search

schemaorg / suggestions-questions-brainstorming

Suggestions, questions, and brainstorming
20 stars 15 forks source link

Properly Defining SportsClub v SportsTeam #163

Open DaveyJake opened 6 years ago

DaveyJake commented 6 years ago

What exactly is the difference between SportsClub and SportsTeam? In the sport of Rugby Union, each could (in essence) be used interchangeably or not at all.

For example, I play for Boulder Rugby Football Club [Boulder RFC] in Colorado. We have 2 men's teams (A-side [1st team] and B-Side [2nd team]) -- 1 women's team (Boulder Babes) -- and 1 youth team (Boulder U18). That is 4 different rugby teams under 1 rugby club.

During national playoffs is when we start playing other clubs (or teams) from around the country. One of those clubs (or teams) is New York Athletic Club [NYAC]. However, NYAC isn't just a rugby club (or team). They have a variety of teams that compete in a variety of sports, all of which do so under the NYAC name. Their "rugby team" has both an A-side and B-side.

With that, what is the proper definition for SportsClub and SportsTeam and which is most appropriate for the examples I listed above? It may seem pretty straightforward but when I looked at the SportsTeam examples I wasn't sure to how to proceed and which one is more appropriate given the uniqueness of clubs and teams.

Any clarification would be greatly appreciated. Cheers!

philbarker commented 6 years ago

The key difference between SportsClub and SportsTeam in schema.org is that SportsClub is a type of local business and SportsTeam is a type of SportsOrganization. So pragmatically, it would depend on what you want to describe. SportsClub has no way of saying who plays & who coaches; whereas SportTeam has no way of saying how you pay to join or when it is open. BTW, you can use both if you want to lump together aspects of the two, or (better) you can say that the SportsClub has a subOrganization which is a SportsTeam.

HTH

DaveyJake commented 6 years ago

@philbarker So, if I'm understanding this correctly and wanted to include USA Rugby, the national governing body, is the following hierarchy correct?

SportsOrganization > SportsClub > SportsTeam

The end-goal I'm trying to achieve is a formal, declarative process for describing sports statistics for the sport of Rugby Union, from governing bodies to national teams to administrators (i.e. referees, coaches, team managers, physios, staff, etc) all the way down to players (i.e. individual position, if they were captain or vice-captain, number of matches, stats, etc).

philbarker commented 6 years ago

Depends which hierarchy you mean. SportsTeam doesn't fall under SportsClub in the schema.org hierarchy, though in the real world it could be seen that way. With schema.org you get a richer set of relationships than just simple hierarchy. I think the following are true USA Rugby is a SportsOrganization Boulder RFC is a SportsClub Boulder RFC is a memberOf USA Rugby Boulder RFC 1st XV is a SportsTeam Boulder RFC 1st XV is a subOrganization of Boulder RFC

DaveyJake commented 6 years ago

For match statistics and player performances, is Game the appropriate schema? I couldn't find any examples on Schema.org which is why I just want to confirm.

thadguidry commented 6 years ago

SportML-G2 has this covered now in many ways and many attribute layers and types to support Teams and Clubs and everything in between.

Here's just one attribute example https://iptc.org/std/SportsML/3.0/documentation/sportsml_xsd.html#coverageAttributes_team-coverage

DaveyJake commented 6 years ago

@thadguidry Wow! Okay, then the next question is where do I begin? This will definitely be my first rodeo with XSD.

Is this example for Rugby Union or Rugby League?

thadguidry commented 6 years ago

@DaveyJake ask them. Scroll down on this page and click + on the Sports Formats. Or scroll down and see their yahoo group https://iptc.org/standards/sportsml-g2/ Aligning with Schema.org is not for the faint of heart in the Sports domain however. But they are pretty much the most used standard out there for Sports vocabulary. I imagine that we will eventually formally work with them as an external extension like we did with GS1 but @danbri would be the one to answer our agenda for that, not me.

philbarker commented 6 years ago

@DaveyJake in that example I see properties for line-outs rucks & mauls, so I would guess Union.

You might also be interested in the BBC sports ontology https://www.bbc.co.uk/ontologies/sport

RichardWallis commented 3 years ago

See issue #7 for the context of the move from the main Schema.org issue tracker to this repository.