Do not require restarting the PC after installing with MSI installer

[allexzander]

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Feature description

Rebooting PC after installing the Nextcloud desktop client is really overkill.

MSI can be scripted to kill and run a process without restarting. Since we need to restart only just to allow Explorer.exe to reload and initialize context menus and overlay icons, we can simply kill it and run again it when the shell extension installation is complete.

[github-tomster]

really kill explorer.exe 😿 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/rstmgr/about-restart-manager do a graceful restart of explorer.exe 🤷🏻‍♂️

[eibex]

Now Nextcloud doesn't even ask if you want to restart, it just does forcefully.

[nroach44]

Yep, can confirm that when upgrading through winget, or the "we need to update" prompt, a restart is unceremoniously triggered without ANY warning.

This is very user hostile - giving us no warning is completely unacceptable.

Please consider:

• Restarting explorer gracefully (instead of killing it and failing to start it like 3.4.x did)
• Giving 60+ seconds of restart warning
• Not performing the application upgrade until the next restart (like Windows update does)
• Notifying us that a restart is needed
• Logging out the current user instead of restarting the whole damned computer and leaving us to potentially deal with any dual-boot or other issues (see bitlocker with a PIN) that may ensue from that?

[allexzander]

@eibex @nroach44 Nothing's been changed in terms of installation for a while. How do you trigger the installer? Via command line? Could you provide more info on how to reproduce this? In fact, we do not control the popup as of now, it is a standard action performed by Windows. Somehow it may have decided to not provide it. Weird. Need more info.

Just double-checked after reading this, and the prompt is still there in 3.5.0...

[eibex]

I am on Windows 10 and update by clicking the button on the settings page of Nextcloud. I have never used the command line/powershell to update the program.

The pop-up started appearing after v3/v3.1 as far as I can remember.

[nroach44]

@allexzander I started NextCloud and it popped up saying "an update is about to start..." so I clicked through and then suddenly the machine just rebooted. On the other case, a winget upgrade --all downloaded and installed the MSI and the same thing happened.

The process msiexec.exe has initiated the restart of computer $COMPUTER on behalf of user NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM for the following reason: No title for this reason could be found Reason Code: 0x80030002 Shut-down Type: restart Comment: The Windows Installer initiated a system restart to complete or continue the configuration of 'Nextcloud'.

[nroach44]

One thing to note is that at no point was I prompted for the reboot, so this may only happen on "silent" upgrades.

[nroach44]

Logs: Log: Application Source: RestartManager Type: Warning Application 'C:\Windows\explorer.exe' (pid 2180) cannot be restarted - Application SID does not match Conductor SID..

Source: RestartManager Type: Information Machine restart is required.

Source: RestartManager Type: Error Application or service 'Windows Explorer' could not be shut down.

Source: MsiInstaller Type: Information Windows Installer requires a system restart. Product Name: Nextcloud. Product Version: 3.4.4.20220318. Product Language: 1033. Manufacturer: Nextcloud GmbH. Type of System Restart: 1. Reason for Restart: 2.

Source: MsiInstaller Type: Information The Windows Installer initiated a system restart to complete or continue the configuration of 'Nextcloud'.

[allexzander]

@eibex @nroach44 I see, so it's the installer that gets started automatically during the autoupdate. In my scenario, it was an MSI file that I started manually. Thanks for the details.

[eibex]

@allexzander I should have mentioned that specifically for 3.4.4 to 3.5.0 I manually started the MSI file (as I outlined in #4506) and the pop-up still appeared. I cannot now remember whether the computer restarted by itself even if I pressed "No", but I believe it did as mentioned in a few other bug threads.

[eibex]

For 3.5.1 no pop-up appeared, but the computer rebooted without asking for anything

[allexzander]

@eibex @nroach44 Indeed, the issue is annoying and is quick to fix. It's done now in https://github.com/nextcloud/desktop/pull/4566, however, expect the force reboot to be removed when updating from the next patch 3.5.2 to the subsequent 3.5.3 a, the parameter that prevents force reboot is added into an MSI and is also added into a calling code of the running desktop client. TL;DR; Expect the reboot issue to be fixed after updating to 3.5.2 and onwards.

