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Issue tracking for UMMZ Bird data in the VertNet portal (portal.vertnet.org).
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[UMMZ Birds 144583] Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus - Subspecies identity #38

Open paintedstork opened 8 years ago

paintedstork commented 8 years ago

Hi there, I would like to know if we are double sure as to the identity of the subspecies of this specimen. There is another specimen from the same general locality in ROM with subspecies chlorigaster. It is unlikely that both races co-exist - one of them have to be incorrect. I am raising data quality issues on both records to be checked. http://portal.vertnet.org/o/rom/birds?id=45140 thanks & best rgds Praveen

.....................................................

You can view the original detail page on VertNet. Here are the original record contents:

Term Value
Modified 2012-12-07 11:41:03.0
Language en
AccessRights http://vertnet.org/resources/norms.html
References http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583
InstitutionID http://grbio.org/cool/ra64-3eva
CollectionID urn:lsid:biocol.org:col:34962
InstitutionCode UMMZ
CollectionCode Birds
BasisOfRecord PreservedSpecimen
OccurrenceID urn:catalog:UMMZ:Birds:144583
CatalogNumber 144583
RecordedBy Koelz, Walter N
Sex male
EstablishmentMeans native
OccurrenceStatus present
Preparations Skin, Y
EventDate 1946-08-15
StartDayOfYear 227
EndDayOfYear 227
Year 1946
Month 8
Day 15
HigherGeography Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] | | | |
Continent Asia
Country India
CountryCode IN
StateProvince [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces
County [Mandla District]
Locality Kanha
VerbatimLocality Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District]
VerbatimElevation 600
LocationRemarks Locality originally spelled Kanka or Kanda. Now in Madhya Pradesh State and Mandla district.
DecimalLatitude 22.2833338
DecimalLongitude 80.6166649
GeodeticDatum not recorded (forced WGS84)
CoordinateUncertaintyInMeters 7500
GeoreferencedBy Kadambi, Hemanth
GeoreferencedDate 2010-03-08
GeoreferenceProtocol VertNet Georeferencing Guidelines
GeoreferenceSources BioGeomancer
GeoreferenceVerificationStatus requires verification
GeoreferenceRemarks Elevation Source: Google Earth
ScientificName Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus
HigherClassification | | | Piciformes | Picidae | Picus
Kingdom Animalia
Phylum Chordata
Class Aves
Order Piciformes
Family Picidae
Genus Picus
SpecificEpithet chlorolophus
InfraspecificEpithet chlorolophus
TaxonRank subspecies
NomenclaturalCode ICZN
jhinshaw commented 8 years ago

Dear Praveen,

This should be regarding Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus, not painted stork.

The UMMZ specimen is from Kanha, United Provinces. The ROM specimen does not have any specific locality other than India. Thus theirs could be chlorigaster. Their locality coordinates are for the center of India, and the uncertainty includes all of India.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:48 AM, paintedstork notifications@github.com wrote:

Hi there, I would like to know if we are double sure as to the identity of the subspecies of this specimen. There is another specimen from the same general locality in ROM with subspecies chlorigaster. It is unlikely that both races co-exist - one of them have to be incorrect. I am raising data quality issues on both records to be checked. http://portal.vertnet.org/o/rom/birds?id=45140 thanks & best rgds Praveen

.....................................................

