said Windows in DOSBox-X (latest nightly build), after I converted the VHD from fixed to dynamic with Hyper-V. I have created a dynamic VHD file from DOSBox-X, and installing Windows XP in it, as well as converting from FAT32 to NTFS was completely possible, unlike before, only that the screen resolution cannot be larger (or smaller) than 640x480, and that the desktop background is not with the famous green meadow, but the blue color associated with Windows ME (#3A6EA5), because I can't get into Display. I can install Windows Media Player, the installable one, right after Windows is installed, I can install anything along with Windows XP, from the installation CD itself, I can activate Windows XP with xp_activate32.exe, but I cannot upgrade Windows XP with the latest upgrades. During the installation of Windows XP, I was able to do a full installation (custom, you might say), even everything related to East Asian languages. I just converted the newly dynamic VHD file (with StarWind this time, since that program is available with me right now) with freshly installed Windows XP, to fixed, to see if it is possible to do what I couldn't do while the VHD file was dynamic. I have now opened DOSBox-X with the correct configurations, to see if it is possible to run a Windows XP, which I installed in the NTFS-converted VHD file, which was dynamic until now. I've typed "boot c:", pressed enter, now it says "Booting from drive C . . .", but it just flashes all the time, I can't start Windows XP. I just wanted to mention it to confirm how inflexible (but more flexible compared to before) DOSBox-X is now, when it comes to Windows XP in dynamic VHD files with NTFS.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

I've just successfully setup Windows ME in Virtualbox 7 on a Dynamic VHD, then linked a Differencing VHD to it with DosBox-X which finally booted the OS without problems from the delta VHD. So, VHD sharing seems good to me. Are you sure @BridgeHeadland that your problems do not arise from mounting VHD in newer Windows editions or other causes? Windows often silently upgrades NTFS to newer revisions, but this leads to problems if you want to use the file system with older NT editions, for example.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 I was able to run BOOTMGR for Windows Vista in DOSBox-X, by installing Windows Vista with VirtualBox 7, in a VHD file I created in DOSBox-X, but I couldn't run Windows Vista itself. It seems more as if NTFS-converted VHD files cannot withstand DOSBox-X, if Windows 2000, XP, and the like were installed in VirtualBox, or vice versa.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@BridgeHeadland With the latest commit (slightly patched to obtain more LOG) I tried:

in Windows 11: create a 1 GiB Dynamic VHD, a single MBR partition on it and format with NTFS;
IMGMOUNT 2 SUCH.VHD -fs none in DosBox-X;
install Windows 2000 on it booting from CD-ROM (Windows NT 4 does not offer to keep the partition unchanged); detected disk geometry: LOG: VHD DEBUG: part. CHS=(0,2,3) - LBA=65536, heads=255, sectors=63
after first reboot, I have instead:
```
LOG: VHD DEBUG: part. CHS=(0,2,3) - LBA=41984, heads=43, sectors=40
LOG: CHS and LBA partition start differ, choosing LBA
```
Then Windows 2000 GUI starts regularly in DOSBox-X (since it relies on LBA value) and continues Setup, but this change should not happen and surely generates issues to other apps.

@joncampbell123 In fact, booting the VHD in Virtual Box 7 we immediately get from MBR an "Error loading Operating system"; such error disappears as soon as the MBR is corrected by hand setting the previous CHS geometry for partition end.

Obviously, this means that when Windows 2000 Setup updated the MBR (to write its own boot code), the partition geometry provided by DosBox-X was not the one initially detected by the VHD driver: this must be investigated!

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

Running NT 4 Setup in Bochs, the original MBR (Windows11-made) is changed again:

LOG: VHD DEBUG: part. CHS=(0,2,3) - LBA=41984, heads=41, sectors=40
LOG: CHS and LBA partition start differ, choosing LBA

but Bochs (and DosBox-X itself) boots the VHD.

Also, Windows 11 opens the changed VHD and the NTFS filesystem without issues. After a VHD-to-VDI conversion, VirtualBox can't boot instead ("couldn't find NTLDR" error: but this shows that the boot sector was correctly loaded).

