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long-war-2 / lwotc

Port of Long War 2 to XCOM 2's War of the Chosen expansion
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Integrate near-essential quality-of-life mods #67

Closed pledbrook closed 2 years ago

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

This is a list of quality-of-life mods we should consider integrating with LW2:

✅ = Works as is 🔧 = Requires patching 📦 = Bundled

Some of them may need patching and bundling. Others could just be dependencies.

These are already supported/integrated:

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

Having features and fixes spread across multiple mods is difficult.

Rebel Job Selector & View Infiltrating Squad & Show Infiltration percentage in Squad Select should be integrated in LWotC itself, i agree. These probably will break by porting to WotC and will need rework anyway.

With the rest it is difficult, some are no longer maintained, some do not really need maintenance.

I'm not sure if it is a good way of solving the problem but maybe it should be done like https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1581142050 (Various Options)

Combine all "fixes" into a community-fixes mod and combine the quality of life features into a community-qol-mod. Things you don't need can be turned off there.

This way even the people that don't want LongWar will still benefit from better maintenance and less conflicts between various mods. Gotcha&PerfectInformation are a good example for unsolved problems in combination with Peak from Concealment

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

It might also be worth noting specifically which of these work as is (such as evac all) and which ones need patching (based on discussion in #54 ). Moreover, while I like the idea by @yoshimo , the problem is that some mods actually do change gameplay even if they are classified as QoL improvement, i.e. rebel job selector, peak from concealment, etc., so not sure if bundling those together with "true" QoL mods is the best option. I wonder if a spreadsheet would be a good idea to manage and classify all such proposed mods for better classification and prioritization?

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

Peak from Concealment is a game changer absolutely. The focus is more that the other two , which have problems with it, seem stale these days. So if they were part of a quality of life "highlander" it would be easier to fix interactions.

Dragon-32 commented 5 years ago

FYI, the WotC version of "Upcoming events in hours" is Upcoming Events.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Thanks, I've updated the entry in the list above.

ghost commented 5 years ago

I think New Target Icons should be added, its not a 100% needed but it is very nice to have. I have been playing with it so far and haven't seen any issues.

WOTC - Extended Information also doesn't seem to have the issue Prefect information has where the aim is always 0% over enemy icons.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

My only concern about Extended Information is the alleged performance issue on Mac/Linux.

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

Also, I am not sure if extended information takes grazes into account

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

If we make a table what infos would we need?

[ ] Quality of life [ ] bug fixes [ ] little enhancements [ ] vanilla/wotc [ ] maintained? [ ] working with lwotc yet? (good, partially,not at all)

SirMrMister commented 5 years ago

Tactical Information Overhaul seems to a merge of Additional Target Icons plus its own more involved implementation of Numeric Health Display (two modifications usually incompatible as they alter the same .ini file), but I'm not sure if it includes the extra icons from New Target Icons.

@yoshimo The table should if possible mention which files it changes (assuming we're talking small mods that modify at the most three .ini files), to account which mods should be integrated together.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

Additional Icons, nothing about target mentioned there. If we stick to the Lost, which we should, i suggest Lost Autofire Where would be the best place to start this collection? The issue and then a wiki page?

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

One mod that seemed to have been missed in this list and is a lifesaver for LW2 slogs is Quick End Turn. I am not sure if it was updated for WOTC, but having to go through 30+ turns on an HQ with 8+ soldiers individually is near impossible

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

I think Overwatch All/Others does this very well

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

@yoshimo Does it also do steady weapon in case of a stock equipped? In my experience, the solider who cannot OW just hunkers down even if they have a stock. I need to double check this

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Overwatch All only does overwatch as far as I can tell. It definitely doesn't mention the reloading, steady, etc. that Quick End Turn does.

Also worth pointing out that the Quick End Turn workshop page points to Smart Overwatch All for WOTC. Which has the auto reloading and hunkering, but not steady.

SirMrMister commented 5 years ago

Free Reload Anytime. Makes free reload from auto loaders a separate reload action, allowing you to save free reloads for later when you have action points to spare.

Incidentally, I found this comment on an old reddit post, which gives an idea (just the idea though) worth considering if you'd prefer it to Free Reload Anytime's behaviour:

Given that they're often mags taped together, it'd be nice to make it an active ability that makes THIS reload a normal one but slots in the quick change mag so the NEXT reload will be free. Rather than making it something you can use on a whim, you'd have to decide in advance when you think you'll need to activate it

In that case the "Has taped magazines; next reload will be free" status could be indicated to the player via a buff, but I digress.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Another option would be to remove auto-loaders from the game :smile:

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

Another option would be to remove auto-loaders from the game 😄

Plz no, I want rangers and gunners to be at least somewhat relevant

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

So as a course of action i think we should wait for the showstoppers and major bugs to be fixed , then hope that @pledbrook integrates the 3 lw specific qol mods intro lwotc (even if the title changed in the mod itself) and then sit down and collect, discuss and catetegorise the rest and then decide how to proceed. Deciding if work is needed to support lwotc and check if they work together is difficult if lwotc itself still has major broken parts.