You can view the original detail page http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 on VertNet. Here are the original record contents: Term Value Modified 2012-12-07 11:41:03.0 Language en AccessRights http://vertnet.org/resources/norms.html References http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 InstitutionID http://grbio.org/cool/ra64-3eva CollectionID urn:lsid:biocol.org:col:34962 InstitutionCode UMMZ CollectionCode Birds BasisOfRecord PreservedSpecimen OccurrenceID urn:catalog:UMMZ:Birds:144583 CatalogNumber 144583 RecordedBy Koelz, Walter N Sex male EstablishmentMeans native OccurrenceStatus present Preparations Skin, Y EventDate 1946-08-15 StartDayOfYear 227 EndDayOfYear 227 Year 1946 Month 8 Day 15 HigherGeography Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] | | | | Continent Asia Country India CountryCode IN StateProvince [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces County [Mandla District] Locality Kanha VerbatimLocality Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] VerbatimElevation 600 LocationRemarks Locality originally spelled Kanka or Kanda. Now in Madhya Pradesh State and Mandla district. DecimalLatitude 22.2833338 DecimalLongitude 80.6166649 GeodeticDatum not recorded (forced WGS84) CoordinateUncertaintyInMeters 7500 GeoreferencedBy Kadambi, Hemanth GeoreferencedDate 2010-03-08 GeoreferenceProtocol VertNet Georeferencing Guidelines GeoreferenceSources BioGeomancer GeoreferenceVerificationStatus requires verification GeoreferenceRemarks Elevation Source: Google Earth ScientificName Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus HigherClassification | | | Piciformes | Picidae | Picus Kingdom Animalia Phylum Chordata Class Aves Order Piciformes Family Picidae Genus Picus SpecificEpithet chlorolophus InfraspecificEpithet chlorolophus TaxonRank subspecies NomenclaturalCode ICZN

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paintedstork commented 8 years ago

Thank you very much for this valuable piece of information, I missed reading that the ROM specimen was not properly geo-referenced, which settles my issue. Praveen On 21-May-2016 7:01 am, "Janet Hinshaw" notifications@github.com wrote:

Dear Praveen,

This should be regarding Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus, not painted stork.

The UMMZ specimen is from Kanha, United Provinces. The ROM specimen does not have any specific locality other than India. Thus theirs could be chlorigaster. Their locality coordinates are for the center of India, and the uncertainty includes all of India.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:48 AM, paintedstork notifications@github.com wrote:

Hi there, I would like to know if we are double sure as to the identity of the subspecies of this specimen. There is another specimen from the same general locality in ROM with subspecies chlorigaster. It is unlikely that both races co-exist - one of them have to be incorrect. I am raising data quality issues on both records to be checked. http://portal.vertnet.org/o/rom/birds?id=45140 thanks & best rgds Praveen

.....................................................

You can view the original detail page http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 on VertNet. Here are the original record contents: Term Value Modified 2012-12-07 11:41:03.0 Language en AccessRights http://vertnet.org/resources/norms.html References http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 InstitutionID http://grbio.org/cool/ra64-3eva CollectionID urn:lsid:biocol.org:col:34962 InstitutionCode UMMZ CollectionCode Birds BasisOfRecord PreservedSpecimen OccurrenceID urn:catalog:UMMZ:Birds:144583 CatalogNumber 144583 RecordedBy Koelz, Walter N Sex male EstablishmentMeans native OccurrenceStatus present Preparations Skin, Y EventDate 1946-08-15 StartDayOfYear 227 EndDayOfYear 227 Year 1946 Month 8 Day 15 HigherGeography Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] | | | | Continent Asia Country India CountryCode IN StateProvince [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces County [Mandla District] Locality Kanha VerbatimLocality Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] VerbatimElevation 600 LocationRemarks Locality originally spelled Kanka or Kanda. Now in Madhya Pradesh State and Mandla district. DecimalLatitude 22.2833338 DecimalLongitude 80.6166649 GeodeticDatum not recorded (forced WGS84) CoordinateUncertaintyInMeters 7500 GeoreferencedBy Kadambi, Hemanth GeoreferencedDate 2010-03-08 GeoreferenceProtocol VertNet Georeferencing Guidelines GeoreferenceSources BioGeomancer GeoreferenceVerificationStatus requires verification GeoreferenceRemarks Elevation Source: Google Earth ScientificName Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus HigherClassification | | | Piciformes | Picidae | Picus Kingdom Animalia Phylum Chordata Class Aves Order Piciformes Family Picidae Genus Picus SpecificEpithet chlorolophus InfraspecificEpithet chlorolophus TaxonRank subspecies NomenclaturalCode ICZN

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jhinshaw commented 8 years ago

You are welcome. Let me know if you have any other questions about our Indian specimens, or if you can help with any of our ungeoreferenced localities. There were some Indian localities we were not able to locate.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Sun, May 22, 2016 at 9:57 PM, paintedstork notifications@github.com wrote:

Thank you very much for this valuable piece of information, I missed reading that the ROM specimen was not properly geo-referenced, which settles my issue. Praveen On 21-May-2016 7:01 am, "Janet Hinshaw" notifications@github.com wrote:

Dear Praveen,

This should be regarding Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus, not painted stork.