So, I can't judge if this is really a DosBox-X issue. In fact, if the VHD is made by IMGMAKE, NT 4 Setup does not change the MBR which remains: LOG: VHD DEBUG: part. CHS=(0,1,1) - LBA=32256, heads=64, sectors=63

EDIT: if Setup is run in Virtualbox 7, the Windows 11 VHD MBR is altered the same way (255-63 to 41-40 heads-spt); after NTFS conversion, the boot process starts, but hangs with a "unaccessible boot device" BSOD.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 I was able to run BOOTMGR for Windows Vista in DOSBox-X, by installing Windows Vista with VirtualBox 7, in a VHD file I created in DOSBox-X, but I couldn't run Windows Vista itself. It seems more as if NTFS-converted VHD files cannot withstand DOSBox-X, if Windows 2000, XP, and the like were installed in VirtualBox, or vice versa.

@BridgeHeadland Install/run NT-based systems on different hardware (like the hardware emulated by different emulators is) can easily led to incompatibilities by itself. Only recent Windows are really "portable" at a larger extent.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 What Windows 11 software/app did you use to create this VHD, which is a single MBR partition? Did you use Hyper-V, StarWind? I think how to create VHD files plays a big role in such cases.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@maxpat78 What Windows 11 software/app did you use to create this VHD, which is a single MBR partition? Did you use Hyper-V, StarWind? I think how to create VHD files plays a big role in such cases.

I used the builtin Windows 11 Diskpart GUI.

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

Update: if the VHD was made by DosBox-X with VHDMAKE (=empty, unpartitioned), NT 4 Setup partition it with: LOG: VHD DEBUG: part. CHS=(0,1,1) - LBA=32256, heads=255, sectors=63

Virtualbox is able to start the booting process of NT 4, installed by Dosbox-X on such VHD - obviously, a BSOD occurs, but this is possibly unrelated to disk emulation.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

It took me a while to understand how to even create such a VHD file, which is dynamic, I did some research online, tried my hand, and understood which command line(s) to write.

For the pleasure of those who do not yet know what to write, I now write a command line example here.

«vhdmake hdd.vhd 2040g»

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

It took me a while to understand how to even create such a VHD file, which is dynamic, I did some research online, tried my hand, and understood which command line(s) to write.

For the pleasure of those who do not yet know what to write, I now write a command line example here.

«vhdmake hdd.vhd 32g»

@BridgeHeadland ...did you ask the dosbox-x shell? It's not misterious, it's builtin!

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

I've tried to follow guidelines found on this site (https://bearwindows.zcm.com.au/winnt4.htm#3) and made a NT4 boot CD with SP6a slipstreamed.

It's interesting to note that Setup starts properly, both in Dosbox-X and Bochs: but, only with Dosbox-X, it can't continue, since Setup complaints that no hard disk is present!

maxpat78 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 The "inaccessible boot device" BSOD, and the primary HD vanishing mentioned above, when Windows NT 4.0 is updated with a Service Pack >1 could be related to #4837 ? Perhaps SP2+ disk drivers talk with the hardware in a different way?

joncampbell123 commented 7 months ago

@joncampbell123 The "inaccessible boot device" BSOD, and the primary HD vanishing mentioned above, when Windows NT 4.0 is updated with a Service Pack >1 could be related to #4837 ? Perhaps SP2+ disk drivers talk with the hardware in a different way?

Maybe SP1 and higher changed how the IDE driver works.

BridgeHeadland commented 7 months ago

This is my experience of Windows XP in a dynamic VHD file created in DOSBox-X with VHDMAKE: Unlike a VHD file created with IMGMAKE, where the storage capacity limitation of Windows XP is 31.25 GB (if the file system is NTFS), the the limitation of the storage capacity of Windows XP is 2 TB (if the file system is NTFS), and I'm happy about that, because when Windows XP is in a dynamic VHD file of 31.25 GB, Windows XP behaves as if the storage capacity is about 4 GB, if the VHD file is fixed. Even at 2 TB in dynamic VHD file, I experience getting messages with the heading "Windows - Delayed Write Failed", like you see in the pictures below, if I update something Windows-related, or install components. Windows XP agrees to be activated with xp_activate32.exe, but to update Windows XP to the latest version from 2019, and components from the installation CD (ISO) of Windows XP (MCE2K5), which I have already tried, I am experiencing the errors that I have mentioned, there has never been a problem if Windows XP was installed in a fixed 31.25 GB VHD file. Could it be because DOSBox-X, Windows XP, or the VHD file currently thinks that the total size of the storage capacity is 23.9 GB (7.3-4 GB to go), and that there is 20.5 GB of free space? I think that might be the reason, but I'm not entirely sure. I have also experienced, after an error, that I ended up with a Blue Screen every time I started Windows XP, and that the whole thing restarted by itself, without there being any possibility to do anything about it. I had tried everything, except this F8 thing, but I don't know if it works in DOSBox-X.

