ujtcelvn / Ending_Extension_Mod

A fork of Historical Project Mod 0.4.6, a mod for Victoria 2 - Heart of Darkness 3.04
GNU General Public License v3.0
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Oversight?: "Anarchy in the South" can fire while the Red Turban Rebellion is already underway #185

Open Xylephony opened 1 week ago

Xylephony commented 1 week ago

And I assume probably vice-versa. I think this is probably intentional on your part, but I question it. In my game, it was a two-state Taiping which popped out, which was obviously totally useless and was defeated instantly. Both should be allowed to happen at the same time, I feel, but perhaps they should be required to have a certain number of remaining Qing states as cores then, so that the rebellion is no smaller than at least 4 states in size?

ujtcelvn commented 1 week ago

This is intentional. Since both rebellions occurred in real life, I made it so if one rebellion occurs first that one gets all its cores and a miniature version of the 2nd rebellion can occur if the 1st isn't put down yet. In real life, the Red Turbans took only half of Guangzhou and half of Guangxi even though there were secret societies over much of the southern Chinese coast. Therefore, I made a mirror version of the event for a mini-Taiping rebellion that would take a maximum of 3 states. I don't want the mini rebellion to be too large because then it wouldn't represent how the main rebellion has most of the momentum. I also don't want to nerf the Qing too much because they should win most of the time.

On a related note, both rebellions last way too short in game, they usually die within 2 years unless both the Qing and rebel armies die to millions of reactionary rebels, which is extremely silly. The Taiping lasted 14 years in real life! There used to also be a Nian rebellion event but the Nian rebellion was extremely unorganized in real life so I think they should just be treated as the generic anti-Qing rebels that can appear and not scripted. The mini versions of the rebellions that you saw here was added to slightly delay the Qing in their victory.

Xylephony commented 1 week ago

Well, I can't argue with history; if that's how it happened IRL, that's how it should happen ingame. But if you want to make the rebellions last longer (and I agree they should), why not borrow from the ACW and have them release first as puppets for a time? I know that isn't exactly true to how the Taiping started out - it seems like they were very militant from the start, and Qing efforts to suppress them were just as militant - but as things stand their armies are often blown apart at the beginning because they spawn, their troops are embedded into Qing armies and those armies just delete them. If they had a few months' window to pull all their troops back to their borders they would be less likely to lose many of them instantly, and the Qing would have to fight harder to put the rebellion down. Ditto Red Turbans.

The only issue there would be if that buffed the Taiping far enough that the Qing began to regularly lose, but I think spawning them as a puppet could also help the Qing since they would know what troops they were going to lose and could reorganize.