show the next "rank"

[fredao]

Use case

For motivation, it would be nice to see how many "points" the next higher rank has.

Proposed Solution

Maybe something like this https://qu.ax/KVxj.jpeg

Next level Next rank ... or whatever

More or less like the leaderboard in MapRoulette

[mnalis]

Related FAQ entry: "I like gamification factor of StreetComplete, and have an idea how to increase it even more" and https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/issues/3706.

While your suggested picture does not look that problematic as some others are (like MapRoulette one!), it is still a concern.

Also note that while it can be motivating if there is just a little but for next score like in your example ("I'm at 931, and next step is close at 976, I should push some more!"), it might be very demotivating too (e.g. "I'm at 931, and next step is at 18376, it's absolutely hopeless, I'm giving up").

Perhaps it might only be shown if one is getting close enough to the next step, e.g. a toast "It seems you are very close to climbing up the next level, keep it up!" when you enter the profile and there is <100 points difference?

But it might still be too much gamification, as it might incentivize mapper to do sub-par mapping (more like guessing) quickly (as explained in the FAQ) in order to get that dopamine rush of climbing to the next level.

[fredao]

I am well aware of the problem with gamification.

The leaderboard of MapRoulette was only an example, as I did not know whether my request was understood. The example should not be realised under any circumstances.

If so, then there should only be a small hint as indicated in the picture. https://qu.ax/KVxj.jpeg

The idea came from my granddaughter because she wanted to know how far away the next step is.

[mnalis]

(added suggested https://qu.ax/KVxj.jpeg picture inline)

[fredao]

@mnalis if you think a small number is to much gamification, one should rethink My Profile - by type, by country and all the awards ;-)

[mnalis]

@mnalis if you think a small number is to much gamification,

I'm actually undecided about this specific suggestion, that's why I wanted to hear opinions of others... (It's not up to me to decide whether something like it would be accepted or not anyway :smiley:)

one should rethink My Profile - by type, by country and all the awards

those are probably not problematic because... (click to expand)

I see no problem about `by type` / `by country` as they simply show classification statistics of your own quests. If you solve double the number of quests in same manner as you did before, those stats would look exactly the same, so they IMHO do not incentivize careless mapping to increase quantity. As for the `awards`, they **do** incentivize solving more quests, but **_weakly_** (i.e. it is much bigger dopamine hit when you get your first award, then when your award level increases from 42 to 43), and it gets exponentially harder to get new ones (i.e. you must do much more work to get much smaller dopamine hit, which gets old quickly). What is the **biggest gamification problem** IMHO is when there is **competition between different humans**, as there is strong sociological tendency among humans that most want to become alpha, which can easily make that "want" (especially to people who are not otherwise hard-core mappers, which happens to be many SC users) overriding other concerns (like caring that map data is _actually 100% correct_ instead of _"**probably** it's the same surface of that road segment as it is here, so I'll just answer that without wasting time on verifying"_) So yeah, biggest gamification-relation problem currently in SC is `rank in country` / `global rank`. Those are definitely **not hugely worrisome**, but _not completely benign_ either.

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This proposal specifically (if implemented) might turn gamification concern up quite a notch, as it is also in (most troublesome) competing-with-other-humans category, and it gives more incentive to "cheat" (as you can see how close you are to getting to getting new dopamine hit, which current global/country rank don't). On the plus side, this proposal does not show any names, which would be sure way to cause problems.

On negative feedback side (as mentioned before) there is also possible issue that (if it is always shown!) it can be quite demotivating too if one sees there is huge amount of work needed to advance to next level (see https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/issues/3230#issuecomment-908682445 for example workaround of similar problem)

[retiolus]

To add my little grain of sand to this debate, and I agree with everything that has been said by @mnalis I also think that in some cases it can be demotivating to make editions for a long time and not see our ranking increase (which is sincerely never the case).

And in reality, even at a high ranking (I'm talking in my case where I'm at #675 world level), even doing 50 editions, I still go up several points in the ranking at once. So I think that the "it can be demotivating to see that you are very far from the next ranking" only applies to a minority of people who are very high in this ranking.

[YoshiRulz]

How about showing progress for achievements, maybe only when you're close?

[matkoniecz]

if you think a small number is to much gamification, one should rethink My Profile - by type, by country and all the awards ;-)

the question is about balance - some gamification is nice but some is more risky. I feel that "just X edits left to increase rank" is of a more risky variety

Also, some new things got added (nicer styling of stats menu, mappy days display, weekly rankings) so I would wait to see how this works before further tweaks

[mnalis]

[...] even doing 50 editions, I still go up several points in the ranking at once. So I think that the "it can be demotivating to see that you are very far from the next ranking" only applies to a minority of people who are very high in this ranking.

This is true, it gets slower only when you get in top-few-hunderds or so, but then those top users are not really your main targets audience as you note, and there is by a definition a small number of top-performers anyway...

However to address second part of the equation: while just 50 quests is not a problem to someone in urban city centre (like me and I guess you too) who could solve that in one easy afternoon walk, it might be quite more time-consuming if someone lives/commutes in more rural areas (even with resurvey preference set to ask more often) where quests are much much rarer.

But I agree with @matkoniecz, let's see how much extra life v49.0-beta1 changes to award screens bring us first!