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streetcomplete / StreetComplete

Easy to use OpenStreetMap editor for Android
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Ask for bicycle_parking=* #330

Closed matkoniecz closed 6 years ago

matkoniecz commented 7 years ago

My current idea is

What is the bicycle parking type?

These answers cover more than 95% of bicycle parking types https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/bicycle_parking#values

westnordost commented 7 years ago

Picture is always better than text

matkoniecz commented 7 years ago

I am not convinced in that case. bicycle_parking=stand may be extremely varied and something that looks very similar to bicycle_parking=stand may be bicycle_parking_wall_loops.

At least text+image is required here.

westnordost commented 7 years ago

I think image+word (stand, wheelbenders, shed, individual lockers) is enough. As stand and wheelbender are the only standard stands you plan to implement, it is not difficult to distinguish them from the photo - simply from the size. Keep in mind that in Android, you can show different images for different countries if they really vary so much. But really, the basic shape is the same: an upside down U or |_| for stands, small tilted c for wheelbenders. Sheds and individual lockers are already clear from the name, the photo is not so important for these. It is not necessary to explain to the user the concept of a locker. To stress the fact that sheds are in fact lockable and not just "open sheds" that only protect the cycles from rain, a different word could be used. I.e. "private shed" or "lockable shed".

rugk commented 7 years ago

From your descriptions I can sometimes hardly imagine what you mean… So I seriously need images here. Apart from that, good quest. :+1:

Binnette commented 7 years ago

Here is a mockup :innocent: racks

I miss a "free" image for the "simple anchor". Can someone find or take a picture of these kind of parling ? I do not thing I ever seen something like that in real...

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:bicycle_parking

Pictures I use :

Todo :

westnordost commented 7 years ago

Thanks for searching for fitting pictures! The picture looks like as if you already implemented it(?).

Hmm, the shed is wrong, these are covered stands (or racks, don't really know the difference).

The stands and wall loops pictures are good, the bollard and rack look too specific. What about the pics in the OSM wiki?

Todo

Please only search for pictures / include the following tags:

matkoniecz commented 7 years ago

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bike_racks,_Union_Station_light_rail.jpg

I was also looking for pictures and I am not fan of this one - it depicts badly made bicycle parking - stands are hold only by screws attached to small paving stones.

leave out rack and bollard. The distinction to stands won't be clear to the user (and not even to me) and also the distinction adds very little value

rack is also completely unclear for me, bollard is distinguished by being a single pole, rather than inverted U like a typical stand (though difference is minor).

westnordost commented 7 years ago

rack is also completely unclear for me, bollard is distinguished by being a single pole, rather than inverted U like a typical stand (though difference is minor).

For me the reason to not have bollard - while being clearly distinguishable - is that it is in effect the same as a stand: you can attach a bicycle on either side and it is usually as secure as a stand.

Binnette commented 7 years ago

@westnordost : What about the pics in the OSM wiki?

Because those pics do not have licence. If thoses pics are better may be we can ask permission to owners, but I fear that it gonna take a lot of time... :cry:

New mockup : racks2

westnordost commented 7 years ago

Nice, the building and lockers are quite representative I think. The shed - there is too much detail for such a small image I'd say. These probably only exist in Hamburg, right?

rugk commented 7 years ago

These probably only exist in Hamburg, right?

Hmm, would these be buildings or sheds?

westnordost commented 7 years ago

Shed

On 29 June 2017 15:06:58 CEST, rugk notifications@github.com wrote:

These probably only exist in Hamburg, right?

Hmm, would these be buildings or sheds?

-- You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub: https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/330#issuecomment-311960428

-- Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android-Mobiltelefon mit K-9 Mail gesendet.

Binnette commented 7 years ago

New mockup version. With better shed and more light for building. racks2

Please, can someone help me find an "anchor". I tried many words in https://search.creativecommons.org/ Bur I can't find one. :cry:

Shed : https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Parking_v%C3%A9los_s%C3%A9curis%C3%A9_gare_des_Martres_2015-08-20.JPG

CalliOSM commented 7 years ago

will take a picture of an anchor this evening

matkoniecz commented 7 years ago

Maybe it would be better to use "wheel benders" name rather than "wall loops"?

rugk commented 7 years ago

Maybe it would be better to use "wheel benders" name rather than "wall loops"?

Indeed, it seems to be the corrct term. (nice article, BTW)

Binnette commented 7 years ago

I will keep "wall loops" because the OSM value is "wall_loops". But it will be possible to translate "wall loops" to "Wheel benders" via POEditor. In the wiki, value "wheel benders" does not exist. See : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:bicycle_parking

matkoniecz commented 7 years ago

Wiki has "Often scathingly referred to as "wheelbenders" by cyclists." (wheelbenders, wheel benders, wheel-benders forms are all popular, one with space has less problems with fitting into narrow space).