SirMrMister commented 5 years ago

Counter-argument: Besides the 3 LW-specific ones, I think it should also be a priority to include one of the ones giving data that might help in debugging - the equivalence of XCOM:EW’s Perfect Information and More than Perfect Information, and an extended F1.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

How well do the perfect information mod and its successor work with lwotc? For alpha bundle, later depend on them

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Perfect information can't be integrated as is because it shows 0% to hit over the enemy icons. I want to test Extended Information on Mac before committing to that, as the mod page warns that there's a potential performance issue on Mac and Linux.

bazik123 commented 5 years ago

i dont think i understand the motivation of including QOL mods that dont need changes to work. by doing this you are limiting the ability of people to chose some less popular mods that are conflicting with those you happened to choose.

(FWIW i am mostly using same mods you chose, but I dont see any real benefit of not having people install those that dont require changes separately)

SirMrMister commented 5 years ago

Thing is, while your argument is absolutely correct, most of them do indeed need changes to work, both with LWOTC AND with each other.

After all, if ALL the changes LWOTC were to do to a particular .ini file were related with integrating a certain QoL UI mod, then if you want to use a different mod instead that also changes that file it won't matter whether LWOTC integrated the first mod or not, as it'll be replacing the whole file regardless.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

..., but I dont see any real benefit of not having people install those that dont require changes separately

The benefit is for those people who aren't comfortable with or don't want the hassle of installing many different mods. This is partly guided by the joy I had at seeing Long War Rebalance integrating a bunch of QoL mods that would make the game more pleasant and I wouldn't have to mess around getting them myself.

Of course, allowing folks to use their own preferred mods is desirable too. But it's mutually exclusive with the convenience of "bundling" mods into one.

There may be a reasonable compromise, although I don't know the mechanics of how it would work: set up a second mod that is simply a collection of mods that we think are desirable for all players. That would limit the number of mods people need to install to two.

To be honest, I don't know how mod dependencies ("required mods") or mod collections work. It may not prove as convenient as I hope. But we'll tackle that when we get there.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

In terms of enhancing the lwotc experience with companion mods, we might want to have a look at [X2CommunityCore/X2WOTCCommunityHighlander/issues/32] (List of almost every WotC-relevant Fix Mod) later

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Those fixes are listed for going into the highlander anyway, which we depend on. Not sure if there's much point adding them to this mod.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

Not for this mod, but future related work. Highlander doesn't fix itself

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

I think [WOTC] Cost Based Ability Colors was also a nice QOL addition

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

@yoshimo That mod does conflict somewhat with LW2's own colour coding.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

I don't remember how LW did it, was it doing the same?

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

Similar. Green for free action. Yellow for abilities that required two actions. I don't think it distinguished between turn-ending actions and non-turn-ending actions though. That's something that would be nice.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

I tried Extended Information! on Mac and it just crashed the game. That rules it out as a dependency.

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

What are people's experiences with Gotcha Again? Does it work as is?

ghost commented 5 years ago

Gotcha Again has some bugs with line of sight for overwatch shots. Sometimes it will say that you won't pull overwatch and you do and other times it says will pull an overwatch and you don't. A lot of this pretty obvious if you will or wont pull an overwatch if you have been playing a while.

Haven't had any issues with line of sight for hack targets.

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

I tried Extended Information! on Mac and it just crashed the game. That rules it out as a dependency.

Does it crash without lwotc too?

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

I can confirm that instant avenger menus has been working for me without any issues. Extended information works but it sometimes shows a different percentage when the shot is taken than what it shows in the preview. Since graze band is disabled, I am not sure what else could be causing that

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

@yoshimo Didn't try it. I may have a go. It's a bit of a pain switching between them though, and I'd have to start a vanilla campaign 🤢

vandervalkg commented 5 years ago

Yes [WOTC] Cost-Based Ability Colors clashed with LW2's built-in coloring of actions (in Gatecrasher, both nades were blacked out, but could still be used), so this one should not be used with LW2.

I had a crash after Gatekeeper when I clicked to promote one of the sollies, I guessed it was due to [WOTC] New Promotion Screen by Default, but the fault repeated itself even after I disabled the mod in the AML and loaded back up. I even clicked continue to go straight to the Avenger, then tried to view soldiers and it crashed there too. I also had the following mods enabled:

Stop Wasting My Time - WOTC Remove Missing Mods for WOTC

No Reveal Cinematics Tactical HUD Shot Bar [WOTC] Gotcha Again [WOTC] Quick Soldier Info Instant Loot Confirm Free Reload - WOTC Quicker Reload - WOTC

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

@vandervalkg The blacked-out ability icons could indicate a problem with the core game classes (the highlander). That would probably also explain the crash on promotion.

