Feedback/Enhancement - police system and jail

[Nextej]

Problems

• There's no real meaningful consequences of being taken to jail, with the only exception of losing 'stolen' items
• In result players are not concerned with consequences of getting crime points
• Despite meaningless role the jail players often choose to reload an earlier save the moment they see the police approaching or when taken to jail, making the jail even more pointless and incentivising into doing save-scumming

Changes to jail

• Minimal time player has to spend in a jail should be one night (at least 8 hours after appearing in jail), currently players can be easily taken to jail with small amount of crime points only to be immediately released
• When taken to jail, player should pay the default fine for the type of committed crime
• On top of the default fine, game should keep track of the total value of stolen items player had ever stolen, when caught, player should pay appropriate recompensations equal to that total value, minus value of any repossesesed 'stolen' items player had on them during intervention
  • the total value should reset each time player is taken to the jail (or successfully bribes the cops); if player does not have enough funds, they simply don't pay what they can't, player should not get into a debt
  • player should be able to deposit their own money to their own owned safe furniture (with the limit per safe equal to 99x times the amount of safe's slots), so that player can strategise when it's profitable to go all in, while having the actual funds stored away

Changes to the police

• Depending on the value of stolen item, there should be chance % whether the police is alarmed of the crime, instead of always approaching player when they have a stolen item in the inventory (for instance an 11OC Duct Tape would have rather very small chances of alarming the police, while a Gold Urn would have very high chances of alarming the police)
  • The police should not react immediately a moment after the item was stolen, there should be a delay #1166
  • If the police is suspecting the player but the player has no stolen items on them at the time of questioning, the police should let the player free
  • If the player was caught stealing by other people or the camera, then when the police approaches player they should state that the player was caught stealing by a camera or witnesses, regardless whether they have something stolen in their inventory or not
• When the bounty on the player is high, police should have a chance to raid the Player's Tenement while the player is away (if they can't get the player relatively soon themselves) and repossess any 'stolen' items from chests, etc. This would make a situation in which bad action of the player in the past do happen out of their control out of their presence, when they can't easily rollback a save.
  • Police should leave a clear eye-catching note/warranty that they have searched your apartment
  • Player should be able to counteract this action with safes to store 'stolen' items safely, also mentioned in #992
  • The list of repossessed items could also include other valuable/illegal/controlled items #1377
• When police questions the player, they should precisely state why player is questioned: whether they got a witness or whether player is only suspected in investigation; for what crimes specifically;

Major suggestion for the police

• Each transition door should have a small dark human-sized cuboid space behind it, allowing the police officers to spawn there and transition between the maps, when for instance, running after the player
  • Game should keep track of when the player is being chased and spawn a cop from the same door player has entered, with a delay, giving player a chance to hide behind another door or change level once again
  • This could enhance Bank of Bazaar quest, where after 3am, the police appear in the lobby and makes their way towards the player, giving player just minutes to escape in the last moment or be caught before being taken to jail

Sleep events changes

• Each bed should have a separate, from safety, meter for chances of being taken to jail, allowing places like the top of the Metro Station hideout or deep in the Bergmann Tunnels to be 100% safe from police, while others, like random beds in the abandoned apartments of Deekula have much lower % than your own bed or the hostel.
• Special case for your apartment and hostel, when police is meant to take you in in your sleep, instead of doing so immediately, a couple of the officers should be spawned in the entrance (doorstep, reception passage), blocking any escape path (just so people are less confused, as to why supposedly secure place got them jailed anyway)

[Taco-Cat1]

If the player needs the pay the fine regardless of wheatear they go to jail or not then why would they choose the jail when they can just pay the fine. It would be better if they had to pay like 25% of it so there is still punishment but it is not too harsh

[Nextej]

If the player needs the pay the fine regardless of wheatear they go to jail or not then why would they choose the jail when they can just pay the fine. It would be better if they had to pay like 25% of it so there is still punishment but it is not too harsh

It's not a choice whether player goes to the jail or not.

