Win10 update broke the scrollbars in Bioedit

[hoytpr]

Hi, I've been using Bioedit for 20 years and never really had a problem with it (once you helped me TON by adding the "Send output to a file" checkbox on the 6-frame translation function) but now the scroll bars have stopped working (and have odd video issues). This happened recently during a Win10 update but sadly I'm not sure which update. Others are experiencing the same issue. If I knew enough to try and fix it myself I would. Note that I've already tried uninstalling/reinstalling, changing video settings like scaling to all options, and even running in 640X420 mode. The "Graphic View" has the same issues with the scroll bars. An image of Bioedit running with scrollbar behavior failing includes sequences showing up in the scrollbars as can be seen in the attached image. NOTE: mouse scrolling (up-down) works, as do the arrow keys (left-right) but we are working with bigger files these days.

I know this is old stuff for you but thanks for any help you can provide.

Pete

[thalljiscience]

@hoytpr - Did you try downloading the current version from thalljiscience.github.io? The picture looks like an older version, based upon the 'World Wide Web' menu still being present (I took that out because it is becoming too inconvenient to keep it up to date with the ancient code base - I did, however, update the direct sequence download from Genbank functions as well as the 'Go to Pubmed references' function to work with updated Windows 10 security that knocked my past connectivity methods out - I had to resort to a thin https client written in Visual Studio). Recent versions have been compiled in Windows 10, but the old microbiology server that housed BioEdit at NCSU went away, and for a while before that was repeatedly reimaged (after server problems or getting hacked, I guess) with an image containing an old version of BioEdit that was compiled under Windows 7 (or before).

[hoytpr]

Thanks @thalljiscience for the rapid reply. I did download the latest version just now (BioEdit.zip dated May 11 2021) and it did not fix the problem, although I haven't tried any of the other video corrections. But it's pretty much exactly the same (image attached). I don't get any notices of Windows trying to block anything.

Let me know if there's anything I can do to help!

[hoytpr]

Actually just noticed the mouse scrolling seems to not work correctly now. It scrolls left-right intermittently. Maybe it's a setting. Also the side scroll bar appears to be simply gone.

EDIT: Don't know if it makes a difference but running as Administrator is used the side scrollbar seems to have reappeared, and mouse scrolling is okay.

[hoytpr]

Updated image Run as Administrator:

[thalljiscience]

@hoytpr - That's odd. What kind of computer and monitor are you running? I just downloaded and tested on a 4K screen laptop (HP Omen) and I'm running normally on a HP Omen laptop with a standard UDF screen. Both system have the latest Win10 updates, as far as I know. I'll check Windows updates and see if there is an update my computer hasn't done yet. I've also recently tested it on a Dell laptop and a couple of LG Gram laptops. I have an older HP desktop at home running a server in Win10 that I could test on to see if I can replicate it, but it's hard to trouble-shoot something I cannot replicate. It may be possible to create a VM that replicates the issue to try to debug, but not without something to go on. Maybe a screenshot of your display settings? I got an email yesterday from someone at the CDC having a similar issue, but for them the scrollbars disappear when the window is maximized, but not necessarily when not maximized. How long ago did the problem appear and do you happen to know which update broke it? (I would not normally know the name of an update, but just in case).

[thalljiscience]

@hoytpr - Are you by chance running the latest version 21H1 update? I just looked and I have not yet installed that particular update. If that is what you are running, I think I will take my backup computer (an LG Gram that is not my main working system at this point) and install the 21H1 update and see if that replicates the issue.

[hoytpr]

I'm checking: On 03/23 I got KB4589211: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 1903 and 1909, and Windows Server, version 1903 and 1909 Windows Server, version 1903, all editions More...

For Intel Microcode updates for other Windows 10 versions, see the following articles: KB4589198: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 1507 KB4589210: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 1607 and Windows Server 2016 KB4589206: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 1803 KB4589208: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 1809 and Windows Server 2019 KB4589212: Intel microcode updates for Windows 10, version 2004 and 20H2, and Windows Server, version 2004 and 20H2

On 04/15/2021 I got

On 05/05 I got:

[thalljiscience]

@hoytpr - Hmm ... I have that update too, installed 4/21, as well as the next one, KB5003173, on 5/12. It doesn't sound like you are on 21H1.