The UMMZ specimen is from Kanha, United Provinces. The ROM specimen does not have any specific locality other than India. Thus theirs could be chlorigaster. Their locality coordinates are for the center of India, and the uncertainty includes all of India.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:48 AM, paintedstork notifications@github.com wrote:

Hi there, I would like to know if we are double sure as to the identity of the subspecies of this specimen. There is another specimen from the same general locality in ROM with subspecies chlorigaster. It is unlikely that both races co-exist - one of them have to be incorrect. I am raising data quality issues on both records to be checked. http://portal.vertnet.org/o/rom/birds?id=45140 thanks & best rgds Praveen

.....................................................

You can view the original detail page http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 on VertNet. Here are

the original record contents: Term Value Modified 2012-12-07 11:41:03.0 Language en AccessRights http://vertnet.org/resources/norms.html References http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 InstitutionID http://grbio.org/cool/ra64-3eva CollectionID urn:lsid:biocol.org:col:34962 InstitutionCode UMMZ CollectionCode Birds BasisOfRecord PreservedSpecimen OccurrenceID urn:catalog:UMMZ:Birds:144583 CatalogNumber 144583 RecordedBy Koelz, Walter N Sex male EstablishmentMeans native OccurrenceStatus present Preparations Skin, Y EventDate 1946-08-15 StartDayOfYear 227 EndDayOfYear 227 Year 1946 Month 8 Day 15 HigherGeography Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] | | | | Continent Asia Country India CountryCode IN StateProvince [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces County [Mandla District] Locality Kanha VerbatimLocality Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] VerbatimElevation 600 LocationRemarks Locality originally spelled Kanka or Kanda. Now in Madhya Pradesh State and Mandla district. DecimalLatitude 22.2833338 DecimalLongitude 80.6166649 GeodeticDatum not recorded (forced WGS84) CoordinateUncertaintyInMeters 7500 GeoreferencedBy Kadambi, Hemanth GeoreferencedDate 2010-03-08 GeoreferenceProtocol VertNet Georeferencing Guidelines GeoreferenceSources BioGeomancer GeoreferenceVerificationStatus requires verification GeoreferenceRemarks Elevation Source: Google Earth ScientificName Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus HigherClassification | | | Piciformes | Picidae | Picus Kingdom Animalia Phylum Chordata Class Aves Order Piciformes Family Picidae Genus Picus SpecificEpithet chlorolophus InfraspecificEpithet chlorolophus TaxonRank subspecies NomenclaturalCode ICZN

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paintedstork commented 8 years ago

I can ofcourse help with Indian localities - perhaps, it is better to close this thread and start a new one?

thanks & best rgds Praveen

On Mon, May 23, 2016 at 9:08 AM, Janet Hinshaw notifications@github.com wrote:

You are welcome. Let me know if you have any other questions about our Indian specimens, or if you can help with any of our ungeoreferenced localities. There were some Indian localities we were not able to locate.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Sun, May 22, 2016 at 9:57 PM, paintedstork notifications@github.com wrote:

Thank you very much for this valuable piece of information, I missed reading that the ROM specimen was not properly geo-referenced, which settles my issue. Praveen On 21-May-2016 7:01 am, "Janet Hinshaw" notifications@github.com wrote:

Dear Praveen,

This should be regarding Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus, not painted stork.

The UMMZ specimen is from Kanha, United Provinces. The ROM specimen does not have any specific locality other than India. Thus theirs could be chlorigaster. Their locality coordinates are for the center of India, and the uncertainty includes all of India.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Janet Hinshaw ph: 734-764-0457 Bird Division Collection Manager fax: 734-763-4080 Museum of Zoology, University of Michigan 1109 Geddes Ave. Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 USA

http://www.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/birds/

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:48 AM, paintedstork < notifications@github.com> wrote:

Hi there, I would like to know if we are double sure as to the identity of the subspecies of this specimen. There is another specimen from the same general locality in ROM with subspecies chlorigaster. It is unlikely that both races co-exist - one of them have to be incorrect. I am raising data quality issues on both records to be checked. http://portal.vertnet.org/o/rom/birds?id=45140 thanks & best rgds Praveen

.....................................................

You can view the original detail page http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 on VertNet. Here are

the original record contents: Term Value Modified 2012-12-07 11:41:03.0 Language en AccessRights http://vertnet.org/resources/norms.html References http://portal.vertnet.org/o/ummz/birds?id=144583 InstitutionID http://grbio.org/cool/ra64-3eva CollectionID urn:lsid:biocol.org:col:34962 InstitutionCode UMMZ CollectionCode Birds BasisOfRecord PreservedSpecimen OccurrenceID urn:catalog:UMMZ:Birds:144583 CatalogNumber 144583 RecordedBy Koelz, Walter N Sex male EstablishmentMeans native OccurrenceStatus present Preparations Skin, Y EventDate 1946-08-15 StartDayOfYear 227 EndDayOfYear 227 Year 1946 Month 8 Day 15 HigherGeography Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] | | | | Continent Asia Country India CountryCode IN StateProvince [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces County [Mandla District] Locality Kanha VerbatimLocality Asia | India | [Madhya Pradesh]Central Provinces | [Mandla District] VerbatimElevation 600 LocationRemarks Locality originally spelled Kanka or Kanda. Now in Madhya Pradesh State and Mandla district. DecimalLatitude 22.2833338 DecimalLongitude 80.6166649 GeodeticDatum not recorded (forced WGS84) CoordinateUncertaintyInMeters 7500 GeoreferencedBy Kadambi, Hemanth GeoreferencedDate 2010-03-08 GeoreferenceProtocol VertNet Georeferencing Guidelines GeoreferenceSources BioGeomancer GeoreferenceVerificationStatus requires verification GeoreferenceRemarks Elevation Source: Google Earth ScientificName Picus chlorolophus chlorolophus HigherClassification | | | Piciformes | Picidae | Picus Kingdom Animalia Phylum Chordata Class Aves Order Piciformes Family Picidae Genus Picus SpecificEpithet chlorolophus InfraspecificEpithet chlorolophus TaxonRank subspecies NomenclaturalCode ICZN

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dbloom commented 8 years ago

So great to see this conversation! I am going to alert Brad Millen from ROM - and georeferencer extraordinaire. He may be able to shed light on the ROM record, but would certainly benefit from knowing more.

bradmROM commented 8 years ago

Monday 23 May, 2016

Hi:

I am going to check this specimen out ina our collection and original record entries tomorrow.

Brad Millen ROM

bradmROM commented 8 years ago

This ROM specimen is definitely from no specific location in India. the subspecies was assigned using Peter's Check-List of Birds of the World, Volume VI, Page 140., published in 1948. The locality range is based upon the text in the publication which is noted as "Indian Peninsula".

So georef'd as India with a large Coordinate Uncertainty in Meters.

paintedstork commented 8 years ago

Thank you very much Sir - the reason for the renewed interest in this specimen is due to the fact that we now know that chlorigaster subspecies also occurs in central India towards the western side - still far (~400km) from where the current specimens of nominate were reported (UMMZ), but we do not know whether their ranges meet or whether they breed sympatrically. No intermediates have been reported till date.

thanks & best rgds Praveen

On Tue, May 24, 2016 at 7:15 PM, B Millen notifications@github.com wrote:

This ROM specimen is definitely from no specific location in India. the subspecies was assigned using Peter's Check-List of Birds of the World, Volume VI, Page 140., published in 1948. The locality range is based upon the text in the publication which is noted as "Indian Peninsula".

So georef'd as India with a large Coordinate Uncertainty in Meters.

— You are receiving this because you authored the thread. Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub https://github.com/ummz-vertnet/ummz-birds/issues/38#issuecomment-221273921

bradmROM commented 8 years ago

You are quite welcome. Always happy to oblige.