[SommerEngineering]

@allexzander Okay, thanks for your explanation 🙂 So, it was expected that today, when I updated 3.5.1 to 3.5.2, the forced reboot happend once again? But next, when the update 3.5.3 gets released, it should not happen again?

[eibex]

Forced reboot happened while upgrading from 3.5.2 to 3.5.3

[nroach44]

Can confirm: Windows Installer requires a system restart. Product Name: Nextcloud. Product Version: 3.2.4.20210706. Product Language: 1033. Manufacturer: Nextcloud GmbH. Type of System Restart: 1. Reason for Restart: 2.

[allexzander]

@eibex @nroach44 My bad. Apparently, this was not backported :(

Likely, we won't have any more bug-fix releases for 3.5, so, the fix will be available in 3.6.1.

[Kraligor]

Just my two cents, but you should really, really consider breaking procedure and implement it as emergency fix. It doesn't look like a huge issue from a technical POV but if I were your service manager I'd probably categorize it as critical because behavior like that has the potential to seriously hurt Nextcloud as a brand. Especially when users (who typically don't browse incident reports) are forced to experience it over and over again.

[markusdd]

I totally agree. I had people coming back to me, being furious, because they had their PC restarted in the middle of a call or had their work interrupted.

There is >zero< justification doing that for something like Nextcloud. No one expects that.

[ghost]

I totally agree. I had people coming back to me, being furious, because they had their PC restarted in the middle of a call or had their work interrupted.

And rightfully so. Just that it is not even your fault, but Nextcloud's.

I am seriously puzzled by who decided that a forced reboot is a good idea for a software that they want to be used in production environments. We might simply be annoyed, but deal with it. People who are not as tech-savvy and just want to work associate Nextcloud with trouble by now as this has been happening for several updates.

Regaining trust is tough... An emergeny fix would be a first step.

[markusdd]

The real issue with this is: It is those kinds of people you have to tell: Install your updates. Keep your system up to date.

Then they to it, and are greeted with something like this. This is not a small problem.

[allexzander]

These are all valid points that I am going to discuss with my colleagues, and we'll see what and when we can do. Thx.

[tdaugaard]

This is extremely annoying. We're not even asked if we want to reboot now or reboot later like every single other application on the planet in the history of Windows. I just updated to 3.5.3 and it still did this. Completely unacceptable.

Can we expect that the NEXT update from 3.5.3 to whatever is next will NOT forcibly restart my PC?

[Kraligor]

These are all valid points that I am going to discuss with my colleagues, and we'll see what and when we can do. Thx.

@allexzander Thanks for being responsive and taking the matter seriously.

[captainwasabi]

why was this closed when it is still happening in the latest update. This is 100% unacceptable. I'm going to send an email to all my users to just skip updating their desktop clients until this is fixed. How did this get past QA? Does no one fight for the users?

[Magneticdud]

Need to reopen the issue, as it rebooted without any confirm for 3.5.3. It forces reboot too, no matter if you have unsaved work. Just close everything and reboot?????? If a reboot is this important, can you put a "now you must reboot, please save all your work and press continue"? Please, forced and surprise reboots are not fun at all

[q-wertz]

Guys this has been now posted about 5 times. Everyone knows that this behavior is not good and unwanted and the maintainers already responded:

My bad. Apparently, this was not backported :(

It seems to be a mistake and they already reacted. Please stop spamming the issue with the same complaint again and again…

[Magneticdud]

We know it's a mistake, but when it happens four-five times in a row over a year, it starts to be annoying

If the fix it's not ready, better to keep the windows client on 3.5.2 or earlier than continuing to push harmful updates that fix minor issues. Users will start to think "nextcloud will crash my computer and i will lose all my unsaved data" and will ignore every single update from now on...

It's not an obscure bug, it clearly appears at the moment of installation. Just test it for 10 seconds before publishing it, and will see the problem... (no test? Just "if it compiles, ship it"?)

[allexzander]

We've released 3.5.4 which now contains a fix. Updating automatically from 3.5.3 to 3.5.4 will still trigger a reboot, but, updating from 3.5.4 to a newer version, will not force a reboot (you will be able to choose yes/no on the reboot prompt, however, it is recommended to reboot if the Explorer.exe is not restarted by MSI).

