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[1844] Destination not counted before home station comes down. #10806

Open physic opened 1 month ago

physic commented 1 month ago

https://18xx.games/game/165067?action=701

The VZ on its track lay connected the BLS home base to its destination, but the BLS did not receive its treasury. My guess is that this is because the home station was not yet laid. Based on my reading of the rules, they do not specify that the token must be laid, only that the home base be connected to the destination.

Expected: When the VZ lays the tunnel, the BLS receives its extra 500sfr of capital for reaching its destination.

Observed: The BLS did not receive its destination money.

Rules

Destination Hexes

If a fictitious train with unlimited range can drive from the home base to the destination then the company receives its remaining treasury

The rules do not define home base, but they refer to it numerous times as the location where the company starts, and not the station itself. e.g.: Place A Station Marker

It must place its first station marker at home base when the company operates for the first time. This first station is free.

crericha commented 1 month ago

Base is a bad translation. They mean station. Here is the translated German.

Historical companies and pre-SBB companies have a destination station. Is there a continuous route at any point in the game from the home station to the company's destination station, receives it immediately from the Bank a bonus.

physic commented 1 month ago

@crericha The use of the word Bahnhof in the German rules also appears to imply location and not token. Zielbahnhoefen (Destination stations) do not contain a station token of the company. In some cases, they cannot even be tokened. So the German rules don't make sense either if you assume it means station token.

When the rules refer to station tokens, they say Bahnhofsmarker.

The relevant section from the German Lookout rules: Historische Gesellschaften und Vor-SBB Gesellschaften haben einen Zielbahnhof. Gibt es zu einem beliebigen Zeitpunkt des Spieles eine durchgehende Strecke vom Heimatbahnhof zum Zielbahnhof der Gesellschaft, erhält sie sofort aus der Bank eine Prämie. Bei historischen Gesellschaften beträgt diese das Fünffache des Ausgabekurses, bei Vor-SBB Gesellschaften das Doppelte des Ausgabekurses. Dabei darf die Strecke nicht durch andere Bahnhofsmarker blockiert sein. Diese Bedingung kann jederzeit während des Spiels erfüllt werden, auch während des Spielzugs einer anderen Gesellschaft.

Bold sections: unbroken route from home station to destination station. May not be blocked by other station markers.

crericha commented 1 month ago

The rules also describe having a route, which a corporation can't have until it has a station on the board. There are ambiguities in the language either way I guess; neither interpretation being fully supported. We'd need a ruling from Helmut or Lonny on this one to have clarity.

crericha commented 1 month ago

@ViennaTramways can you please clarify if a historical company can reach its destination before its home token is laid? Thank you!

philcampeau commented 1 month ago

This is Helmut's game, not Lonny's, though I suppose Lonny did co-publish it originally. I can reach out to Helmut on BGG.

philcampeau commented 1 month ago

Looks like physic's interpretation was right here too (first answer below):

Screenshot_20240623_083234_Chrome