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pascallanger / DIY-Multiprotocol-TX-Module

Multiprotocol TX Module (or MULTI-Module) is a 2.4GHz transmitter module which controls many different receivers and models.
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2165676&goto=newpost
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Extend HOTT Telemetry for GAM and EAM Values #304

Closed Flying-Bolt closed 4 years ago

Flying-Bolt commented 4 years ago

Is there already a planning in which version the other telemetry sensor values will be implemented by GAM (General Engine Module) or EAM (Electric Air Module)?

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I don't have any HoTT hardware anymore (sent back to the owner). If you have sensors then we could look to see if the RX is reporting something to the radio using telemetry when you plug them. If not then I have no way to know what to send to the RX to get the info. If it does then we can see if it's possible to decode them. To do this you would need to connect your module to a computer using serial, flash it in debug mode and copy the output of the serial monitor. It requires time and effort so if you are willing to look into it we can try. Pascal

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Hello Pascal,

I am also interested in getting as much functionality into the HOTT protocol as possible as I do have many HOTT receivers, but I am about to switch to the Jumper T16 pro and I also have two irangex IRX4 Plus modules which I used to upgrade my old 35Mhz radio to 2.4Ghz. I use the "GR-12L SUMD +T" micro receiver in all 5 of my quadcopters. I don't have a GAM or EAM but the flight controllers flashed with betaflight report back as a EAM when HoTT telemetry is selected. They also deliver GPS data to the receiver. My Graupner radio is currently send in for service (MZ-24), so I have a few receivers lying around (GR-12L SUMD +T, GR-16, GR-32) doing nothing for some time (and I do not fly much during the winter). I don't have the knowledge on how to analyse or even record the relevant data, but would be willing to try or give my support in any way possible. Best regards Harry

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

I don't have a clue about such stuff but would data from within the files of the following Made4RC github help?

https://github.com/Made4RC/HoTTServer https://github.com/Made4RC/HoTTClient

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I really need a RX and a couple of sensors to figure out how it works. If you are willing to ship these parts to me in France I'll have a look. Pascal

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

I don't own any sensors at this moment. I currently only use the HOTT telemetry data supplied by my betaflight flight-controllers (F4 and F7 boards). They identify as EAM (and GPS if a GPS is connected to the FC). However, as my interest in this is quite high, I would be willing to buy some sensors and send them to you, maybe I can find some used ones for a reasonable price. Would an EAM be sufficient or would you need a GAM as well?

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Did you get my email with the source code?

I don't recall seeing an email. Have you used my yahoo address? What source code are you atlking about?

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I don't own any sensors at this moment. I currently only use the HOTT telemetry data supplied by my betaflight flight-controllers (F4 and F7 boards). They identify as EAM (and GPS if a GPS is connected to the FC). However, as my interest in this is quite high, I would be willing to buy some sensors and send them to you, maybe I can find some used ones for a reasonable price. Would an EAM be sufficient or would you need a GAM as well?

I need to look at the HoTT word more closely. I don't know what EAM and GAM really means in term of hardware. Iwas under impression that you can plug a simple voltage sensor or a variometer. But listening to you it looks more like the Hitec stations where you plug all the sensors. Is it what you mean by that? I really need a RX in fact. May be with the link you sent and wiring a "HoTTServer" will give me some clue on how telemetry works over the air.

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

I am not yet an expert on this matter, as I don't have any sensors/modules, but I do use the HoTT telemetry in my multi-rotors which run on the betaflight firmware. Here is what I know:

There are quite a few HoTT-sensors that you can use which you simply plug into the T-socket of the receiver such as a vario, GPS, RPM-sensor, voltage-sensor, termperature, etc. As far as I know you can connect several sensors using a Y-adapter cable for example. <- So your assumption was absolutely correct!

Then there are modules, such as the Electric Air Module (EAM). This module already includes the following sensors and is made with electric crafts in mind:

The General Air Module (GAM) is very similar, includes many of the same sensors with the additional option for fuel-metering and RPM sensors for combustion-engines.

