V8: Spec out - limiting editorial access by language

[kjac]

We need to create sub tasks for this feature which is what this task is.

Here's the gist:

Since languages are a first class citizen in V8, wouldn't it make sense to limit the editorial access to language specific content?

Specifically I'm thinking that the users should always be able to see content in all languages, but only edit the languages permitted by their user groups. The config would be something like this:

I have a crude but functional PoC that only allows users to edit the variation properties in the permitted variant languages. I'd be happy to work some more on it, if this is indeed a feature worth working on.

[dawoe]

Hi @kjac

Thanks for raising this issue. I think it would be a good addition personally. We now often have seperate trees for languages and give editors rights to only one tree...so we have editors per language.

I will label this as needing HQ input.

Dave Community Pull Request team

[kjac]

@dawoe exactly!

I think it'd be a killer feature and also possibly a decisive factor when comparing Umbraco with other CMS'es for a new project.

Considering how little change is actually needed to get the PoC up and running, it's definitively worth chasing after in my opinion.

[nul800sebastiaan]

Thanks @kjac - we recognize the need for this as well. Currently this is not on the roadmap while we wait for when people start using the variants feature and we get some more feedback on it. Our permissions model is quite complex already and we're still thinking about the best way to implement this feature.

[kjac]

@nul800sebastiaan cool. Let me know if I can do anything to help.

If we're to fully leverage the power of language variants, I am certain a need for this feature will arise pretty quickly for larger international sites with multiple editors around the globe. I'd really hate to see the lack of this feature as the cause for choosing another CMS over Umbraco.

[MatsStam]

This is most def something that should be added in my opinion. Handling large multilingual sites is impossible without it :/

[sbesteman]

Since languages are a first class citizen in V8, wouldn't it make sense to limit the editorial access to language specific content?

Specifically I'm thinking that the users should always be able to see content in all languages, but only edit the languages permitted by their user groups. The config would be something like this:

I have a crude but functional PoC that only allows users to edit the variation properties in the permitted variant languages. I'd be happy to work some more on it, if this is indeed a feature worth working on.

This is a must have for our project with a lot of language variants. When will it be included? Or has someome build it already and can it be packaged?

[FransdeJong]

Ran in to this issue just now. This is really a must have when working with different editors for different languages.

[rasmusbollerup]

Please make this happen. Missing this feature is a show stopper on current client projects that won't happen without it. To quote Kenn: "If we're to fully leverage the power of language variants, I am certain a need for this feature will arise pretty quickly for larger international sites with multiple editors around the globe. I'd really hate to see the lack of this feature as the cause for choosing another CMS over Umbraco." And this is exactly what's about to happen.

[henrikgm]

I totally agree that this feature is badly needed

[Ladefuss]

Completely agree. Hard to fully utilise languagevariants without it.

[FransdeJong]

@nul800sebastiaan Is there any update from HQ if they are interested in this feature and if it is on a roadmap?

[nul800sebastiaan]

We are interested but it is not on the roadmap, we have yet to think about how to implement it and are currently not able to invest the proper time into it.

Right now, the recommendation is to use the older way of doing multilingual websites by using multiple nodes in the root of your tree (/en, /nl, fr) and giving editors access to their own language trees.

[rasmusbollerup]

@nul800sebastiaan I realize this is not the place for lengthy discussions, but that is very bad news as this will totally undermine the whole argument that Umbraco 8 is now an enterprice level CMS.

The language variant setup on any site is part of the core architecture/configuration and doing it the old way will have the site stuck with that architecture "foreverthereafter". You would really do the community a favor by taking this feature into the roadmap. @kjac already made an excellent UI for the feature:-) eom

[kjac]

@rasmusbollerup if I'm not mistaken you can achieve most of this using the existing extension options for the back office, maybe with one or two caveats.

[nul800sebastiaan]

I do understand the disappointment and I wish I could help. Unfortunately we have limited resources and we're currently have our hands full with all of the other things that are on the roadmap: https://umbraco.com/products/roadmap/

[nul800sebastiaan]

That said, I'll make sure to share the feedback at HQ, in case some of my colleagues have more to add to this feature request. 👍

[arknu]

@nul800sebastiaan Could we at least put this on the roadmap, even if it is under Later? Maybe get an RFC going to iron out the details...

I'll join the chorus saying this is an essential feature for large multilingual sites.

[nul800sebastiaan]

For a bit of background information: In the past we've been very good at over-promising and under-delivering.

Therefore, everything on the roadmap is something we've committed to working on and we have enough detail/insight into how the feature needs to work.

At this moment we don't have a good insight in how we think it could/should work and we can not commit to working on it in the future, this is why this feature is not (yet?) on the roadmap.

As always, we're listening and will incorporate all your feedback on this issue in the final implementation once we can commit to get to it, so anything you can add here is great.

I agree that this probably requires an RFC, but an RFC also requires someone from HQ to be able to guide and complete it, I don't think we have available resources for that at the moment.

[mzajkowski]

Hey there! @Shazwazza - is there anything happening around it maybe? We welcomed a new v8 project and literally just stopped because of the ^^. Curious if it's considered as something possible to worked on "next" or now something totally out of the scope / planning / ideas? Please let me know.

