Ask for service road surface

[Atrate]

The purpose of this issue is to:

• Express my opinion on the surface quest,
• Ask other contributors whether they would like for the surface quest to also include service roads.

I would personally find it nice if the surface quest also included service roads, since it already does include even smaller highway types like track.

[westnordost]

The reason why the service road is excluded is because as a road of lowest priority (generally, but for routers anyway), it will usually only appear in a navigation route at the very start or very end. This is why the surface of a service road is almost irrelevant. In any case, the information value is really low and since in some places, every single private driveway is mapped (but sometimes missing access=private), it generates a lot of spam and possibly brings the surveyor into awkward or dangerous situations when the app incites them to linger on private property.

[matkoniecz]

The only case where surface for service roads is likely to be useful is for service roads with cycling or walking or hiking route. In all this cases you are likely to be interested what kind of surface is there and it indicated that this service road is not just dead-end property access.

But adding this clause to query would increase query run time, for an insignificant benefit.

[natrius]

Actually thinking about my neighbourhood i think westnordost is correct here, it would be too spammy if someone else would get there and would try to tag something. If i really want to tag this, i can still do it cia JOSM or on the smartphone with vespucci.

[andrewharvey]

How about just excluding service=driveway but including all other highway=service ways. Around me, these are mostly public roads just smaller lane ways or alley ways, which are frequently used by cyclists to avoid traffic.

[Helium314]

Maybe exclude service=parking_aisle too?

[HolgerJeromin]

openstreetmap-carto has WHEN service IN ('parking_aisle', 'drive-through', 'driveway') THEN 'INT-minor'::text And there is discussion about adding service=emergency_access to the list.

The other high count values are railway based: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/service#values

[westnordost]

Many driveways are not tagged as such

Am 22. April 2021 11:08:30 MESZ schrieb Holger Jeromin @.***>:

openstreetmap-carto has

WHEN service IN ('parking_aisle', 'drive-through', 'driveway') THEN 'INT-minor'::text And there is discussion about adding service=emergency_access to the list.

The other high count values are railway based: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/service#values

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[TurnrDev]

Many driveways are not tagged as such

Perhaps we can get a "What type of service road is this?" quest

[HolgerJeromin]

Perhaps we can get a "What type of service road is this?" quest

Thats not possible, because there is no valid answer tag for "no parking aisle, driveway"

[HolgerJeromin]

Many driveways are not tagged as such

Than retagging could be done in the "others" menu.

[westnordost]

Would be weird - "I can't say the surface because it is a driveway"? What.

[mnalis]

I don't see the big problem in marking surface of the driveway. Only issue I can see is that the quest might possibly be asked many times in areas which have a lot highway=service with are not fully marked with service=* tag (like one would encounter a lot of "roof type" quests, if they are in area with a lot of buildings without mapped roof type).

If bigger number of quests is the issue (and we want to avoid adding such level of detail for relatively unimportant ways) perhaps the query could be made in such a way that it ignores short ways tagged with highway=service which are not connected on one side to anything. That would ignore driveways and similar unimportant ways, while still allowing asking surface of service roads (and their segments), where surface type is very useful (especially for cyclists).

[smichel17]

• Marking the surface of a driveway is likely to be very spammy — the vast majority of driveways in my area are going to be asphalt.
• Driveways are usually quite short, so it doesn't matter as much what surface they are.
• There is almost never an alternate route — if you're going to someone's house, you'll probably drive on their driveway, whether it's asphalt, gravel, or dirt.

I think it would be useful to ask for driveways that are longer than a certain amount (maybe 50 meters?). These driveways also have a larger variety of surfaces (in my area). If I am riding my bike to someone's house, which has a half a kilometer of gravel driveway, I may leave my house a bit earlier so I can walk my bike on this section and still get there on time.