Each module can be accessed via the telemetry-screen on an HoTT-transmitter and programmed to output different warnings (maximum altitude for example, etc)

When using an F3, F4 or F7 flight-controller for multi-rotors, flashed with the betaflight firmware, you can configure it to output telemetry data in the HOTT-format. You then connect the telemetry pad of the Rx with the telemetry UART of the flight controller, which will identify itself as an EAM and delivers the following telemetry-data (provided the flight controller has the relevant sensors on board, or connected):

TL;DR So there are following sources for telemetry data:

I wrote this from limited knowledge and from memory, hope my claims are largely correct.

I can provide you a Receiver (a "GR-12L SUMD +T" and a "GR-16") and soon with a EAM and GAM which I ordered, if it helps. I would love to do more to help, but I simply don't have the skills.

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Hello Pascal,

I know it is a hassle and that Graupner HoTT is not used by too many people within the hobby, but if you would be interested in pursuing this further I have now bought and can provide you with some hardware if needed to do so and I am willing to send them to you. I live in Germany, so sending to France is not a problem. If interested you can find my public E-Mail address in my profile and contact me directly. A donation from my side is of course assured :)

A betaflight developer pointed out to me that the following might help as well (but I guess you might already be aware of it):

https://github.com/betaflight/betaflight/blob/master/src/main/telemetry/hott.c https://github.com/betaflight/betaflight/blob/master/src/main/telemetry/hott.h

I also found these projects that seem to include HoTT data:

https://github.com/obayer/MultiWii-HoTT/blob/master/MultiWii_2_1/HoTTv4.ino https://github.com/3yc/hott-for-ardupilot/tree/master/PX4/hott-px4-code/px4-hott-module

Harry

PS: If there is anything else I could do to help to make this easier, let me know. My knowledge in these things it little to none but I am always willing to learn :)

hgo-be commented 4 years ago

Hello Pascal, Implementation of the graupner hott sensor modules could be very simple as the implementation can be read from the open source project http://www.nongnu.org/dataexplorer. The hott protocol is implemented in the HottAdapter.

Hendrik

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Sadly not since that doesn't tell me how the data is sent over the air... All the links you are sending are about what the RX reads on its input. But this is not the point here, the goal is to know what to send to the RX so it sends this data over. It does not do it by itself and the data is also coded to be transported over the air. So I don't see how it can be "very simple". May be I'm missing something. If that's as simple as you say please submit a PR with the appropriate code change in Multi and OpenTX. Pascal

hgo-be commented 4 years ago

Sorry , I was not aware of the two way communication. Hendrik PS I appreciate your superb work, I have donated 10€ last week.

wimalopaan commented 4 years ago

Do you need a Hott-TX and Rx? Or just some sensors?

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I have everything I need, just need some time to work on it.

wimalopaan commented 4 years ago

Oh, then I misinterpreted the previous posts. I read that you had to pass the Hott stuff back to the owner.

Since Graupner/SJ in Germany is effectively dead and in the foreseeing future the will be only some distributing support from Robbe and D-Power, I think that a lot of people now are interested in using some other TX with the SJ-RX stuff.

In my personal opinion this is a really great feature! Thanks a lot!

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

You interpreted correctly, but in the meantime someone else supplied a new set of equipment to Pascal :).

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

@pascallanger just wondering if your received my last mail or if it might have landed in your spam-folder :) I know there is a lot going on around the project at the moment and that you are really busy, but maybe you had a chance to have another glance at the Hott protocol?

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

@HazzaHFPV Sorry but I'm extremely busy right now. The coronavirus is putting a lot of pressure on all my professional projects and my time is fully dedicated to it. I'm not expecting much progress within the next 2 weeks or so. I apologize but...

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

No worries and absolutely no need to apologize. Just hoped for a little update and, as always, thanks for the hard work :)

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

@pascallanger In case you need some more hardware, let me know. I have plenty Graupner stuff, and I live in France (Picardie, Clermont de L'oise).