[Shazwazza]

Hey mate, we are working on planning this now - meaning figuring out how exactly this should work, identifying the various 'gotchas', defining MVPs, etc. So we'll be able to provide some implementation details once that's ready

[shearer3000]

hello - we too have this requirement in umbraco 8 projects. Is it possible for the community to vote on having items like this prioritized on the roadmap? thx

[shearer3000]

hi - has there been any progress on this (for 8.7 maybe)? thanks

[picadu]

Hey mate, we are working on planning this now - meaning figuring out how exactly this should work, identifying the various 'gotchas', defining MVPs, etc. So we'll be able to provide some implementation details once that's ready

Any updates here? That's a key feature for multinational websites. thanks

[juliangrahame]

Yep. Defo a must-have for larger corporate sites. Otherwise it's U7 style :(

[nul800sebastiaan]

Unfortunately many other priorities came up so this has been on the backburner for a while (we don't have a timeline for when we'll get back to it).

Otherwise it's U7 :(

I am not sure how v7 would be different, it is still entirely possible to build a site exactly like in v7 with separate content roots for each language.

[FransdeJong]

I think he means, otherwise you'll have to use V8 like V7 and loose the language benefits.

Hopefully this issue will get on the planning soon. It's hard to tell customers that we use a CMS that is multilingual in core but we can't manage who can edit the different languages.

Another option could be to make it a community driven update by starting a Request For Comments? That way the community can be guided to create this update?

[icavalheiro]

Any news on this feature? This gonna be a game changer for my company, allowing us to migrate some projects from Drupal to Umbraco.

[JeffreyPerplex]

This sounds like an excellent idea!

[marcemarc]

Hi, I'm building a large multi-language content repository for V8 and using language variants, and although we were aware of the limitation and discussed separate trees being the workaround... it was opted to 'go with variants' for the side by side editing experience. Anyway just flagging that the first round of feedback has been they would really like to restrict editors to only be able to edit and publish their own language variants.

Anyway, I'm not sure on the current status of this issue - whether this has just gone stale, covid etc, or whether there is still the process in play to wait for feedback from people starting to use the variants feature, in order to get some more feedback on it, before progressing something big like this for the permissions structure and UI - but if more feedback is wanted, then, I'm just confirming this would still be super useful today in 2021, and does feel like something people would expect to be able to do with variants and V8 and multilingual sites with lots of different editors (not saying it would be easy to do!).

[FransdeJong]

I'm afraid that it will have to wait untill .net Core and new front-end release.

I've asked via multiple chanels how we can help but there seems to be no interest from HQ regarding this issue before at least .net Core

[gurumurthyjv]

I am also looking eagerly at this feature to be available in v8.11 at least, as this is very much important when we have different content editors across the globe. Lets hope sooner to add this..

[shearer3000]

hi marcemarc - from my experience so far with variants, it is currently under-baked and missing important business features such as editorial access by language. There doesn't appear to be any desire to finish making Variants MVP (minimum viable product) any time soon

You might be best to avoid Variants and use a "conventional" content tree as per umbraco 7 even though the big ticket item in umbraco 8 was meant to be Variants.

[filipbech]

Hi there I totally agree, we need this feature and we want it. It is a matter of when and how, not "if"... It is important that we dont do too many things at once, so we can deliver good quality on time. This means that the current focus is on the .NET core migration. This (along with a few other) is on my list of things to do after unicore (ETA august)... its not really a list yet - when it is we'll put in on the roadmap! I agree the next step is a proper RFC for this feature.

[marcemarc]

@shearer3000 @FransdeJong @gurumurthyjv @filipbech ok I've got 'something working' with Umbraco's existing extension points, and I've put a blog post together to explain how, and the fun I had along the way: http://tooorangey.co.uk/posts/umbraco-v8-variants-and-limiting-editor-access-by-language-an-adventure-story/

[shearer3000]

I feel like the community disappointment here is that this really should've been consider MVP (minimum viable product) for the original Variants RFC/spec, not an enhancement/after-thought.

[nul800sebastiaan]

Sure thing @shearer3000 - and it is for that reason we've started creating RFCs before we implement large new features like these so that we can consider all perspectives before implementation.

[OlePc]

Any update on this? Have anything changed since april? Is it still in the plans to start a RFC, now that the .net core migration is done. I bet it's too late to get it into Umbraco 8, right?

[umbrabot]

Hi there @kjac,

Just wanted to let you know that we noticed that this issue got a bit stale and we haven't been able to get to this idea. We will close this idea for now, as we haven't been able to prioritize it yet.

Once we get time to work on ideas that are in this category we'll review and update existing issues like this one to let you know we're working on it.

Thanks, from your friendly Umbraco GitHub bot :robot: :slightly_smiling_face:

[f4c30ff]

Eventhough the issue is closed. I would like to add my name to the list of users that could really use this!

I have a site that has ~15 languages and more are coming. I'd love to give editors the correct access to the correct language only.

[TheBekker]

Is this dead in the water?

[arknu]

@TheBekker No, it is actually on the roadmap slated for Q4: https://umbraco.com/products/roadmap/