search

space-wizards / space-station-14

A multiplayer game about paranoia and chaos on a space station. Remake of the cult-classic Space Station 13.
https://spacestation14.io
MIT License
2.74k stars 3.48k forks source link

Requirements for unfreezing AI law changes #31924

Open slarticodefast opened 2 months ago

slarticodefast commented 2 months ago

We had a huge influx of AI law addition PRs, but AI is not ready for that yet until we address some basics:

The following law proposals will be compiled into one PR and discussed with the game admins once these conditions are fulfilled:

(Myra/VasilisTheChu: idk if this counts being here uh here I suppose)

t0wnshark commented 2 months ago

Question - I wrote some laws on my own in #31913 that aren't specifically from any codebase or fork. If they eventually get added, will I be credited for them? I'm a little disappointed that my PR was immediately closed because I spent more than six hours writing and rewriting all of the YAML and text descriptions, and a good chunk of that time was coming up with the original lawsets.

Psychpsyo commented 2 months ago

I get the point here, but judging from the one PR, the AI is currently not affected by ion storms, making some of these a borg-only change. (and technically admemes) Are ion-stormed borgs also slated for re-evaluation or why were those frozen?

(yes, this is a thinly veiled "reopen asimoth pls cause it doesn't mention or affect the AI in any way")

slarticodefast commented 2 months ago

Question - I wrote some laws on my own in https://github.com/space-wizards/space-station-14/pull/31913 that aren't specifically from any codebase or fork. If they eventually get added, will I be credited for them? I'm a little disappointed that my PR was immediately closed because I spent more than six hours writing and rewriting all of the YAML and text descriptions, and a good chunk of that time was coming up with the original lawsets.

Yes, we will make sure all attributions are properly credited when they get included. The main reason for compiling them into one PR is so we can coordinate the discussion with the admins better.

I get the point here, but judging from the one PR, the AI is currently not affected by ion storms, making some of these a borg-only change. (and technically admemes) Are ion-stormed borgs also slated for re-evaluation or why were those frozen?

Not yet, but that will likely be the case in the future, either as an ion storm or as a malfunctioning AI gamemode. However, even adding laws to borgs is relevant to future AI design, that we haven't decided on yet and we want to avoid having to remove them again later. An example for this would be a potential 0th law ordering borgs to follow the AI's orders or the AI being able to control borgs. We also will have to think about how laws are to be interpreted as a whole concerning server rules. Are they more roleplay guidelines, or part of your job description and when is violating them a reason for a ban? Some lawsets are also designed to be independent of the law priority we currently have as a part of our silicon rules, while others are not.

this is a thinly veiled "reopen asimoth pls

We got quite a influx of similar PRs and without the freeze there will likely be many more. Each one of these has gotten an separate internal discussion thread with over 20 maintainers and admins leaving hundreds of comments. The consensus was that we need to agree on a general direction for AI first, which will allow us to make easier decisions about smaller additions like lawsets.

t0wnshark commented 2 months ago

Yes, we will make sure all attributions are properly credited when they get included. The main reason for compiling them into one PR is so we can coordinate the discussion with the admins better.

Great! Just wanted to make sure that my hard work wasn't going to go to a COMPLETE waste.

Everturning commented 2 months ago

iirc in 13 theres a delay between the start of the round and receiving (downloading) your laws. when this happened you had a chance to get the ion law sets like nutsimov and such. I don't know how to properly describe it but I'd like to see that here

HarrisonGreenlee commented 2 months ago

This might seem a bit odd, but it would be really interesting to make the Lawyer responsible for drafting freeform AI laws, and maybe even managing the AI laws in general. From a logical perspective it would absolutely make sense that Centcom would want to entrust this responsibility to somebody who has experience drafting robust contracts, and this sort of thing is already (somewhat) happening in the real world as well. They are also well equipped to determine if the AI performed an action that is inconsistent with its lawset as written.

From a gameplay perspective, this would also make sense as the lawyer role tends to have too much free time when security doesn't feel like interacting with space law. It could be really cool to give Laywer players the option to interact with the station in a meaningful way during particularly boring rounds instead of just waiting around at the brig.

It also gives lawyers a tiny bit of leverage over security which can be useful to make security actually care about space law without having to go to annoy the heads of the station every time. And of course, if they abuse the freeform law system they will quickly be demoted, imprisoned, or sued for causing damage to the station and its crew.

If this seems interesting I can look into creating a design doc for it, just let me know.

Psychpsyo commented 2 months ago

It also gives lawyers a tiny bit of leverage over security which can be useful to make security actually care about space law without having to go to annoy the heads of the station every time. And of course, if they abuse the freeform law system they will quickly be demoted, imprisoned, or sued for causing damage to the station and its crew.

"If you're not letting me prosecute, I'll make the AI put you into jail!"