Herman-54 commented 4 years ago

I have a Kakute F7 1.5 flightcontroller and a GR-16 Hott receiver from Graupner. The problem for as long as I build this 5" freestyle quadcopter is, that there is no connection between those 2. Can anybody help me? Thanks, Herman

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Hi Herman, I have both, a gr-16 and an kakute F7 here at home. I guess I can help you. How did you connect the GR-16 with the board? Feel free to e-mail me, you can find my address in my profile so that we don't spam this topic :) greetings Harry

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I'm starting to look at the HoTT protocol. Sorry it took so long but just getting back to it today. I'm already getting some info from the ESC (Batt, rpm, temp,...) so I'm getting somewhere ;-)

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Awesome! Pascal, you rule ;)

And for anyone else who might have a similar problem as Herman and happend to land here: Don't forget to define the Signal output ("CH OUT TYPE: ...") in the telemetry menu of the receiver. Further information can be found in the manuals of the receivers.

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

@HazzaHFPV I've spent 4-5 hours yesterday asking why I couldn't get the ESC text config to appear. Finally I took the mz-24 which can't access it either. Is it expected?

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

I am sorry to say that I can only work from memory. I only bought the ESC to have as many sensors as possible for you and have not used it thoroughly myself, only tested it for the setup that I sent you. I have another MZ-24 which I borrowed from a friend currently. I will write you an E-Mail with some pictures, maybe we can figure this out together this way.

EDIT: I just sent you the promised mail with pictures. In the telemet. menu you have to scroll to the last page, select the sensor, which makes a new page appear, which you can then access by pressing "ENT" once more. This should bring you to the settings-page of that sensor.

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

On my MC-32 I have to go into the "RX Telemetry" menu of the ESC and go right until it won't go any further. There I can set the channel out type: CH OUT TYPE:SUMI

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I am sorry to say that I can only work from memory. I only bought the ESC to have as many sensors as possible for you and have not used it thoroughly myself, only tested it for the setup that I sent you. I have another MZ-24 which I borrowed from a friend currently. I will write you an E-Mail with some pictures, maybe we can figure this out together this way.

EDIT: I just sent you the promised mail with pictures. In the telemet. menu you have to scroll to the last page, select the sensor, which makes a new page appear, which you can then access by pressing "ENT" once more. This should bring you to the settings-page of that sensor.

This is what I've checked on the mz-24 at 2am last night and even when you click on "ESC" it does not display the text menu at the end of the RX menu. If I do the same with the GPS and EAM they do display correctly, so I'm thiking I'm doing the right thing and the original Graupner is not dowing anything better than me... They are saying in the doc that the RX and ESC versions should match to get the text to display, not sure if that could be the case here as I don't know how (heven't looked) on how to upgrade the ESC. I'll just continue the implementation like if it does work and will see later.

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Another thing that through me off and made me lost a lot of time is that you need to go through the RX menu if you want to see the sensor you selected. I've noticed that if you do DEC (or INC I can't remember) on the first RX page, it goes to the sensor directly. There doesn't seem to have a way to tell the TX just give me the text page of the sensor I'm asking for...

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

I'm planning to auto detect the sensors like they do. Meanning that only sensors plugged to the RX a the time of a HoTT model load (or TX powered on with a HoTT model) will be polled. It's waiting for the RX to be up right to assess the sensors in any case.

Otherwise I can poll all sensors all the time which is easier but that slows down the updates of the sensors... Not sure if this is really a problem in fact...

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

They are saying in the doc that the RX and ESC versions should match to get the text to display, not sure if that could be the case here as I don't know how (haven't looked) on how to upgrade the ESC. I'll just continue the implementation like if it does work and will see later.

I remember spending an evening updating all firmwares and testing that all the sensors worked and are accessible. I even vaguely remember programming the ESC, but it was with some trouble I think. It could well be that I made a mistake with the ESC or it might be that this particular ESC is not playing along nicely. The only further suggestions that I could find in a German forum was to make sure that TX and RX are not too close to each other (at least 1m apart) and one guy reported having trouble programming his ESC in a HF-noisy environment (WiFi) and that it worked better in the field, but that sounds more like a coincidence and placebo-effect than anything else. I noticed that I have the Graupner USB interface cable for updating sensors and Receivers still lying around here. If you require it, I could mail it to you. Don't understand why I didn't include it in the original package. Did I include the USB stick with firmware and manuals? If not I could mail you the different firmware *.bin files to try, but just continuing and having a further look later is probably the least frustrating path. I know that trial and error with different firmwares eats up a lot of time.

