[Feature Request]: Unlocked Licensed options and defaults

[kchilton]

Platform

NRF52, ESP32, RP2040, Linux Native, other

Description

In the US, Amateur/Ham/Licensed operators have access to the 433MHz band for operations such as LoRa and Meshtastic. However, there is no selection for a Region that provides defaults for this operation. For example, in selecting EU_433, the duty cycle requirements are not necessary for hams in the US. Rather than leave the US ham population to guess at a default set of settings, and require a set of command-line configurations not available on the UIs, I suggest that the selection of IsLicensed also opens new options for lora.region, which in this case may be US_433 with 100% duty cycle, TX power, MQTT, encryption, and other defaults set as appropriate for US hams. Other regions may also enjoy this option where Amateur operators have privileges not available to the public. The reason for making this option unlock additional regions, rather than just adding these as new regions, is to prevent unlicensed users of the hardware from unknowingly violating the local laws without clearly claiming to have a license, and tightly couple these new ham-related Regions to the ID and other requirements of IsLicensed.

[garthvh]

The chance that this change would substantially increase unlicensed use of ham mode is too high, we are like 80% US users.

[kchilton]

The chance that this change would substantially increase unlicensed use of ham mode is too high, we are like 80% US users.

This is why I suggest only turning on the option only when the user selects the IsLicensed option. Then two things have to happen: they have to buy the 433 version of the hardware, and then they have to select that they have a license and input an alleged callsign. Since buying the 433 hardware and not returning it can already lead to unlicensed operation on 70cm by the user selecting EU_433 or MY_433, overriding the frequency, or another such selection without involving the IsLicensed option, there is no increase of abuse by my suggestion or likely increased unlicensed use. Amazon and other retailers gladly sell 433 hardware to anyone without checking licenses, including Heltec and LilyGo units.

However, my suggestion provides legitimate use and conformity among hams without leaving unlicensed operators with the impression that they are operating legally. It provides for increased Meshtastic use and experimentation within the US within the Amateur community. We already have the problem that the units are sold and usable for unlicensed operators, just as Baofengs and other 70cm rigs end up in the hands of non-hams, so that cat is already out of the bag. What I am suggesting is to help the hams adopt Meshtastic on 70cm without making it easy for the non-hams to make an "innocent" mistake.

If you see another way to do this, please suggest it.

[andrekir]

LoRa regions or frequency plans are for unlicensed use (typically ISM bands). for licensed use, frequency is set via override_frequency in the LoRa configs.

users are responsible for following their own local laws, rules and regulations. licensed operators, given their training and certification, are expected to have an even greater understanding and should already know the frequencies they are permitted to use.

[garthvh]

The chance that this change would substantially increase unlicensed use of ham mode is too high, we are like 80% US users.

This is why I suggest only turning on the option only when the user selects the IsLicensed option. Then two things have to happen: they have to buy the 433 version of the hardware, and then they have to select that they have a license and input an alleged callsign. Since buying the 433 hardware and not returning it can already lead to unlicensed operation on 70cm by the user selecting EU_433 or MY_433, overriding the frequency, or another such selection without involving the IsLicensed option, there is no increase of abuse by my suggestion or likely increased unlicensed use. Amazon and other retailers gladly sell 433 hardware to anyone without checking licenses, including Heltec and LilyGo units.

However, my suggestion provides legitimate use and conformity among hams without leaving unlicensed operators with the impression that they are operating legally. It provides for increased Meshtastic use and experimentation within the US within the Amateur community. We already have the problem that the units are sold and usable for unlicensed operators, just as Baofengs and other 70cm rigs end up in the hands of non-hams, so that cat is already out of the bag. What I am suggesting is to help the hams adopt Meshtastic on 70cm without making it easy for the non-hams to make an "innocent" mistake.

If you see another way to do this, please suggest it.

There is no way to keep it isolated just to the is licensed bool, the existing system works well considering how little ham usage there is, and the risk of accidental usage by having a second US preset.

[kchilton]

OK. This explains the LoRa APRS enthusiasm on the 70cm band in the US and why there is little ham usage on Meshtastic near me. That is the best way to keep it isolated, too. Thanks for the consideration.

[garthvh]

Most hams use meshtastic with encryption, the existing Ukraine 433 preset is fine, this has not been a barrier to adoption, the lack of encryption is the issue even for hams.

[kchilton]

In the USA, it is illegal for hams to encrypt their communications under their license in the ham bands except for command/control of satellites. Encrypting on the 433 band can result in an expensive fine and/or loss of one's Amateur license. FCC Part 97.113a4. Most US hams do try to follow the rules.

One could argue that encryption with a known key (as on Meshtastic's default for channel 0) is simply scrambling/encoding and not obscuring the information. This is not something that has been discussed with the FCC, to my knowledge. However, private keys for two way encrypted comms is not legal here. It is legal in some other countries and it would be convenient if US hams could use it to control repeaters and other equipment, but the FCC has not changed this rule in decades.

[garthvh]

The extra power is not of great benefit with these low power devices, hams can use encryption if they don't use any of their licensed privileges and most don't.

[kchilton]

In that case, the IsLicensed is not necessary at all. That is how I set up the 33cm units I have. It is not ham radio, so being a ham or GMRS or MURS or commercial licensee or having no license makes no difference. My recommendation was more specific. In the US, access to the 70cm band requires a license.

The difference between 33cm and 70cm in performance is significant at the same power levels in penetrating foliage and wall structures. There is also a difference between 30dbm ERP and 10W PEP into any desired antenna - it is not just a small power increase. At the same ERP, HAAT, line of sight, and link budget, 70cm reaches about 25% further just due to the increased atmospheric and refractive loss effects on 33cm. If the antenna is high enough and your LNA is good quality, 33cm does work great, but this is supposed to be a full mesh, not a mesh of rare hubs and many spokes.

It is fine that Meshtastic wants to just stay unlicensed on 915 in the US. It is not a problem to reload my hardware with iGate/Digi code and put my efforts into that. The isolation does seem to be a good thing, anyway.

[garthvh]

You have access to all the settings you need, a preset is just going to cause more unlicensed use of a tiny edge case, which is not what we want.

[kchilton]

I get that you don't want it. I understand this is a tiny edge case and it is clear that it remains that way by choice. I mistakenly thought the "Licensed" option was intended to involve the Amateur community. Sorry, my bad.

Since yesterday, I redeployed all of my 433 devices to LoRa APRS on 70cm. They seem to be working well and there is a lot of community support for LoRA APRS, so that appears to be the right choice. Thanks! Tonight I will redeploy the 915 ones to match their companions and see if there is any APRS activity on 33cm within range or if I will start the trend for it. Thanks again for steering me in the right direction!