However Pinkamedic did suggest that under a certain amount of total value of stolen items (let's say under 200 OC), player should be able to pay full cost of the fine or go to jail (given that they do have required amount), over that 200 OC threshold they go to the jail regardless and the cost of fine + compensation is deducted (of whatever money player has left, no need to pay full fine if they can't physically afford on them). The default fine for petty stealing should be at least twice the max threshold, but probably no more than 1000 OC

[Taco-Cat1]

I mean if they turn themselves in which should still fall under prison improvements

[greensalt99]

how police will prove what you have stolen or not stolen. Game should not count what you stole. only what police can prove/find on you. :) (maybe if you have been caught red handed few time, then they do rain in your room, imagine sleeping and waking up to Police waiting near door )

I dont want to attack you Nextej for you hard work but... this looks like "Some Highly Spirit" in the Sky or bellow from dark deep is counting all your mistakes and using Police to punish you. Obey and Pray to holly Obensoer God and its rule-guardian The Police.

We dont know as a Player whats happening in Obensoer, when you start game you are put in some odd place where general rules doesnt count. Maybe devs will later add better info, cause now you are being thrown in and survive as you like :) please dont change this logic, cause its fun to find rules of surviving in this unforgiving place ( part of game learning ) :)

Nextej, agree that jail is a joke. however sometimes you get punished for taking wrong item... i am loot goblin, guilty :P

Edirt: On reloading Issue - if jail will be to punishing, people will, I definetly will reload, if games forces to reload save because it is way to hard, then game is not balanced. Good games let you forget that there is save option, you just play and enjoy "_"

[Nextej]

how police will prove what you have stolen or not stolen. Game should not count what you stole. only what police can prove/find on you. :) (maybe if you have been caught red handed few time, then they do rain in your room, imagine sleeping and waking up to Police waiting near door )

I dont want to attack you Nextej for you hard work but... this looks like "Some Highly Spirit" in the Sky or bellow from dark deep is counting all your mistakes and using Police to punish you. Obey and Pray to holly Obensoer God and its rule-guardian The Police.

the game already does it, it quietly adds up crime points that make the police approach you, sometimes when you sleep anywhere, you'll be transported to jail in your sleep, the amount of time you spend in the jail is also based on the amount of crime points you got during intervention. This is not a suggestion to add these, it's already there, the suggestion is to improve upon them (like instead of being automatically transported to jail in your sleep, you'll find policemen standing in your door way), so they are less confusing and the consequences are actually meaningful.

edit: I would also suspect that having a system where "what police can prove or not" would be too complex to implement.

[greensalt99]

wait, they changed it? it used to be when you get caught... damm this is bad.

[Nextej]

it was implemented from the start, just all "night events" where broken, so whenever you were meant to be taken to jail, it wasn't triggered

[greensalt99]

simple, ccheck inv, if person sav you take somthing, count it in. so in the end crime would be your INV and what withnes sav. :)

[Nextej]

simple, ccheck inv, if person sav you take somthing, count it in. so in the end crime would be your INV and what withnes sav. :)

but it makes a problem where you can shamelessly steal majority of the items, since they are unobserved, leaving no consequences for stealing. People would logically report the crime within hours

[greensalt99]

not sure how was it implemented. cause i havent noticed it O_O . i wont argue with you. you play alot!!!! as i played i enyoed not getting punished for godly list of my crimes.

[greensalt99]

Player will play as he wants, lets leave player a choice, if you want be criminal, fine. if you want make furniture, or farm or make drugs, fine :) lot of choices are good. dont put people in one box :) please

[greensalt99]

i was having fun just running and taking trash :)

[Nextej]

Player is free to choose crime and suffer consequences of it, that's a choice, high risk with high reward, going by that logic, why not just delete the jail entirely since it's pointless anyway, hmmm?

I think my proposal leaves fairly balanced crime system:

• You get caught only if you were seen stealing, were carrying stolen item with you, police found stolen items in your apartment
• Avoid policemen by traveling under ground between locations, deposit stolen items securely in a safe
• Crimes have a delay before are being reported to the police, so you can move small amounts of stolen items on the surface before charges pile up and you'll be suspected
• If you get caught total value of all reported robberies needs to be deducted from your wallet, if you don't have money, you're not losing, so you can deposit your money in a safe and intentionally turn yourself in to clear your state
• If you get caught either pay the fine (if stolen item was under 200 OC) or level up the skill to bribe the policeman to avoid jail.

[greensalt99]

:) this sounds nice :) perfect

sorry, ignored first sentence :D