CalliOSM commented 7 years ago

Here are two Pictures of the anchor I know.

img_0549 img_0546

rugk commented 7 years ago

Eh, oh, this is really something for bikes? Rather looks like something in an ancient castle or so… :smile:

westnordost commented 7 years ago

I have the suspicion that "anchors" being amont the top values for bicycle_parking is based on a misunderstanding. Anyone care to crosscheck some of these taggings with StreetView?

rugk commented 7 years ago

Hmm, I think this and this are clearly wrong. (map)

This (on the right side) (map) too…

Generally they seem to be extremely rare (and possibly mapped wrongly).

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

I was unhappy with available images for bicycle_parking=stand so I made https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bicycle_parking_stand_2.jpg and https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bicycle_parking_stand_1.jpg

Still not ideal, but better than what I found.

rugk commented 6 years ago

Yeah, they look good. I'd choose the first one if I need to guess.

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

@Binnette What is the source of building image in https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/330#issuecomment-311786772 ?

I am preparing to (finally) implement it.

To summarize, based on https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/330#issuecomment-311511732 and https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/330#issuecomment-312370685 we need images for

westnordost commented 6 years ago

These are all good photos! Though, I find the picture for stands originally posted by @Binnette slightly better, because in yours, the asphalt has so much contrast that it almost springs into the foreground. I am also not too happy with the building-picture - it looks like a bicycle shop or something. Perhaps crop it so that only the bicycles (without those flyers and the man) are visible.

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

I will try to make a better picture (I dislike original stands picture as stands are incorrectly attached to surface - just by using screws, making them nearly completely useless for protection against thieves).

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

It turns out that building image is really small - but hopefully it will be big enough. In the worst case I will try to find alternative image of this object.

selection_007

rugk commented 6 years ago

I dislike original stands picture as stands are incorrectly attached to surface - just by using screws, making them nearly completely useless for protection against thieves

I really doubt that matters for StreetComplete. In such a small size as it is used, it does not even may be visible.

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

Potential alternative building photo: https://www.flickr.com/photos/climens/2215047236/in/photolist-4nJGnA-7rp11r-7rp15z-ptDFvt-ohH8TC-Q1ag4W-21nKZEQ-nGdRbb-4v5Lty-6QZmtX-5TV2d2-ntN5XN-qPitym-38G34D-QoN3VH-6voCBy-pwKKFt-5nNyZL-7JKM4A-5dCC8n-ubxLA-9kz9gq-F5EkSN-amjkwA-JZxsWq-r2xDAt-oN4zNe-qM5TtY-ahR5Bv-ewLWN-hjr95X-nHjnSf-8dg5XL-6EmLoq-nZqkCV-nYVZpJ-7j4AeA-nGszvh-nFXPWg-nXnUks-6fBwbY-nGeyjT-64AoMP-e9Nk7S-nZjGKf-o2A8nD-nGx73k-nGVWJo-732PBt-8fcohf

westnordost commented 6 years ago

Indeed!

On 27 February 2018 09:38:37 CET, Mateusz Konieczny notifications@github.com wrote:

Potential alternative building photo: https://www.flickr.com/photos/climens/2215047236/in/photolist-4nJGnA-7rp11r-7rp15z-ptDFvt-ohH8TC-Q1ag4W-21nKZEQ-nGdRbb-4v5Lty-6QZmtX-5TV2d2-ntN5XN-qPitym-38G34D-QoN3VH-6voCBy-pwKKFt-5nNyZL-7JKM4A-5dCC8n-ubxLA-9kz9gq-F5EkSN-amjkwA-JZxsWq-r2xDAt-oN4zNe-qM5TtY-ahR5Bv-ewLWN-hjr95X-nHjnSf-8dg5XL-6EmLoq-nZqkCV-nYVZpJ-7j4AeA-nGszvh-nFXPWg-nXnUks-6fBwbY-nGeyjT-64AoMP-e9Nk7S-nZjGKf-o2A8nD-nGx73k-nGVWJo-732PBt-8fcohf

-- You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub: https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/330#issuecomment-368787762

-- Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android-Mobiltelefon mit K-9 Mail gesendet.

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

The flickr one has problem with lines crossing image, Macdonald one is not obvious that it is inside building.

I found https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Victoria_Park_TTC_bike_storage.JPG https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:BikesZurich_ST_08.jpg and https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bike_Storage_(YAUS).jpg that are potentially better.

matkoniecz commented 6 years ago

Next part of bikeshedding: current locker image has not enough space at bottom to for crop that leaves space for text.

alternatives that I found

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bicycle_lockers_at_Gathurst_railway_station.JPG