kero990 commented 6 months ago

This is my experience of Windows XP in a dynamic VHD file created in DOSBox-X with VHDMAKE: Unlike a VHD file created with IMGMAKE, where the storage capacity limitation of Windows XP is 31.25 GB (if the file system is NTFS), the the limitation of the storage capacity of Windows XP is 2 TB (if the file system is NTFS), and I'm happy about that, because when Windows XP is in a dynamic VHD file of 31.25 GB, Windows XP behaves as if the storage capacity is about 4 GB, if the VHD file is fixed. Even at 2 TB in dynamic VHD file, I experience getting messages with the heading "Windows - Delayed Write Failed", like you see in the pictures below, if I update something Windows-related, or install components. Windows XP agrees to be activated with xp_activate32.exe, but to update Windows XP to the latest version from 2019, and components from the installation CD (ISO) of Windows XP (MCE2K5), which I have already tried, I am experiencing the errors that I have mentioned, there has never been a problem if Windows XP was installed in a fixed 31.25 GB VHD file. Could it be because DOSBox-X, Windows XP, or the VHD file currently thinks that the total size of the storage capacity is 23.9 GB (7.3-4 GB to go), and that there is 20.5 GB of free space? I think that might be the reason, but I'm not entirely sure. I have also experienced, after an error, that I ended up with a Blue Screen every time I started Windows XP, and that the whole thing restarted by itself, without there being any possibility to do anything about it. I had tried everything, except this F8 thing, but I don't know if it works in DOSBox-X.

I tried to install WinXP according to the document you provided below https://github.com/joncampbell123/dosbox-x/discussions/4907 but regardless of whether I used the SP3 version or the Media Center Edition 2005 (both in Chinese language), after the file copying finished, when I executed boot C:, it showed an error 'NTLDR is Missing'. I don't know what the problem is. I'm using the latest build

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

I haven't updated the post for a while, as I've been busy testing out VHDMAKE. If you created a dynamic VHD file by typing "VHDMAKE hdd_xp.vhd 2040g", you must mount the VHD file as 2, not C. Do not open the D drive, i386 folder, and type ""winnt.exe ", but write "Boot -el-toroto D:" from the Z drive. Remember that you must initialize the VHD file to MBR with Disk Manager before mounting.

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

After several experiments with installing Windows built on NT technology, not least Windows XP, I have noticed that if you, in a dynamic VHD file that is MBR-initialized and is 32000 MB (31.25 GB) , created in either DOSBox-X with VHDMAKE, or in Disk Manager in Windows 1x, installing Windows 2000 or XP, I see that Windows will be installed on a 31997 MB hard drive, and that's a good thing, but doing the same in such VHD-file, only at 2040 GB (2 TB), I see Windows being installed at 24XXX MB (can't remember the exact number at the moment, but it's equal to 23.99 GB) and I can't see how this make any sense. I've done some research and it appears that Windows XP, also Server 2003, Home Server, and probably pre-reset Longhorn (Beta-Vista), can be installed on 2TB. Maybe someone here can explain to me the pattern of VHD files like these?

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

I have created a dynamic VHD file in Disk Manager in Windows 11, installed Windows Vista Ultimate (x86) with SP2 in the VHD file with VirtualBox 7.0, and tried to run Windows Vista in the said VHD file with DOSBox-X (not latest developer build), although Windows Boot Manager was the only thing I expected to see. The only thing that happened was that I had to restart the entire DOSBox by pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete. I did the same procedure once again, just the W11 Disk Manager created VHD file was fixed, this time I got Windows Boot Manager running, but not Windows Vista, as expected (this is the first time I tried it in a raw, fixed VHD file), because DOSBox-X does not emulate SATA. NTLDR by the way, cannot run in VHD files made with Disk Manager or VHDMAKE, which is sad if someone wants to multi-boot in such VHD files, DOSBox-X skip NTLDR, and start Windows directly - you can multi-boot both Windows 2000 and Windows XP in the same VHD-file/partition (IMGMAKE only At least I realized that Windows Vista's boot manager is IDE compatible, even the last mentioned operating system is not, I wonder if you can replace NTLDR with Windows Boot Manager, by the way.