To prevent rebooting when doing auto-update from 3.5.3 to 3.5.4, you can just download the installer and run it manually only this time https://nextcloud.com/install/#install-clients

[User65481]

@allexzander can you maybe add this to the release notes/changelog? https://github.com/nextcloud/desktop/releases/tag/v3.5.4

I had a look at the changelog, was happy that its fixed and pushed it. Now getting calls from users and downgrading is always bad.

[platima]

I cannot express how utterly angry this horrific failure in design just made me. An hour into recording an MP4 video with OBS and my computer decides to randomly restart for a software update that has no reason to require an OS reboot?

Given that there are still dozens of issues with this client, including the fact it broke hundreds of thousands of my files with the timestamp issue, and now also has ~700 files that are in a permanent sync loop due to an issue (#31464 I think) that was closed without being fixed, I really cannot justify paying hundreds of dollars per month for this service. This is on top of the mobile app being outdated and very slow, which means it is only really useable as a web browser service.

In my opinion, with the protection and stability of users files being seemingly so low on the developers priority list, when file management is seemingly a key selling point of the product, it just is not fit for production use at this point - unless you are looking for a digital file shredder perhaps. Version 0.24 may be a better number as opposed to Version 24, as I do not know how you can go version > 1 without having a stable product with design and testing controls in place.

To be completely honest, I was so very happy to migrate so much away from Google, but it feels that I'll be saving myself future time and files lost to move back at this point. I have had a hunt around though, and cannot find any 'Export' tools akin to the Google import one so that I can get all of my files, photos, notes, contacts, calendars and emails back to G Suite. Or even Microsoft 365 if that is an option. If someone can please advise of something like MigWiz that works, and I'll gladly pay for it, that'd be appreciated.

To the devs; a big middle finger for thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours lost, and to whomever else wants to use this for prod use PLEASE be aware that hundeds of users have had (collectively) millions of files damaged or destroyed by this software.

[Magneticdud]

A reboot during one hour of recording reeks of microsoft windows update, not nextcloud, which, while it does not mention reboot, it has a window "an upgrade is available" and asks UAC permission. It also usually ask for update at login, not after several hours

Second, the hundreds of dollars you're paying each month are 100% going in the pockets of who's hosting the service, not nextcloud or the devs, unless you had nextcloud enterprise

[User65481]

@Magneticloud WinUpdate asks before reboots and gives you multiple warnings, doesn't even does it when it recognizes activity on the system. Nextcloud does not - not even a timer, telling you a reboot will happen.

How this issue was dragged along, combined with suboptimal communication, including patchnotes that are unclear, leave users frustrated. For production, including multiple thousands of users, nextcloud made me grind my teeth a few times. I don't like to say it but it is what it is.

[platima]

@Magneticdud Nah known issue; Nextcloud will pop up for update, you go 'yep' and get back to what you are doing, then BOOM reboot ffs.

Event log entry: The process msiexec.exe has initiated the restart of computer KP-I7 on behalf of user NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM for the following reason: No title for this reason could be found Reason Code: 0x80030002 Shut-down Type: restart Comment: The Windows Installer initiated a system restart to complete or continue the configuration of 'Nextcloud'.

[kleajmp]

I totally agree this automatic windows reboot after an update is the worst behaviour you can expect for "just" a simple desktop cloud manager. The desktop client is running on my server which is also my desktop computer, but rebooting my server for a stupid update is really a no go! Just because "explorer.exe" needs to be restarted which is actually not really necessary in most cases... Please change this behaviour into just an "explorer.exe" restart and put at least an option to ask the user permission before doing this. I dropped my Dropbox for Nextcloud because the Dropbox desktop app was annoying asking me to pay more money all the time or pushing one if its new unnecessary features where no one cares about. But this behaviour makes me consider to switch back to the commercial. I hope this option comes in next version.

[platima]

Glad it's not just me my friend!

