We need fuel.

[Amplar]

Combat is hitting breaking point. I can't keep nerfing things to try to supplement the real problem. Tanks are too small. We need fuel to take up interior space. It's the easiest thing to do. It will use ammo crates and each engine will have a specified consumption based on throttle.

Fuel basics:

Same flammability/explode-ability for gasoline/diesel. Use ammo crates. Engines should be rated in liters or gallons per minute (it will be exaggerated obviously.)

Please, tweak, ferv, someone, I'm ready to give up on ACF. Changes need to be made to combat that aren't raw nerfs.

[nrlulz]

Pretty sure li-ion batteries did not exist in the 60s. Not that it has to affect the stats

[Fervidusletum]

Also, how much lighter should electrics be, now that they don't have to account for battery weight?

[Fervidusletum]

I subtracted about 5 minutes worth of battery weight from electrics; small 250 > 100, med 850 > 575, large 1900 > 1500.

Electrics drain far less energy now; the large electric will empty a 2x4x4 battery in 5 minutes.

Electric energy drain is based purely on kw output, so it drains the most power at peak kw, at drops off at the start and end of the rpm range. Assuming energy drain is watts = voltage * amps, constant voltage is applied and amps are tied to power output; the power usage mirrors the power output. Source: http://hpevs.com/Site/images/torque-curves/ac-76/imperial/ac76%20imperial%20peak%20144%20volt%20500%20amp.pdf

Am I interpreting this correctly?

[Redreaper]

This is a hilariously terrible idea for a reason y'all totally forgot.

People now don't move. Combat is stationary. Moving = frontal armor not forward = vulnerable. Now, if you add into it a penalty for moving, you're just gonna freeze combat MORE. Peeps play it safe in fighting, they always have. They fear penetration more than a skinny guy in prison, and this just makes that even WORSE.

The only way you can even consider implementing this, is if a single set size fuel tank was used for a set engine, lasting either a really long time or forever (anything more than a minor penalty, and they'll pillbox). And making it small is really more practical. Most tanks are already anemic as fuck on ammo, so they'll gradually grow or be combat useless.

It's a fun thought, and it looks cool, but the balancing aspect is not gonna work out the way you want. Just ain't.

[Fervidusletum]

I disagree. Tanks aren't going to be so limited on fuel that the driver is more concerned with conserving fuel than combat. And if it does get to that point, perhaps the tank builder needs to rethink their build strategy

Fast, petrol fuelled tanks are going to need a lot of fuel, so they'll have to sacrifice by increasing in size, decreasing ammo, or decreasing run time. Alternatively, they can switch to a less fuel hungry engine, such as a diesel. They suffer in power to weight, but consume significantly less fuel. Turbines are slightly more efficient than diesels, but take up more volume.

I ask that you give it a try before denouncing it. I'm trying to make it a reasonable addition to combat. If it turns out that fuel is too restrictive with the current settings, I can easily adjust the fuel consumption rate and the amount of fuel per container.

[Redreaper]

You can't possibly be serious... I cannot imagine any, ANY, tank builder, who would, for instance, choose to move a lot if movement took up ammo. Unless it was such a miniscule amount that it didn't justify adding it in the first place. It's also another level of complexity, another component, which makes shit more difficult for newbies. We've got an entire thread dedicated to this. This is a very bad idea for balance.

[Fervidusletum]

I won't argue it further; I know I won't change your mind on the topic. However, if you've got a better idea to make tanks larger, or achieve better balance, please let us know. We can always use more input.

Also, I included a means of disabling fuel requirements, so people who are firmly against fuel can continue with business as usual on servers that disable it.

[Amplar]

yeah, great, that means sestze will just disable it on ggg forever, making all this work for nothing. i won't be around much anymore. I got an on-call locksmith job so i'll be gone most of the time. i'm making mad money, though.

[Redreaper]

most tanks aren't that far off on size scale, actually. Of course tanks are smaller than necessarily reality, because they can be designed more efficiently, and because they're also usually lighter. But big, long, hard black tanks are karbine's fetish

good for you mate. Congrads

[Fervidusletum]

Grats on the job. :D

Fuel functionality is pretty much done; I just need to add some e2 funcs and do some thorough polishing. If any of you want to have a quick look at it, maybe do a bit of testing, hit me up on steam and I'll get a listen server going.

It'll probably be a few more days before I commit anything.

[Redreaper]

We can work on other methods of handling tanks. Right now with the engine damage they're gonna be changing (that is, btw, grossly overdone. I suggest undo the hp nerf, and reduce the damage-torque bias to 50% torque before total failure? engines already made quite shitty armor except for the rear, which is exactly how they are in real life...)

I think mostly tanks are being changed more than they need to be, and I'm getting a lot of people who are upset about it pming me. This is part of why I'm almost always offline anymore.

I will be probably disabling fuel on FRS if it is added. I'm staunchly against its addition. I have a feeling it's going to wind up like spall did. Probably better to just abandon it, tbh.

[Fervidusletum]

@nrlulz Could you give me commit permissions to this repository? It's a nightmare trying to keep my fork up to date with this repository (nothing I've tried allows me to update and make clean pull requests).