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Surfaces - cobblestone v sett #53

Open boothym opened 4 years ago

boothym commented 4 years ago

I've noticed some "cobbled" streets which would normally be tagged as surface=cobblestone. are now being tagged as surface=sett - mostly from users of the Streetcomplete app.

Here's the current cobblestone v sett situation: https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/URZ - as you can see there are a few places where adjacent streets with the same surface on the ground are being tagged differently in OSM.

Seems silly to have two surface values meaning the same thing! Any suggestions as to what should be done? Change setts to cobblestone or follow the wiki and use setts for the cobbled streets?

Might need to be discussed on the mailing lists as well.

chrisfleming commented 4 years ago

So reminding myself on the surface page on the wiki, it looks like general use of surface=cobblestone is being discouraged for surface=sett or surface=unhewn_cobblestone

I've generally used surfaces=sett for some of the better laid and generally smoother setts and cobblestone for the more common examples in Edinburgh,

boothym commented 4 years ago

Having looked at the mailing list, wiki, and tag history, I found that surface=sett only started being used after it was added to the wiki in 2011. And then about 18 months ago there was a discussion which resulted in the current situation of sett/unhewn_cobblestone: https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=61042.

The numbers are now getting closer - cobblestone has 181k v 125k for sett, but only 3.5k v 3.1k in the UK. I assume sett will close the gap eventually - just depends on whether people start retagging cobblestones.

I found India Place tagged as sett (by a StreetComplete user) and the surrounding streets as cobblestone: https://www.bing.com/maps?osid=774eeae7-30ba-4cfc-833b-2ff4577174d3&cp=55.957262~-3.20697&lvl=19&dir=298.88046&pi=-9.079712&style=x&mo=z.1.39&v=2&sV=2&form=S00027

If the setts are really smooth and not much space between them, they probably become paving_stones?

Funnily enough, the Wikipedia page for sett paving features an image from Edinburgh https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sett_(paving) - though they are (wrongly) tagged as paving_stones in OSM!

boothym commented 3 years ago

Sett is now equal with cobblestone globally and has more uses in the UK, so it looks like the tagging is only going in one direction. http://taghistory.raifer.tech/#***/surface/cobblestone&***/surface/unhewn_cobblestone&***/surface/sett

Scotland has twice as many cobblestones than setts tagged though.

Might be worth reviewing as many streets as possible and following the new tagging to get rid of cobblestone. Because we have this situation with what looks like identical "cobbled" surfaces which are tagged differently, and mappers will be confused over what to use for the untagged section! For example: