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Disable traffic signal vibration quest in Bulgaria #5846

Closed Dimitar5555 closed 2 weeks ago

Dimitar5555 commented 2 weeks ago

In Bulgaria, ~12% of the pedestrian crossings are tagged with traffic_signals:vibration=yes (92/747). Of those 92, 91 also have traffic_signals:sound=yes. There are 0 (or close to 0, see *) traffic signals with any vibrating things. The confusion likely comes from the sound effect which may sound like a vibration to some people.

The older type of traffic signals sound like a chirping bird and it shouldn't be confused for vibration (see https://youtu.be/2aUtqR_Uim0?si=RovODKEZCNeEIaZK&t=1180 which is node/6111662646).

The newer models create louder and more annoying sound but it's definitely not vibration (https://youtu.be/2aUtqR_Uim0?si=50gVBJQmEYwMo5si&t=930, node/1117150647).

Looking at some examples in Sofia (https://overpass-turbo.eu/?w=%22traffic_signals%3Avibration%22%3D%22yes%22+in+Bulgaria&R), the ones near УНСС, метростанция Константин Величков and the ones in the center (Съдебна палата, Св. Неделя, пл. Възраждане, пл. Македония, Дондуков и Раковска, по Васил Левски и по Патриарха) all have sound but no vibration. Most of them (if not all) use the older sound maker.

Looking at the Bulgarian law, nothing refers to vibrations/vibration devices.

Related article in Bulgarian law ORDINANCE NO 17 OF 23 JULY 2001 ON THE REGULATION OF TRAFFIC BY TRAFFIC LIGHTS Art. 30. (1) (Former text of Art. 30, amend. - (30, SG 35/2015, in force from 18.05.2015) To facilitate blind pedestrians, **the green light signal shall be accompanied by an audible signal**. (2) (new - SG 35/15, in force from 18.05.2015) **The frequency of the sound referred to in par. 1 shall be** 800 - 2000 Nz, and **when the sound signal has pulsations, they shall have a frequency** of up to 4 Nz ± 0,2 Nz, and the ratio of the durations of the sound and the pause shall be greater than 1. The loudness referred to in par. 1 shall not be more than 5 dB(A) above the background noise level at the regulated location. (3) (new - SG 35/2015, in force from 18.05.2015) The sound signal referred to in par. 1 shall have different pulsation frequencies for green signals at different fundamental beats. (beats refers to the signal phases) (4) (new - SG 35/15, in force from 18.05.2015) The sound signal referred to in par. 1 shall be directed along the footpath for which it is intended and shall end simultaneously with the end of the green pedestrian signal. (5) (new - SG 35/2015, in force from 18.05.2015) In case the sound signal referred to in par. (1) is requested by the blind by means of a special button referred to in Article 50a(2), the sound to orient the blind to the location of this button shall be at a frequency at least three times lower than that of the sound referred to in par. 1. The loudness of the orientation sound shall be such that it is perceptible at a distance of up to 5 m from the button. Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

*Potentially there is one exception (node/6319690382) because it's near the "Union of the deaf people" and it has a non standard button.

cc: @rhhsm

rhhsm commented 2 weeks ago

For the Finnish case #5791, they also looked at guides for blind people. Did you search for such guides in Bulgarian?

Saschl commented 2 weeks ago

Why? Will we install some malware doing this?

Yes, do not click on it. My account got compromised and posted this.

matkoniecz commented 2 weeks ago

I have redacted suspicious link.

Dimitar5555 commented 2 weeks ago

For the Finnish case #5791, they also looked at guides for blind people. Did you search for such guides in Bulgarian?

There is a broshure on how to be helpful to blind people (http://ssb-bg.net/viewactivity-142.html), which is not exactly what we are looking for. There is also a book "Ориентиране и мобилност" from 2003, but I assume that there weren't any sound devices then. AFAIK the first ones appeared with the introduction of "smart" traffic lights around 2012-2015.

matkoniecz commented 2 weeks ago

@Dimitar5555 listing seems quite convincing, I would disable this quest based on this info - even without checking guides for blind people