info on determinate vs indeterminate by species

[lizzieinvancouver]

See this UBC link ... where does this info come from? Who teaches this course? Do they know?

[lizzieinvancouver]

@FrederikBaumgarten reported on this Monday and "said the information is harder to find than he thought, but is working on it." @jannekehrl continued "We had a general discussion about how this seems super important (to understanding endogenous factors), might not be as categorical as the two words make it seem, and much less known / studied than we would have expected so bound to come up in the discussion."

I agree! And I think some of the best info is somewhere in the Forestry group at UBC.

[rdmanzanedo]

Anecdotically, image from our green house with the oaks doing 2 very clear growth strechtes (and creating buds in the middle) these are the control ones! Determinate buds in the first and then able to re-start growth, switch to indeterminate?

[lizzieinvancouver]

@rdmanzanedo Cool photo!

@FrederikBaumgarten Can you post your current notes here? And @jannekehrl friendly reminder to ask your molecular colleague about this.

[lizzieinvancouver]

Notes I have from Monday are they generally juvenile trees and early-successional are more indet than det. @FrederikBaumgarten See if you can ask Rob Guy and/or Sally Aitken for more info. Also if you can label the species/genera we have in issue #9 -- @AileneKane can add it to plots.

[FrederikBaumgarten]

Here some infos I could gather so far:

• Hariharan, I. K., Wake, D. B., & Wake, M. H. (2016). Indeterminate growth: could it represent the ancestral condition?. Cold Spring Harbor Perspectives in Biology, 8(2), a019174. -> Indeterminate growth may be the ancestral form
• BORCHERT, R. (1975). Endogenous shoot growth rhythms and indeterminate shoot growth in oak. Physiologia Plantarum, 35(2), 152-157. -> Shoot elongation might seem determinate because of water deficits that resulted from a imbalance of shoot/root ratio. As the shoot elongates root may not be able to supply enough water which results in a hormonal suppression of further shoot growth. This stop and go pattern can result in rhytmic bursts of shoot growth/elongation
• Marks, P. L. (1975). On the relation between extension growth and successional status of deciduous trees of the northeastern United States. Bulletin of the Torrey Botanical Club, 172-177. -> Early successional species adopt a more indeterminate extension growth pattern during a long fraction of the growing season. Species later in the succession in contrast switch towards growing less during a shorter fractino of the GS and show more determinate sxtension growth behaviour.
• Boojh, R., & Ramakrishnan, P. S. (1982). Growth strategy of trees related to successional status I. Architecture and extension growth. Forest Ecology and Management, 4(4), 359-374. -> Same than previous. Additionally they found that early successional species emphazice vertical growth whereas late successional species emphasize broader growth based on their branching architecture probably as a result of competion.
  -> Younger trees follow a more indeterminate growth pattern and become more conservative in that regard with age

[lizzieinvancouver]

Thanks @FrederikBaumgarten !

I asked a molecular colleague for some info and she thought there could be links about determinate buds FLC which controls a million things (leaf shape, leaf thickness, cold tolerance, drought tolerance), including vernalization and so controls the switch between what some call `perpetual growth' versus doing it all in one season.

The Coupland lab might have some relevant publications on this 'lifestyle' change.

Also, this is all epigenetically regulated, so plants shift over time.

I don't know if there is FLC in trees though ... the only possibly relevant paper I found was this one on citrus. I think we'd have to dig into the 'competancy' literature to find more, as I am not sure if 'determinate' and 'indetereminate' are used so much anymore (perhaps?).

[FrederikBaumgarten]

thanks lizzie for posting even some new terms here! I have talked to Sally and Rob and I am waiting for some more papers that Julie and Tolu are trying to find. I keep you posted!

[lizzieinvancouver]

Extremely done. Thanks @FrederikBaumgarten !