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

Admittedly, Windows Longhorn (up to build 4015) is unable to continue installation from the second phase, in any of the versions of DOSBox-X, for now, not even the latest nightly build, but still… What I have done is to use Hyper-V from Windows 11 Pro to convert a dynamic VHD file with Windows XP, created in Disk Manager for said operating system, to fixed, to see how flexible WXP (formatted from raw to NTFS, of course) is in solid state, the one that I installed not too long ago, also to once again install Windows Longhorn 4015 ( Impossible in dynamic VHD file), the last version that is possible to installs with DOSBox-X (but via WXP), probably because it is the last IDE -compatible version, I don't know. As said, WL4K15 could not continue the installation from the second phase. I converted the VHD file back to dynamic, then tried to continue the install from others, to see if that works, but like BOOTMGR for Windows Vista, I got "A disk read error occurred Press Ctrl+Alt+Del to restart ». It does not surprise me if it is the same issue that is the cause of the disk read error thing for both Windows Longhorn and BOOTMGR, as well as the Windows - Delayed write failed messages that you can get in Windows 2000 and newer Windows NT.

Torinde commented 6 months ago

@BridgeHeadland,

MHz is very seldom (if ever) the reason for OS not to work. For example XP actually runs on 8MHz, despite the official spec requiring much more.
DOSbox cycles max won't give you performance equivalent to your host CPU - it's always much lower due to the emulation overhead: the example at the link is Core2 3.3GHz being capable of emulating Pentium 133MHz. If you have a modern host I've seen reports of having performance on the level of P4/1.5GHz.
the real requirements are specific CPU instructions (CMPXCHG8B from Pentium for WinXP, SSE2 for the latest XP updates, etc.) or some other system feature like ACPI (for Vista), etc.
Pentium 3 is supported by DOSbox-X, so you can try with it. I've seen it listed as official requirement only for Windows Home Server - it may be that after certain build number CMOV, SYSENTER, FXSR, SSE or something else is required. Usually that will apply for other builds/service packs/updates (even for different OS/editions, e.g. 2003/XP/etc.) after that date as well.

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

@Torinde I see you are replying to a comment that I have deleted, I deleted it because I thought I found the answer and it seemed silly to have the comment posted here, but according to your reply I realize there are certain things I had no idea on, and which I still do not understand. My PC is over 10 years old and originally it had Windows 8.1 as the host OS, before I upgraded to Windows 10, the CPU type of the PC is an Intel Core i7. The PC is too old to be able to install Windows 11 on it, that I have used Windows 11 in the context of DOSBox-X is only when I have used a PC that I have borrowed, the CPU type of the borrowed PC is a Intel Core i5. I'm not familiar with CMPXCHG8B, and I don't know what it is, other than what you say, but I reckon it's a hardware thing, much like with SSE2, if I'm not mistaken. Are those CPU instructions added to DOSBox -X already? I knew that Pentium 3 is supported by DOSBox-X, I've gotten Windows ME for example to run in DOSBox-X, while emulating P3, but when I try to run Windows XP while DOSBox-X emulates P2, WXP crashes before I gets something done, and emulates DOSBox-X P3, I can't start WXP - I think I've mentioned it before. It is possible there is something I need to reconfigure in the configuration files. I reckon that CMOV, SYSENTER, FXSR and SSE are hardware-related things. Are they added to DOSBox-X?

wxp.txt wxp.reference.txt wxp.reference.full.txt

Torinde commented 6 months ago

@BridgeHeadland

CMPXCHG8B, CMOV, SYSENTER, FXSR, SSE are CPU instructions emulated by DOSbox-X (depends on which CPU type you select, e.g. Pentium III has all of those). For Windows XP (without 2018/2019 updates) is relevant only CMPXCHG8B, which is emulated with Pentium/MMX/Pro/II/III.
"Core i7" and "Core i5" are meaningless without the specific model number, but again - performance (MHz on host, speed in guest) is seldom (if ever) the blocker for running something (although it may be too slow to actually use).

BridgeHeadland commented 6 months ago

@Torinde I understand. By the way, I want to say I mean to remember I've managed to install the update from April 9, 2019, in a fixed VHD file, but not in a dynamic one (the delayed write failed thing, you know). I have not been able to install the security update from 16 May of the same year, neither in a fixed or a dynamic one. I am now in the process of converting the dynamic VHD file to fixed to see if I remember correctly.

joncampbell123 / dosbox-x