[hoytpr]

As for your other questions my monitor is a Dell E2314H1 (1920 X 1080). My second monitor (extended desktop) is another Dell, but an older one running at 1280 X 1024. Using an NVIDIA GeForce GT 730 using an NVIDIA driver from 09/03/2020. This older video card could be a problem but it's not showing any problems in the event manager. I build my own systems, this one is getting old though, it's Gigabyte motherboard 870A-UD3 R. 3.1, running an AMD Phenom (6-core) processor with 12Gb RAM.

In full screen (the software opens in essential a full screen (this is normal setting right?) and the scrollbars aren't always visible on my primary monitor because the Windows menubar at the bottom is thick (lots of quick-start items). But I don't have any trouble resizing the windows or going from true full-screen to not full screen. The scrollbars are messed up all the time although what shows up in the scroll bars varies. Sometimes they are invisible, sometimes they have black in them, sometimes they look like they have sequence data in them.

I do have to admit that this problem was around the time I installed this video card however. Maybe Microsoft has a generic version I can use.

[thalljiscience]

My current laptop has an NVIDIA RTX-2080, and it did have some issues under Windows 10 for a little while that appear all resolved, but I don't recall having application-dependent issues. Is BioEdit the only program showing GUI anomalies? I guess it looks like that motherboard does not have an integrated GPU, otherwise you could test just temporarily disabling the NVIDIA. You don't have your old GPU still lying around to do a test with, do you? Obviously not a solution to downgrade, but it would point in the direction of the problem if it is GPU-dependent - it would likely point toward GPU driver issues.

[thalljiscience]

The other question I would ask is: Is it a functional problem with the scrollbar's programmatic positioning, or just a GUI display issue? If you click where you know the scrollbar should be, does the alignment window still respond? This might be useful to know for troubleshooting the issue.

[hoytpr]

For your last question: No, the scrollbar does not respond at all even if it is visible, or if I can guess where it is.

Right now this is the only software I can remember having GUI issues. The old GPU is toast unfortunately, but maybe I can scrounge up another card for a quick check.

FYI my computer says it's ready to install Win10 version 20H2 after I install a few security updates unrelated to 21H1. I installed BioEdit on my Samsung ATIV -7 laptop and it works fine.

[thalljiscience]

In case these threads help, other people have reported issues to both Microsoft and NVIDIA concerning the GeForce GT 730 in Windows 10. Perhaps there could be some workaround information following these threads?

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/games_windows_10/nvidia-geforce-gt-730-unable-to-install-in-windows/d7fcd34a-41f4-450b-bc14-e2c8557fd5cc

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/geforce-graphics-cards/5/239184/gt-730-on-windows-10-issues/

[thalljiscience]

I originally had a problem with the NVIDIA RTX cards in Windows 10 that I had to solve by going through HP directly for their Omen line. Some issues may have been addressed by Gigabyte for their motherboard BIOS versions as well:

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/game-ready-drivers/13/105842/gigabyte-motherboards/

[hoytpr]

Hey thanks VERY much for your help with this. I think it's just an old apparently unpopular video card, and because I want to continue using BioEdit, I'm going to purchase a new one. It may be a week or so but I'll let you know how it goes.

[thalljiscience]

OK, but there is still no reason it shouldn't be resolvable. I used to have GeForce video cards and they didn't create an issue. It's probably just a matter of getting the right driver version.

[hoytpr]

Just FYI. I tried every driver for this card I could find and nothing changed. It might be a bad card (it was new in the box, but several years old).

[hoytpr]

@thalljiscience Tom, I just wanted to follow up with you that after a recent Win10 update, the problem seems to have gone away. I wish I could have been more helpful, and I'm sorry that this took some of your time, but whatever it was, is gone now. I've attached my recent Win10 updates in case they are useful. .

Feel free to close this.

[thalljiscience]

@hoytpr: Thanks for letting me know. I'm glad it is working now. You are not the only person to have had this problem. A scientist at the CDC had a similar scrollbar issue. In that case it was a Dell laptop right after a Windows update and updating the drivers through Dell service fixed it that time. I think it probably comes down to backwards compatibility with ancient libraries using outdated Windows GUI resources. Sooner or later it will probably stop working altogether. Maybe before then I can retire, get bored, and write an updated (and cross-platform) version. If that ever happens, I'd like to revamp the structure and i/o and make it scalable and suitable for NGS data anyway.