I'm planning to auto detect the sensors like they do. Meaning that only sensors plugged to the RX at the time of a HoTT model load (or TX powered on with a HoTT model) will be polled. It's waiting for the RX to be up right to assess the sensors in any case.

Sounds good, but I know too little about these things as to give constructive input, which I am really sorry about :/ All I know is that once you get everything is working, Graupner is great. BUT it can be finicky and annoying to get to that point sometimes. I trust your professional judgement will find the best way, and I thank you for it :)

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

There was a major change in the firmware history of the Rx that required a recent Firmware on the Tx, so I think you may have hit that one.

Regarding the sensor detection, HoTT does it the way you described (Autodetect at Power-on). Once the sensors are detected, you will not add another one. IMHO, efficiency is the better approach here. If, once the sensors are detected, we can free CPU cycles for the rest of the system, that is always better.

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

I can almost (98% sure) guarantee that the Tx, Rx and sensors are on the latest Firmware. The only one that I might not quite be so certain about is the ESC. Firmware Versions are Tx MZ-24 Pro: v2.029 Rx GR-16: v7a07

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

Latest for MZ-24 Pro is: v2.029 Latest for GR-17: 7a07

So you are set with the latest. Should be fine.

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Regarding the sensor detection, HoTT does it the way you described (Autodetect at Power-on). Once the sensors are detected, you will not add another one. IMHO, efficiency is the better approach here. If, once the sensors are detected, we can free CPU cycles for the rest of the system, that is always better.

It does not free CPU but instead increase the refresh rate of the connected sensor(s). Example: if you have 1 sensor only, you can poll only this sensor instead of trying all the time the 6 possible sensors. 1 sensor poll is 50ms, so if you poll 1 sensor you have values every 50ms, if you poll the 6, you have this sensor values every 300ms. Add to that the loss of over air and you could receive your single sensor every minute or so...

What I've done is the following:

There is at power up a sporadic sensor that appears every 10-20 power up... I think this is a bug in their RX software. I don't really want to filter it out so it will stay like this...

Moving now to the Text config mode, leaving the decoding of sensors which is the hardest part for the end.

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

Ok. That makes sense (The sensor polling). Thanks for clarifying! And the "There is at power up a sporadic sensor that appears every 10-20 power up" may be a bug that HoTT has not detected yet :).

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Text config mode is working for RX and all sensors. You can cycle through the sensors with the Menu/MDL key. The cycle goes through all the sensors even if not discovered. I hope it's ok since that makes it easier for me... On the big color screen the sensor being viewed is displayed in the title bar. I need to figure out a way to display it on smaller screens (it cycles but you don't know where you are in the cycle).

The telemetry is now reworked on the OpenTX code side. It can accept all the incoming telemetry from all sensors. Now it needs to be able to decode all these data...

HaleyACS commented 4 years ago

Cool :) for the text mode!

"The cycle goes through all the sensors even if not discovered. I hope it's ok since that makes it easier for me..." The question will be: Does the Sensor actually provide telemetry? The discussions we had in the lounge about that was: it is better to have displayed only what is discovered. This way - if you have the wrong sensor connected, you'll see it ;}

Anyway - having a working sample is the first step :) So do as you think is best!

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

The text mode now cycles only through the RX and discovered sensors.

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

This all sounds really good. I know I sound like a broken record, but thanks for all the effort.

sbuhre commented 4 years ago

Hi Pascal, I'm also interested in seeing the telemetry feature for HoTT. If needed I can do some testing: I have GR12,GR16 receivers and Voltage-Module, Vario-Modul, PowerBox Competition SRS, Unilog 2 (very popular in Germany) ready for testing. Stephan

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Hi @pascallanger I have now started setting up my Jumper T16 with the internal Multi-Module and I have noticed something odd while testing the HoTT protocol with my "Gr-12L SMD +T" receivers (product No. S1045 and S1046) - the small one which I also sent you.

My setup:

The Symptoms: The receiver is experiencing what seems like mini signal-losses? When bound the red LED on the receiver should stay off. This is what I confirmed by borrowing a Graupner MZ-24 from a friend. However, if I bind the receiver with the T16 using the Multi-Module, the LED comes on very briefly about every 7 seconds. Mostly it just flashes briefly, but once in a while it stays on a little longer for about 0.5 - 1.0 seconds or so.

