Who cares?

[nilshoerrmann]

I'll play devils advocate. @jensscherbl [asks on Twitter]():

What's going on? No one using Symphony anymore? Is it dying?

I say, yes, it will die, if no one takes leadership. Is there anyone willing to really lead this project actively? With knowledge, vision and enthusiasm? Or is it dead already?

[jurajkapsz]

NB Generaly: I am capable of IA, but I am busy the following quater.

[nitriques]

@allen Great. I am available every day of the week, from 10:00 to 17:00 EST. I generally check twitter, github and my mails on week-ends too.

[ijy]

I'd love to help out and can put myself forward for the IA group if there is more of a need to balance things there. Sounds like there may be some momentum building. What are the current plans? Feel free to PM me.

[patrickyan]

I just wanted to chime in to comment. I have been using Symphony since back when it first came out as a paid software... I agree with everyone who said that Symphony's main audience is designers. For me, Symphony is the best way to create a completely custom web solution without having to hire a developer. I get complete control over the data structures (sections) and how data is transformed (data sources + XSLT) without customizing the system.

I do think that separating the interface layer and the API layer is a great move. There's not way to customize the admin right now aside from extensions, and that seems very complicated. Treating the interface just like any frontend would be awesome.

Throughout the years, Symphony has been through this up and down cycle of cool!, then dying, then new cool thing, then dying once again. I am looking forward to this project and what's to come!

[allen]

Great to hear guys. Although the fact that there's an overabundance of engineers to designers speak to why discussions skew towards engineering problems and solutions.

Even though SA is critical to any self respecting CMS, without IA heading up requirements, the SA group really don't have enough to make any informed decisions.

So I am clear, the following contributors are joining the new Symphony Working Group:

Information Architects

• @ijy
• @jonmifsud

System Architects

• @nitriques
• @iwyg

We also have @jurajkapsz, who may or may not be able to contribute depending on timing and availability. In addition I will check in with @brendo and @rowan-lewis for their availability. I will also check in with @padwanRO and see what support they're able to provide.

Am I missing anyone else?

[iwyg]

Thanks @allen for the summary. Maybe we can convince @nils-werner or @creativedutchmen to join the SA group?

[nilshoerrmann]

Depending on my time, I can help with the design.

[nitriques]

This is really great news. Do not hesitate to tweet me.

[iwyg]

Can we move this discussion somewhere else?

[ijy]

Awesome. Once we've got confirmation on the numbers we can start planning it out.

[nitriques]

@iwyg IRC ? :P

[iwyg]

Yea, we definitely should setup an IRC once we start off developing but I actually meant more, moving the discussion to another, not already closed Issue.

[nitriques]

aa! ok!

[iwyg]

I fear we have to limit our team to 5 people: https://www.hipchat.com/pricing

[nitriques]

that's sad. But it should be enough.

[iwyg]

Harrrr… :)

[jurajkapsz]

We also have @jurajkapsz, ...

right

[creativedutchmen]

The coming year will be both laid back and very busy, but it'd love to help with the design (time allowing). ​ Or am I too late to the party?

On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 11:44 AM, Juraj Kapsz notifications@github.com wrote:

We also have @jurajkapsz, ...

right

Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub: https://github.com/symphonycms/symphony-next/issues/14#issuecomment-21679902

[allen]

Nope, not too late. I'll have time in the next couple days to get the group set up.

[bauhouse]

I'd love to be involved in IA, but I don't want to dilute my efforts on documentation. If the concerns dovetail in a good way, then, yes, I'd like to be a part of the design process.

[nitriques]

I really think having someone specifically for documenting the whole thing is very important. Thanks BTW @bauhouse on that.

[iwyg]

Yes, documentation is essential for a project's success, but this can be a highly automated process.

Think of development in modules/components. Each module has its own Documentation aka README, which describes the public API and it's intended behaviour (think of a github README.md). The documentation must be provided by the dev team/author for each module.

Then, there's the APO documentation (something like this), which would be automatically generated on each deployment (apigen, phpdoc, etc).

As the public documentation is contained in every module, everyone can contribute and improve the documentation as it's in the repository already.

Ok, both documentation types need to be reviewed and lectured, but generation and deployment can be automated (think of jekyll or simmilar solutions).

So, the essential thing is continious integration on both, code and documentation.

My two cents.

[allen]

@jensscherbl I didn't check with you, are you interested in joining the new WG?

[allen]

@nitriques I don't have your email address. An email of the new WG has been sent to all contributors. I'll DM you on twitter.

[iwyg]

Thanks for the heads up :)

[jensscherbl]

@allen

Currently not, sorry (can't really commit to it due to client work). Maybe at a later point. But I would still like to follow the development and test early releases for client projects and extension development and provide feedback.

I guess it's important to also have that kind of an outsider's perspective, since the current codebase and documentation is Symphony's weakest point at the moment regarding new developers and extension development.

[allen]

@jensscherbl no worries, and thanks!

[nitriques]

@allen I can't PM you back on twitter since you do not follow me :( BTW, I am on IRC each day of the week: freenode/#symphonycms

@iwyg You are right about dev doc. But user doc can't be generated.

@jensscherbl Yes, outside feedback will be much needed. Thanks.

[iwyg]

@nitriques well, It would be supplied by the developer. The "parsing and making a website out of it" part could be automated.

[nitriques]

Yes exactly. I am more than willing to document what I code. But I mean, doing user docs like those pages http://www.getsymphony.com/learn/beginners/

[ijy]

Isn't the IRC channel #symphony?

[nitriques]

Ahhh ! Thanks @ijy I did not knew that!

[iwyg]

@nitriques alright, got you :)

[jensscherbl]

The information architecture group must come up with requirements

Sorry to once again beat the dead horse, but I think this already was a very good starting point. You guys should pick up from there.

[nitriques]

I hate discussion on the forum since it does not notify me when the thread is updated. But i'll read the post for sure.

[iwyg]

wait, is it dead already? aww, c'mon!

[allen]

Haha.

And ouch.

I loved S3 for what it was.

Ah, S1. You're my high school sweetheart. Charming with lots of potential, but ultimately it was immature. Oh, S2. You're like my first serious long term girlfriend. Perfect for me. In fact, we're still dating! Sigh, S3. You're like my first secret love affair. Tragically, you died before our relationship blossomed.

I'm just glad S2 took me back.