------ Original Message ------ From: "kleajmp" @.> To: "nextcloud/desktop" @.> Cc: "platima" @.>; "Comment" @.> Sent: 11/08/2022 08:13:36 Subject: Re: [nextcloud/desktop] Do not require restarting the PC after installing with MSI installer (#3551)

I totally agree this automatic windows reboot after an update is the worst behaviour you can expect for "just" a simple desktop cloud manager. The desktop client is running on my server which is also my desktop computer, but rebooting my server for a stupif update is really a no go! Just because "explorer.exe" needs to be restarted which is actually not really necessary in most cases... Please change this behaviour into just an "explorer.exe" restart and put at least an option to ask the user permission before doing this. I dropped my Dropbox for Nextcloud because the Dropbox desktop app was annoying asking me to pay more money all the time or pushing on if its new unnecessary features, but this behaviour makes me consider to switch back to the commercial. I hope this option comes in next version.

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[Kraligor]

I totally agree this automatic windows reboot after an update is the worst behaviour you can expect for "just" a simple desktop cloud manager. The desktop client is running on my server which is also my desktop computer, but rebooting my server for a stupid update is really a no go! Just because "explorer.exe" needs to be restarted which is actually not really necessary in most cases... Please change this behaviour into just an "explorer.exe" restart and put at least an option to ask the user permission before doing this. I dropped my Dropbox for Nextcloud because the Dropbox desktop app was annoying asking me to pay more money all the time or pushing one if its new unnecessary features where no one cares about. But this behaviour makes me consider to switch back to the commercial. I hope this option comes in next version.

Apparently they have made the restart optional in 3.5.4+: https://github.com/nextcloud/desktop/issues/3551#issuecomment-1203608570

[tflidd]

Still see the "issue" on a machine on Windows 10 Pro, NC Client 3.6.2->3.6.4 it asked to restart explorer.exe and after the installation it even asked to reboot the system (or dalay to do it later). I think it said it was a MSI-Install-Package...

I manage to update certain things like sync clients when I reboot anyway.

[hristian-carabulea]

Updated to Version 3.9.0. I had to reboot PC, that is I had to close all my open applications and stop what I was doing.

Can you finally stop this aggressive behavior of Nextcloud updates or I have to dump it? Megasync or Onedrive will suffice for me. I do not necessarily need to use storage on my own server any longer.

Thank you.

[markusdd]

yup. it is absolutely beyond me why nextcloud still prompts for reboots. for this type of applications this makes 0 sense. This is a folder sync app, not a Kernel update.

100% the biggest annoyance right now.

[captainwasabi]

Not a nextcloud dev, but I think I can explain this. Under certain circumstances the shell overlays (the little green checkboxes) that are displayed on the file icons will not refresh properly until you reboot. Just select "reboot later" and it's always worked for me. IIRC this is a M$ thing that has been a loooooong standing issue (so long that guaranteed it'll never change).

[Magneticdud]

Updated to Version 3.9.0. I had to reboot PC, that is I had to close all my open applications and stop what I was doing.

Can you finally stop this aggressive behavior of Nextcloud updates or I have to dump it? Megasync or Onedrive will suffice for me. I do not necessarily need to use storage on my own server any longer.

Thank you.

It's NOT the same bug. I just tried it. It asked "do you want to reboot? Yes/No", and it's possible to click No if you don't want it.

The original bug instead was "forced reboot without even a warning to the user"

[hristian-carabulea]

OK, thanks.

[gbakeman]

Anyone think this is worth another issue/investigation into? I thought the issue just boils down to restarting the shell (kind of a hack?) I think I've seen installers do this as efficiently as possible by offering to kill explorer.exe and restarting it. That looses any open explorer windows but still better than a full logout or reboot. I don't know if there's any better-practice way of doing this.

[Magneticdud]

It already asks to kill explorer.exe and if you deny it suggests a reboot

edit: yesterday on a windows 11 pc it did that, today on another windows 10 pc, it did not prompt to restart explorer, just to reboot

[markusdd]

Wrong. Even with explorer restart it does suggest the reboot.

At least that should be fixed.

[Magneticdud]

Wrong. Even with explorer restart it does suggest the reboot.

It suggests and asks for a reboot, which can be conveniently denied by the user.