Behaviour in flight: The Quadcopter flies normally for the majority of the time. Those really brief signal-losses/failsafes are unnoticed (meaning the quick flashes). Once in a while the quad freezes in flight for about 0.5 - 0.8 seconds before I regain control. The delay for a full failsafe (disarming) in betaflight is a little longer. I think, so it did not lead to a crash yet, but when you are inverted over a tree it gets your heartrate up when the quad doesnt react.

What I have tried:

More Data: Here is a short video of the flashing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTtmoKq7Lb0 During that video, the transmitter was moved over 2 meters away from the receiver.

Here is an extract of a betaflight Log, RC Commands received by the Flight Controller: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DA22eQ_7F-Y&feature=youtu.be

Here is a Betaflight Blackbox Log if it helps, one event can be seen at timestamp 00:49 and lasts about 0.85 seconds: https://www.dropbox.com/s/kxfjybtys4kv9fc/LOG00030.BFL?dl=0

I tried my best to eliminate as many variables as possible and I think I could narrow it down to the T16. I do not observe that behaviour when using the same radio with FrSky xm+ receivers (D16 EU LBT protocol). You are more qualified than I am to verify or rule out if there is a bug in the HoTT protocol. Anyway, just wanted to share my observation and thank you for your help. Not sure if this should be a separate issue, so I wrote it in here for now. I also dropped you an E-Mail about the equipment, but I'm not sure if you have seen it yet. All the best and kind regards Harry

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

Okay. So I found out that this behaviour can only be observed when I configure Failsafe in the T16 to "Hold", "Custom" or "no pulses". The Failsafe settings then seem to be transmitted to the receiver every 7 seconds I guess? The LED does not flash if I set the Failsafe to "Receiver" or "Not set".

When I define the Failsafe positions in the MZ-24 and safe them, the LED on the receiver only flashes once briefly and then stays off.

Tomorrow I will test the flight behaviour once more and do another Blackbox Log with Failsafe set to "Receiver" in the T16, with which the failsafe settings don't seem to be sent every 7 seconds. Maybe it upsets the Receiver once in a while having to receive and save the failsafe positions on such a regular basis? The occasional times that the LED stays on for nearly 1 second puts me off, as it seems to correlate to the failsafes seen in the blackbox log.

tfode commented 4 years ago

Okay. So I found out that this behaviour can only be observed when I configure Failsafe in the T16 to "Hold", "Custom" or "no pulses".

Had the same issue not long ago (...), this is how to actually set it up: https://github.com/pascallanger/DIY-Multiprotocol-TX-Module/blob/master/Protocols_Details.md#HoTT---57

HazzaHFPV commented 4 years ago

@tfode Damn. Thanks for the hint! I normally am quite thorough with reading instructions, but this I completely missed. I do feel stupid now...

So, I guess then the last comments about my "problem" could be deleted as it is already addressed in the documentation and to allow this topic about extending the Hott telemetry to continue normally. I basically worked out the solution the hard way thinking it was a problem.

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Current status of Multi v1.3.1.1 release:

Todo: Implement LBT on the HoTT protocol

pascallanger commented 4 years ago

Telemetry video: Telemtry video Text mode video: Text mode video

Flying-Bolt commented 4 years ago

Well done!

wimalopaan commented 4 years ago

How do I switch the Sensor?

I only get the values of the receiver in Binary-mode.

In text-mode the receiver-pages and the next sensor page ist displayed.

Am 24.05.20 um 10:14 schrieb pascallanger:

Telemetry video: Telemtry video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geEbRglUB1A Text mode video: Text mode video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81wd8NlF3Qw

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pascallanger commented 4 years ago

@wimalopaan Have you compiled OpenTX with the PR mentionned above? Have you updated the Graupner HoTT LUA script from the PR above? Have you upgraded your module to v1.3.1.1? If the answer is yes to all then simply press Menu has written on the TX screen when you launch the Graupner HoTT LUA script. Menu being whatever you press to get to the model config.