Double check that you don't have another highlander mod (such as subscribed X2WOTCCommunityHighlander) active. And make sure the one you have selected is the one packaged with the alpha.

vandervalkg commented 5 years ago

Oh, I thought on the download page you said that we could use the updated Steam version of Highlander? I already deleted the version that came with LW2[WOTC] zip file. So this version will work better than the current live Steam one, https://github.com/X2CommunityCore/X2WOTCCommunityHighlander/ ?

pledbrook commented 5 years ago

@vandervalkg No, you need the one that comes with the alpha-2 release. And each alpha will likely have a new highlander version due to the number of game fixes that require highlander changes.

The only other option is to build the highlander yourself from https://github.com/long-war-2/X2WOTCCommunityHighlander

yoshimo commented 5 years ago

[https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1207741138] (WOTC Show Tech Path) is quite nice. Maybe this would fit the bill for a future QOL bundle too.

Aurelicornus commented 5 years ago

My thoughts and impressions:

Perfect Information or Extended Information

I feel them like a cheat mode, because I like play without know everything of my enemy, and guess what they could do by what they does in game. I would keep this function off in the base game, but introduce it as Second Wave options like in Long War for Xcom 1, that has the same.

Rebel Job Selector

This one seems handy, maybe I will test it out. :)

View Infiltrating Squad

I'm not using it, but seems a good improvement. I will check it out, but I think is better if is a Second Wave options that those who dislike it can turn on/off.

Show Infiltration Percentage

I like the idea, but not where the info is placed in the equip screen (I dislike that covers the rightmost of my soldiers...!). Is handy, but I believe should be put as Second Wave options for those who don't like know everything.

LW2 Information Display

If I'm not wrong, the Alpha 3 has already something similar. I think is fine, but is another I think is good leaving toogleable with a SW option maybe.

Evac All

An essential that should have been present also in the Vanilla! ;)

Instant Avenger Menus

I have no issues with the standard menus. My suggestions is again to put this one as Second Wave option for those who like/need it.

Gotcha Again

Sounds handy, but they are like the "target preview" option in vanilla, and some players would like the challenge to play without helps or assistants. I would not put it as default, but toogleable for those who want use it.

New Target Icons

I would avoid this mod because it includes also icons for other units that are not present into Long War 2, and I think is better restrict these add-on only to the assets that are included into the mod (both for safety for compatibility or bug tracking). Maybe is possible a "lite" version that includes only the icons used by LW2, and cut off the unused ones?

TacticalUI Kill Counter

If I'm not wrong, Long War for Xcom 1 has a similar function (or was put with an extra mod, I don't remember right), however I would not activate it for default, but leaving it as a gameplay option to activate for those who likes it. As said, some players like don't know everything, and understand some details from how the game behave (for example, if you have kill all or most enemies depending how much long is the computer turn). Know the number of enemies left can spoil the fun for some players (like me ;) ) or spoil the surprise to have still enemies actives when you thought to have killed them all.

Show Health Values

I think the best is Numeric Health Display: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1126938196

Customize UIEventNotice

Sounds useful for those who want/needs tweak further the gameplay experience. ;)

Upcoming Events

I feel is a good eyecandy, approved ;)

Yet Another F1

I believe this should be essential and present in the main Mod, because the Vanilla info screen is really lacking of... everything. The only way to see the stats during the play is hovering the cursor over the soldier name, but you have only an overview of the basic stats, while is missed a window that lists stats and perks like Xcom 1. On Long War 1, I used also Enhanced Tactical Info for a complete summary of what the unit can or cannot do, that I feel essential: https://www.nexusmods.com/xcom/mods/554/

Kazanir commented 5 years ago
Kazanir commented 5 years ago
BTAxis commented 5 years ago

If I'm not wrong, Long War for Xcom 1 has a similar function (or was put with an extra mod, I don't remember right), however I would not activate it for default, but leaving it as a gameplay option to activate for those who likes it. As said, some players like don't know everything, and understand some details from how the game behave (for example, if you have kill all or most enemies depending how much long is the computer turn). Know the number of enemies left can spoil the fun for some players (like me ;) ) or spoil the surprise to have still enemies actives when you thought to have killed them all.

By default though it only shows the number of enemies you've killed, which is information you would have anyway if you simply kept count. It does not show the number of enemies on the mission until you build the Shadow Chamber (again, by default), in which case you again already have that information because the Shadow Chamber tells you. That does put it squarely in QoL territory in my opinion.

ansabalirai commented 5 years ago

Would love to have at least the "Show infiltration percentage" when sending out a squad. Would eliminate a lot of Alt-Tabbing to put numbers in the infamous Xavier spreadsheet to find if you make the cut. I have the local code ported from vanilla LW2 working on my machine in case it might help. Cannot seem to build LWOTC and integrate it within though.

robojumper commented 4 years ago

Probably worth integrating: Better Squad Icon Selector

preview

zyxpsilon commented 4 years ago

As suggested on Discord (LWotc channel) & adding here for clarity... Mission Notification/Icons & custom Intro-Splasher Images; ... image