This issue is not related, as it was about a forced reboot without a confirmation or even a warning, at the time it just rebooted.

[markusdd]

It should not be doing that nonetheless.

I think what people obviously do not wish to understand is that this is a HUGE irritation for the average user.

It is affecting nextcloud in ways Devs do not seem to want to understand. To me it is merely an annoyance and chance for an inconvenient misclick.

I think the fundamental problem is that this behavior overall has to end, as I thionk even relaunching explorer is a bad solution. If nextcloud is to be the european counterpart to google drive, iCloud and Dropbox, (which I think is maissively and critically important) it has to strive for the same convenience and user experience.

My little self hosted home setup does not matter, but I have experience with on-prem hosted nextcloud installs for hundreds of people and this update process is the NUMBER ONE problem people have with nexctloud.

This imho needs attention before almost anything else when it comes to the windows client.

[platima]

I think what some people may miss understanding is the edge cases that utterly brutalise workflows.

For example I got involved in this issue when I had a text file open that I was drafting a long email in. You could have anything open though; a web form with medical details you're filling out, your tax return in Excel that you've not yet saved, etc.

BUT, then horror struck. I started the update, went back to my document and was typing. The 'restart' dialog popped up at the end of the install and I think the default button must have been 'OK' because I hit spacebar to enter a space in my document RIGHT as that dialog came up, and boom - everything closed and my computer restarted. An hour or so work lost.

I was furious and nearly put my computer into the wall. Then the lovely "Installing Windows Updates" popped up, so I left the house before burning it down.

Since then, I no longer use the Nextcloud client. I have recently tried reinstalling it, but it is so utterly bug riddled that I uninstalled it within a few minutes, and for months now I only use the web interface and use OneDrive for my file sync instead.

Hopefully that use case and horror story gives you some idea. Could be worse; Teams call with the CEO, typing notes as you chat, and the 'space' hits reboot cutting the call off and he cannot get back to you for an hour.

-Platima

------ Original Message ------ From "Markus Krause" @.> To "nextcloud/desktop" @.> Cc "platima" @.>; "Comment" @.> Date 15/06/2023 17:53:35 Subject Re: [nextcloud/desktop] Do not require restarting the PC after installing with MSI installer (#3551)

It should not be doing that nonetheless.

I think what people obviously do not wish to understand is that this is a HUGE irritation for the average user.

It is affecting nextcloud in ways Devs do not seem to want to understand. To me it is merely an annoyance and chance for an inconvenient misclick.

I think the fundamental problem is that this behavior overall has to end, as I thionk even relaunching explorer is a bad solution. If nextcloud is to be the european counterpart to google drive, iCloud and Dropbox, (which I think is maissively and critically important) it has to strive for the same convenience and user experience.

My little self hosted home setup does not matter, but I have experience with on-prem hosted nextcloud installs for hundreds of people and this update process is the NUMBER ONE problem people have with nexctloud.

This imho needs attention before almost anything else when it comes to the windows client.

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[Magneticdud]

are you seriously comparing a free product made by 50 employees and many volunteers to a paid product coded by a corporation with 165000 employees and an annual revenue of $400 billion?

Apple/Google/Dropbox have the resources to test all the quirks that can happen if you don't restart explorer.exe

btw, if you click on "yes, you can reboot", then you can't complain "the computer did exactly was it was told"

[platima]

Think you completely missed the point sorry mate.

Don't get me wrong, I utterly hate Apple, Microsoft and Google. I just need to be able to move between physical locations and know my files are there

------ Original Message ------ From "Magneticdud" @.> To "nextcloud/desktop" @.> Cc "platima" @.>; "Comment" @.> Date 15/06/2023 6:12:33 PM Subject Re: [nextcloud/desktop] Do not require restarting the PC after installing with MSI installer (#3551)

are you seriously comparing a free product made by 50 employees and many volunteers to a paid product coded by a corporation with 165000 employees and an annual revenue of $400 billion?

Apple/Google/Dropbox have the resources to test all the quirks that can happen if you don't restart explorer.exe

btw, if you click on "yes, you can reboot", then you can't complain "the computer did exactly was it was told"

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